Cut Veterans: Who do you think WON'T make it?

[Xigger]

There's as much character speculation as ever as to who will get in, but what about discussing the opposite? Who do you think won't make it and why?

For starters, clone characters may have low priority because the roster is reaching its limits according to Sakurai. Jigglypuff may be cut due to lack of relevance (not recency) and popularity. Perhaps Pokemon Trainer could be removed or separated due to technical limitations on the 3DS? Or some characters may not be considered at all, such as Snake or Lucario, due to their respective reasons why they were in Brawl.


EDIT: This thread is about who may not make it in, not why someone shouldn't be in.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Toon Link, Ike, Lucario, Snake, Lucas

In that order of being cut, from most likely to least likely.

I wouldn't say Jigglypuff isn't relevant. It's become part Fairy type in the 6th gen....so it has that going for it. Then again you could say the same for a pokemon like Gardevoir, who's a pretty popular suggestion. I think the problem is that any reason you could throw at Jigglypuff being removed you could have thrown at her during the run up to Brawl and she still made it in.

 

[Swift Fox]

You've read number 6 from this, didn't you?

 

[Xigger]

Toon Link, Ike, Lucario, Snake, Lucas

In that order of being cut, from most likely to least likely.

I wouldn't say Jigglypuff isn't relevant. It's become part Fairy type in the 6th gen....so it has that going for it. Then again you could say the same for a pokemon like Gardevoir, who's a pretty popular suggestion. I think the problem is that any reason you could throw at Jigglypuff being removed you could have thrown at her during the run up to Brawl and she still made it in.

That does hold very true for Jigglypuff, you could even say he could be the new generation rep with new fairy moves and whatnot.

Isn't Toon Link considered one of the "debunked" characters thanks to that 3DS stage?

You've read number 6 from this, didn't you?

Yes I have. This isn't meant to provoke or spark flame wars as much as discussing reasons concerning why veterans would or would not return.

 

[BluePikmin11]

If Earthbound reps can be allowed to two for the best representation, then Lucas should not be cut at all.
If Starfox reps can be allowed to 3 for the best representarion, then Wolf should not be cut.

 

[Swift Fox]

Ok that's great, I hope this thread is going well! This isn't character-specific anti-support tread so it should be fine.

Isn't Toon Link considered one of the "debunked" characters thanks to that 3DS stage?

I've mentioned in other topics about that situation. I believe that TL can stay even when him as Spirit Track engineer appears on the stage. My proof? TL exists alongside Adult Link, so all three links can exist.

 

[OcarinaOfDoom]

TL, Ike, Lucario, Snake,

 

[Curious Villager]

I've mentioned in other topics about that situation. I believe that TL can stay even when him as Spirit Track engineer appears on the stage. My proof? TL exists alongside Adult Link, so all three links can exist.

Or.... Wind Waker Link and Spirit Tracks Link aren't the same people. Short and Sweet.

Also, how about we just let Sakurai handle the cutting axe? It's a pretty sharp and dangerous thing after all. Last time we saw Villager handling it and you know how that turned out....

Spoiler

 

[Xigger]

Seems like Lucario and Snake are generally accepted as in-the-moment fighters.

But what about Pokemon Trainer or Olimar or Ice Climbers? Aside from whether or not they should be included, there has been admitted problems with multiple character fighters. If Ice Climbers is proving hard enough, might that same problem persist to Olimar/Pikmin and Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard/Trainer?

I've mentioned in other topics about that situation. I believe that TL can stay even when him as Spirit Track engineer appears on the stage. My proof? TL exists alongside Adult Link, so all three links can exist.

Good point. They are technically NOT the same character.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Toon Link and Lucario are the ones I see that are at the bottom of the priority list, and I'm pretty much expecting them to be cut.

If we're unlucky then Lucas and Ike would be next after that, as much as I hate it.

Lucas is a little bit cloney, and the Mother franchise has ended and sees no foreseeable future except for Earthbound's VC release, a game in which he isn't present in. Plus, he's a Japanese-only character. Only saving grace for him is that it'd be sad for Mother to only have one rep.

