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Lucas' Weekly Matchup Discussion Review - Diddy

Irsic

Irsic

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lil cj said:
Where are the other DK mains? lol


PK Freeze works well in this match
its a better option than PKT edge guarding
Edge guarding DK will make this match a whole lot easier
On stage DK will **** Lucas
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There is practically no reason to not dair edge-guard DK. PKT is a terrible idea against DK, especially since his upb just destroys the head, and he can be a little difficult to tailwhip.
 
~Pink Fresh~

~Pink Fresh~

Smash Master
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4,180
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Maryland
_clinton said:
I like how that Lucas never threw out his 2 frame jab at all in that match...
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Quite redundant there.

This discussion isn't going anywhere. This [discussion lacking... well discussion] happened last time. I, for one, just think we should change the number to 65-35 and move on, since this is basically asking us, "is DK harder than marth?" Then again, I'm not helping the [lack of] discussion get any better.
 
c3gill

c3gill

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951
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VA
Irsic said:
Though FH is generally better, especially when the DK players attempt to approach with bair.
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I HATE DKs bair. also, I prefer to edgeguard with Dair as well, I dont really like PK freeze edgeguarding.

and... DK just ***** Lucas. Its without a doubt one of his hardest match-ups, I dont care if its 75-25 or 65-35, I will not be playing Lucas against a good DK player in a tournament. maybe in friendlies or for ****s n giggles, but any decent DK should rip lucas' butthole apart.
 
Irsic

Irsic

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ChaosTheoryX said:
Dear God man he's just a kid
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LOL

But seriously, DK is a hard match up but it is not that this difficult. 65-35 AT THE MOST. DK has some decent set ups on Lucas, but Lucas has some pretty simple set ups on DK as well, as he is easy to nair and dair, just like Bowser. DK is a lot easier gimped than Bowser. Our dair spikes right through your up-B, and can be really hurting to DK's recovery forcing him to recover else wise, leaving him open for attack.
 
I

itsthebigfoot

Smash Lord
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Irsic said:
LOL
DK is a lot easier gimped than Bowser. Our dair spikes right through your up-B, and can be really hurting to DK's recovery forcing him to recover else wise, leaving him open for attack.
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are you serious?, dk's air movement and invincible startup on the upb make gimping quite hard, especially if you don't have a nasty spike. you dair does spike, but it's not going to be set up unless the dk screws something up. I think kirby and ness are the only two that can consistently threat with spikes, and kirby is the only one that is actually good at gimping him
 
Ripple

Ripple

ᗣᗣᗣᗣ ᗧ·····•·····
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I like how almost every character that has a spike is like " DK is really easy to edgeguard because his recovery sucks" (paraphrased of course)

but still, DK's insane weight and aerial control stops him from being thrown somewhat far off stage until like 90% (from the middle and from a f smash)
 
Irsic

Irsic

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itsthebigfoot said:
are you serious?, dk's air movement and invincible startup on the upb make gimping quite hard, especially if you don't have a nasty spike. you dair does spike, but it's not going to be set up unless the dk screws something up. I think kirby and ness are the only two that can consistently threat with spikes, and kirby is the only one that is actually good at gimping him
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6huTzeyIJQ&feature=channel_page

I make him look like a pretty bad DK, but he wasn't too bad. I just discovered the gimp during this fight and then took advantage of it.
 
Levitas

Levitas

the moon
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That DK is pretty bad, but the spike was legit.

MaJiK, we're not talking about marth, and we know more about it than you. Like how it's not an infinite, and stuff.

Edit: that sounded harsher than I meant...
 
MeLL0W

MeLL0W

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Jan 23, 2009
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Irsic's vid really shows that you can gimp DK with a dair at a low percent even if it's hard to do its still something for a DK to watch out for. The DK in the vid wasn't one of the best but it's a good example none the less.
 
Chuee

Chuee

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Well the best we can do is try and make him land on the stage so we can fsmash him. DK's Recovery hardly ever has no landing lag.
 
JigglyZelda003

JigglyZelda003

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Chu245 said:
Well the best we can do is try and make him land on the stage so we can fsmash him. DK's Recovery hardly ever has no landing lag.
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is that possible? it seems like he'd spin long enough that invincibility frames would wear off if we held the edge hoping he'd land on the stage.
 