Ike fully depends on whether there'll be a new Fire Emblem rep or not, which is pretty expected with Arena Ferox as a stage on the 3DS version, but even then it's not a certain cut, 3 FE reps isn't too far fetched with Star Fox having 3, and Ike certainly is unique.

I don't expect more than that to be cut, but if anything, it'd be ICs (3DS problems,) R.O.B (Just not as important or popular as others) and Wolf (A bit cloney and not too hard of a cut.)

I don't see Snake's chances of being cut to be very high, they'll need to be in early to get permission to use him, so if he isn't planned on getting cut now, which he isn't since Sakurai has said nobody is cut yet, then I don't believe he'll get cut. Same for Sonic.

I'm not seeing PT being cut either. He works differently than ICs in that only one Pokémon is out at a time, so I don't see it as too much of a problem on the 3DS. Plus, he has Charizard, for that fact alone he should be prioritized over even Mewtwo. Combine that with Ivysaur and Squirtle and he's probably one of the more prioritized characters.

 

[Swift Fox]

I am bit concerned for P.T. since he is himself with three pokemons, four characters in total. I think he's the most likely to get cut than every other characters... How likely will that happen? There are some factors to consider:
-3DS technical hardware limitation (not sure if this applies to transformation but this is true for partners like I.C. and Trainer + Pokemon will be considered partners)
-Four characters = 4 times likely
-Too many 1st gen pokemons (to alongside with Pika and Purin though, this is may be little bit too personal)

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Personally even though I have a fondness for Earthbound. I'm not convinced a franchise that has no future is deserving of two reps.

Not even that but two reps that have similar fighting styles.

It just seems a bit excessive and unfair to other franchises that are still without even one rep.

 

[Hong]

Up until now.

 

[Xigger]

I am bit concerned for P.T. since he is himself with three pokemons, four characters in total. I think he's the most likely to get cut than every other characters... How likely will that happen? There are some factors to consider:
-3DS technical hardware limitation (not sure if this applies to transformation but this is true for partners like I.C.)
-Four characters = 4 times likely
-Too many 1st gen pokemons (though, this is may be little bit too personal)

I find Pokemon Trainer one of the more fascinating to talk about simply because it depends more on the technical factors.

The Ice Climbers problem sounds like it could be exclusive to having two actual fighters at once, so it's hard to say. Olimar's Pikmin behave more like items than fighters, and the actual pokemon trainer is more of a stage prop, so they might be safe.
But it could also refer to the memory limits: every character that switches loaded mid-battle, but if memory serves I think Pokemon Trainer loaded all 3 pokemon (and trainer with his own fighter file) so he's pushing it more than any other.


For characters like Ike and Lucas and Wolf, they are welcomed characters but they're also (semi-)clones which could have less priority over newcomers or unique veterans. A new Smash game with new fighters but the same size roster is going to cut more than ever before. You could even say the 3 newcomers already indicate 3 veterans were cut.

 

[IsmaR]

I am bit concerned for P.T. since he is himself with three pokemons, four characters in total. I think he's the most likely to get cut than every other characters... How likely will that happen? There are some factors to consider:
-3DS technical hardware limitation (not sure if this applies to transformation but this is true for partners like I.C.)
-Four characters = 4 times likely
-Too many 1st gen pokemons (though, this is may be little bit too personal)

...Are you serious on the 4 character thing?

[collapse=If so]

[/collapse]

The Trainer himself is not considered a (playable) character. Otherwise what's to stop people from considering Navi from Link's taunt, Lucas' rope snake, F.L.U.D.D., Toad from Peach's Neutral B, and all of Olimar's Pikmin individual characters? The rest of your points are debatable, but this...
Just lol.

 

[FalKoopa]

This thread will be locked in 3... 2... 1....

 

[Swift Fox]

Laugh all you want, just because you disagreed with me.

1. P.T. is technically playable, as you can choose him in the roster, but you don't (really) control him, but his pokemons.
2. P.T. requires all Brawl stages to have animations available on the background just for him.
3. he IS the character (VS "playable", "controllable", etc)

Now, please laugh more!

EDIT: It was nice of you obsessing over my little misspell! Yay rooster! Yeah, whatever. I'm glad the edit button is there for that.

 

[Curious Villager]

Laugh all you want, just because you disagreed with me.

1. P.T. is technically playable, as you can choose him in the rooster, but you don't control him, but his pokemons.
2. P.T. requires all Brawl stages to have animations available on the background just for him.
3. he IS the character (VS "playable", "controllable", etc)

Now, please laugh more!

I laughed when you said that underlined part... Is that okay?

 

[Xigger]

...Are you serious on the 4 character thing?

[collapse=If so]

[/collapse]

The Trainer himself is not considered a (playable) character. Otherwise what's to stop people from considering Navi from Link's taunt, Lucas' rope snake, F.L.U.D.D., Toad from Peach's Neutral B, and all of Olimar's Pikmin individual characters? The rest of your points are debatable, but this...Just lol.

No, it's not like that. It's about the game files: we know an absurd amount of information about how Brawl works, and Pokemon Trainer is one of the few non-fighters that actually uses a full Fighter file like every other playable character. Perhaps it doesn't have to work the same way in the new Smash, but as it is, Pokemon Trainer and Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard take up two fighter files at all times, exactly like Ice Climbers, but not Link, Lucas, Mario, Peach, or Olimar.

 

[FalKoopa]

1. P.T. is technically playable, as you can choose him in the rooster, but you don't control him, but his pokemons.

Great rooster.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

No, it's not like that. It's about the game files: we know an absurd amount of information about how Brawl works, and Pokemon Trainer is one of the few non-fighters that actually uses a full Fighter file like every other playable character. Perhaps it doesn't have to work the same way in the new Smash, but as it is, Pokemon Trainer and Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard take up two fighter files at all times, exactly like Ice Climbers, but not Link, Lucas, Mario, Peach, or Olimar.

The PT himself doesn't do anything on command though, other than walk. He doesn't have any kind of actions to do, he's just a model who's ranting in the background. With the Ice Climbers for all we know the problem could be with synchronization or getting both of them to do stuff on a single button click. The Pokémon Trainer's animations and actions are automatic depending on the Pokémon's location, you still only control 1 character.

I'm sure the problem isn't that it's a matter of lag or not having enough memory to contain many things on the stage at once, else the game would probably never have been developed for 3DS given how chaotic Smash Bros is by nature, I'm almost certain it has to do with the IC's actions. However, only almost, there's a chance we may never know the problem.

 

[Mr. Mumbles]

I feel like there should be two rules on this board that don't currently seem to exist

1. Do not under any circumstance compare SSB4 to Brawl or Melee. Also don't compare Brawl or Melee to each other.
2. Do not discuss who will get axed.

Maybe I'm wrong but I feel like these are the two most heated issues, and you just violated the second one.

The PT himself doesn't do anything on command though, other than walk. He doesn't have any kind of actions to do, he's just a model who's ranting in the background. With the Ice Climbers for all we know the problem could be with synchronization or getting both of them to do stuff on a single button click. The Pokémon Trainer's animations and actions are automatic depending on the Pokémon's location, you still only control 1 character.

I'm sure the problem isn't that it's a matter of lag or not having enough memory to contain many things on the stage at once, else the game would probably never have been developed for 3DS, I'm almost certain it has to do with the IC's actions. However, only almost, there's a chance we may never know the problem.

Just because you only control the Pokemon doesn't mean PT wasn't implemented stupidly. Maybe he really does respond to button input he just gives the null response. I hope Nintendo wouldn't have done something like this, but without looking at the code, you can't know. Stupid things in programming seem to happen all the time unfortunately.

 

[FalKoopa]

2. Do not discuss who will get axed.

This rule is there in the guidelines, actually. This thread will get locked sooner or later.

 

[Swift Fox]

I don't know if he broke the rule entirely... It'd be nice to see the complilation list of possible reasons of why one might (VS "should", "anti-support", by personal preferences, etc) gets cut.