Irsic

Irsic

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JigglyZelda003 said:
is that possible? it seems like he'd spin long enough that invincibility frames would wear off if we held the edge hoping he'd land on the stage.
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I'm pretty confused as to what you were replying to but I'll give it a shot - The super armor frames from DK's upb are at the beginning to middle of the attack - also, when timed right off stage he can land on stage creating an autocancel effect and can just go right into anything. It's something to watch out for.
 
Chuee

Chuee

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Its possible you just have to get him to go onstage with his spin.
@Irsic: Yes but its hard to do.
 
I

itsthebigfoot

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Levitas said:
...And now I have a CP for DK. Thanks bigfoot :)
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np, good thing both ness and kirby are at disadvantages too (kirby's is only slight though).

If you want to cp us, try luigi, zamus, wario or ddd

Irsic said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6huTzeyIJQ&feature=channel_page

I make him look like a pretty bad DK, but he wasn't too bad. I just discovered the gimp during this fight and then took advantage of it.
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he was bad, not just because he fell for the spikes, but he showed all the subtle signs of a bad dk

Chu245 said:
Well the best we can do is try and make him land on the stage so we can fsmash him. DK's Recovery hardly ever has no landing lag.
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dk's recovery will either catch the ledge or land lagless, unless we intentionally whiff the landing (usually to hit you or for the momentum brake) but usually we do that in a good enough situation not to get punished. planning on whiffed dk recoveries won't help much.
 
_clinton

_clinton

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itsthebigfoot said:
np, good thing both ness and kirby are at disadvantages too (kirby's is only slight though).

If you want to cp us, try luigi, zamus, wario or ddd
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Great...another person who doesn't respect the thunder...

Public Service Announcement: 100% of Brawlers that don’t respect the Thundah! are liable to be struck by it. The moment in which you are stunned, convulsing in mid-air, just before you are sent off to your stock’s final resting place, it is a time for you to reflect upon your mistake. Respect the thunder.

May I ask why you think DK is at the + with Ness?
 
Chuee

Chuee

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itsthebigfoot said:
dk's recovery will either catch the ledge or land lagless, unless we intentionally whiff the landing (usually to hit you or for the momentum brake) but usually we do that in a good enough situation not to get punished. planning on whiffed dk recoveries won't help much.
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What im saying is that DK's recovery only has 0 landing lag when he is directly on the ground. It doesnt cancel slightly above the ground like most charaters therefore making it punishable if we can get him to do that.
 
Levitas

Levitas

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If he's gonna land directly on the ground, use a telegraphed retreating fair to hit him back away. Dsmash works too, I guess, but slow startup is bad for reactionary strategies.
 
Yoshi-Kirby

Yoshi-Kirby

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I'd say that it's a little more in Lucas's favor, like 60-40 (numbers mean nothing imo). I just fought a DK offline, supposed to be one of the best in my state. Wasn't as hard as the matchup suggests it is. I just Naired and PK Fired more than natural, and edgeguarding wasn't that hard with PK Thundah and Dair.
 
_clinton

_clinton

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If I can give my thoughts...I really do think Lucas does better in this than what everyone is saying...oh well...
 
Yoshi-Kirby

Yoshi-Kirby

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Ness...seems like it would be in Lucas's favor, not a 60-40 Ness's favor (numbers still don't matter). Both of them cancel out each other's projectile game. I would think that it's a 55-45 (numbers still don't matter) Lucas's advantage cuz he can gimp Ness really, really easily (lol absorb his Thunder), and can outrange and overcome Ness on the ground. However, a smart Ness knows to stay in the air and overcome Lucas. I just think that it comes down to where the match is taking place.
 
_clinton

_clinton

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I hope I'm not the only one who sees it 5:5 or maybe a bit in Lucas' favor...

Yoshi-Kirby said:
Ness...seems like it would be in Lucas's favor, not a 60-40 Ness's favor (numbers still don't matter). Both of them cancel out each other's projectile game. I would think that it's a 55-45 (numbers still don't matter) Lucas's advantage cuz he can gimp Ness really, really easily (lol absorb his Thunder), and can outrange and overcome Ness on the ground. However, a smart Ness knows to stay in the air and overcome Lucas. I just think that it comes down to where the match is taking place.
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Cool...I'm not...

I'm thinking Lucas has issues getting out of PK Fire sometimes if that means anything...but chances are that is just me
 
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