 

[Xigger]

This rule is there in the guidelines, actually. This thread will get locked sooner or later.

I read that rule as anti-character hate and who you think SHOULDN'T be in. This is more about who would or wouldn't, not should or shouldn't. Whether or not Pokemon Trainer or Ice Climbers should, they might not because they can't. This thread seems more technical than opinionated.

Similar point: Snake wasn't in Melee due to time restraints. That's a fact based on evidence, not opinion.

 

[Ember Reaper]

I'm surprised Falco/Wolf haven't been brought up. I feel one of them would get cut after Toon Link.
They're movesets are all similar. They did an okay job of diversifying Falco and Wolf is good, but still not very unique from Fox sadly.

 

[Morbi]

I'm surprised Falco/Wolf haven't been brought up. I feel one of them would get cut after Toon Link.
They're movesets are all similar. They did an okay job of diversifying Falco and Wolf is good, but still not very unique from Fox sadly.

You people annoy me so much... have you ever played Wolf? EVER? EVER EVER EVER?

I will tell you their similarities... ahem... d special and final smash. If Wolf gets cut because they couldn't give him a different Final Smash I will flip. His d special doesn't even really count because all Fire Emblem characters have the same d special too. It is series specific. Not to mention they did change the design and color. His Blaster is NOT even close to the same. It has a blade at the end of it (which is functional) and the blaster projectile is slightly larger and much slower. So you can't say it is similar. The similarities end at they are both blasters. His recovery move is completely different too. People seem to be under the impression that it is Fox/Falco's but without the fire.

TL;DR- Pick up your controller and go play Fox and Wolf back to back. FALCO is WAY MORE of a CLONE than WOLF. So he is unique to Fox. I guess a shared series move is just too much. Nobody complains about FE characters though. Wolf was added last minute I believe... so they didn't have time to change his Final Smash.

Anyways. Sorry for flipping out. I just don't like people telling other people that they are similar. It perpetuates the problem. The share 2 moves that are visually different. The rest ARE different.

 

[Mr. Mumbles]

I don't know if he broke the rule entirely... It'd be nice to see the complilation list of possible reasons of why one might (VS "should", "anti-support", by personal preferences, etc) gets cut.

You can't just whisper the magical word "might" instead of "should" and expect a flame war not to develop. This is the internet; people don't understand subtle differences like that.

 

[Xigger]

You can't just whisper the magical word "might" instead of "should" and expect a flame war not to develop. This is the internet; people don't understand subtle differences like that.

If it gets out of hand, then it gets locked. So far, we've kept to technical considerations rather than why Star Fox doesn't deserve 3 reps. That would be going off-topic. Speaking of....


I've got to agree Wolf is more unique than Falco, he's more heavy and only his special attacks resemble Fox or Falco. That said, I don't have many ideas how Star Fox characters are even picked or considered. Pokemon follows popularity, Fire Emblem follows recency and a bit of popularity, Kirby and Mother may be personal bias from Sakurai... but with Star Fox I'm a bit clueless. I have no idea if Falco or Wolf have more priority over the other or not.

 

[Ember Reaper]

You people annoy me so much... have you ever played Wolf? EVER? EVER EVER EVER?

I will tell you their similarities... ahem... d special and final smash. If Wolf gets cut because they couldn't give him a different Final Smash I will flip. His d special doesn't even really count because all Fire Emblem characters have the same d special too. It is series specific. Not to mention they did change the design and color. His Blaster is NOT even close to the same. It has a blade at the end of it (which is functional) and the blaster projectile is slightly larger and much slower. So you can't say it is similar. The similarities end at they are both blasters. His recovery move is completely different too. People seem to be under the impression that it is Fox/Falco's but without the fire.

TL;DR- Pick up your controller and go play Fox and Wolf back to back. FALCO is WAY MORE of a CLONE than WOLF. So he is unique to Fox. I guess a shared series move is just too much. Nobody complains about FE characters though. Wolf was added last minute I believe... so they didn't have time to change his Final Smash.

Anyways. Sorry for flipping out. I just don't like people telling other people that they are similar. It perpetuates the problem. The share 2 moves that are visually different. The rest ARE different.

Yes I have actually. I'm a very avid player and know every move inside and out.
I'm sad to say it too, but they are indeed similar, more different than fox and falco, but still similar. And my word used was unique. Sakurai seems to be focusing on that word. That every character is entirely unique and brings sometihng different to the game. Like the 3 new movesets we saw and the 9 veterans. All 12 are very unique movesets unlike any of the others. Are fox, falco, and wolf unique? fox is cause he's first, but Falco and Wolf are not. Granted, Wolf's A attacks, spot on. They are different. However, and this may be nit picky, but if some random guy on the internet can see this, than Sakurai has most likely analyzed it to no end.
up tilt, both put their foot up. Side smash: both move forward using a powerful hit. Specials: don't need to say much here Bair: a strong back kick. (love how they did wolf's aerial attacks) Tis nit picky yes, but if it's to be entirely unique some things are gonna need to change. DO I want to Falco and Wolf go? Heck no!! They're both awesome characters who are fun to play, and their attitudes and who they are add much to already great mix of personalities. But if we're talking about possible cuts it ccan't be avoided that they are all pilots from the same game, who ultimately do the same thing in their own game. It would be like having Ninten in there in addition to Lucas and Ness. Like having Young, Toon, and Adult Link.

I understand your frustration. I am against cuts entirely and don't want to see anyone go (save for maybe Toon Link, but that's just bias because he's better than my current favorite character T^T).
Marth and Ike are not similar, they have a sword yes, but so do Link, Pit and MK. the only thing that is similar is the counter, which is dissapointing, but that is literally one move (which I hope changes to diversify it even more)

So in conclusion. yes Falco is more of a clone. No I don't want them to be cut. I was simply bringing them up and being very nit picky at similarities. I am very aware Wolf and Fox do not play the same, (I favor Wolf over Fox). But if it's cut character we're talking about, They shouldn't go ignored.

Very hoping Falco gets very rewored and WOlf gets partially reworked(Like Bowser!)

 

[Morbi]

Yes I have actually. I'm a very avid player and know every move inside and out.
I'm sad to say it too, but they are indeed similar, more different than fox and falco, but still similar. And my word used was unique. Sakurai seems to be focusing on that word. That every character is entirely unique and brings sometihng different to the game. Like the 3 new movesets we saw and the 9 veterans. All 12 are very unique movesets unlike any of the others. Are fox, falco, and wolf unique? fox is cause he's first, but Falco and Wolf are not. Granted, Wolf's A attacks, spot on. They are different. However, and this may be nit picky, but if some random guy on the internet can see this, than Sakurai has most likely analyzed it to no end.
up tilt, both put their foot up. Side smash: both move forward using a powerful hit. Specials: don't need to say much here Bair: a strong back kick. (love how they did wolf's aerial attacks) Tis nit picky yes, but if it's to be entirely unique some things are gonna need to change. DO I want to Falco and Wolf go? Heck no!! They're both awesome characters who are fun to play, and their attitudes and who they are add much to already great mix of personalities. But if we're talking about possible cuts it ccan't be avoided that they are all pilots from the same game, who ultimately do the same thing in their own game. It would be like having Ninten in there in addition to Lucas and Ness. Like having Young, Toon, and Adult Link.

I understand your frustration. I am against cuts entirely and don't want to see anyone go (save for maybe Toon Link, but that's just bias because he's better than my current favorite character T^T).
Marth and Ike are not similar, they have a sword yes, but so do Link, Pit and MK. the only thing that is similar is the counter, which is dissapointing, but that is literally one move (which I hope changes to diversify it even more)

So in conclusion. yes Falco is more of a clone. No I don't want them to be cut. I was simply bringing them up and being very nit picky at similarities. I am very aware Wolf and Fox do not play the same, (I favor Wolf over Fox). But if it's cut character we're talking about, They shouldn't go ignored.

Very hoping Falco gets very rewored and WOlf gets partially reworked(Like Bowser!)

Yes. I feel the exact same way. I am just wondering... do you prefer Toon Link over Link in Brawl? I see that you are also a Link main and I personally feel the exact same way. I actually spent way more time with Toon Link. I just put TP Link on my icon thing anyways because it is disgraceful...

...Are you serious on the 4 character thing?


The Trainer himself is not considered a (playable) character. Otherwise what's to stop people from considering Navi from Link's taunt, Lucas' rope snake, F.L.U.D.D., Toad from Peach's Neutral B, and all of Olimar's Pikmin individual characters? The rest of your points are debatable, but this...
Just lol.

For anyone why PKMN Trainer is MUCH harder to develop. He is actually like 4 characters.

I will explain this a little bit better than he did. PKMN Trainer is hypothetically speaking 3 characters. Sakurai had to fully balance each and every one of them. However, he is more realistically a total of 4 characters. Here is why. Sakurai has already stated that adding characters to the roster is actually like multiplying. This is obvious if you think about it. Adding Mewtwo to the roster would entail that he gets balanced with the rest of the roster. So say Mewtwo is the last character added. He needs to balance with everyone. Mario, Link, Fox, etc. So he needs to be balanced individually with all 40 (worst case scenario) characters. That is obviously like multiplying. He didn't just add Mewtwo. He balanced Mewtwo with everyone. During the beginning development cycle every character is being constantly re-balanced. Say he started with Mario and Link. He would balance those two... then he would add Pit... now he has to re-balance Mario and Link. Obviously he cuts corners. He won't really start balancing until later. However, the notion is still there. So when you have PKMN Trainer he is very unique. He takes 4 character models, and endurance system, and the stage specific animations for the Trainer. This doesn't take as much time as the balancing though.

So he would start off by creating one of them. For the sake of this example, we will use Squirtle. He must balance Squirtle with the entire roster. Next he must balance Ivysaur with the entire roster. Finally Charizard will be balanced with the entire roster. That isn't it though. To avoid mistakes like in Melee (Sheik top, Zelda bottom) he needs to balance PKMN Trainer with the entire roster. That is doing a lot of extra work for the final part. Not only that but he must ensure that the character is balanced within itself. Squirtle can't be a dominant Pokemon. Neither can any of them. So he needs to make a balanced cohesive character within the 3 to justify his place on the roster. This is not the same as balancing PKMN Trainer individually. That is more focused on ensuring he is fine in the roster and doesn't have too many dominant MUs. Balancing himself is to make sure the character itself is fine.

That is precisely why he takes about 4 characters. Balancing is usually the last and longest cycle of development. He already has more to balance than most characters on the roster. This isn't even mentioning the system specific to him (endurance) or all of the PKMN Trainer animations and modeling mixed with voice work for each and every Pokemon. Does he take up 4 characters? Maybe. No doubt he takes slightly longer than 3 (seeing as 3 full-fledged balanced characters are in the game). So that is what he was getting at.

 

[Ember Reaper]

Yes. I feel the exact same way. I am just wondering... do you prefer Toon Link over Link in Brawl? I see that you are also a Link main and I personally feel the exact same way. I actually spent way more time with Toon Link. I just put TP Link on my icon thing anyways because it is disgraceful...

I prefer Link hands down. I always love a challenge, I how I choose who I play... I play my favorites Which in order is Link, Ness, and Lucario. They are my favorite Nintendo characters that are playable in smash brothers (Diddy is fourth, but I play him less than these 3). When I play Toon Link I almost feel like I'm cheating (dat recovery difference....) I whole heartedly prefer Link, and will continue to do so regardless of tier ranking and recovery. .... Oh that recovery....

 

[Knight Dude]

Well if anyone was up for getting cut I could see it being Toon Link. given that he's the most "clone-ish". But even then, he still might stay. I guess you can say that Ike could be on the chopping block too, if Sakurai asked the Fire Emblem guys which character he could add again. And only if the happen to care so much about relevancy. Lucario would have a similar problem of getting axed for a more "relevant" Pokemon. But those two are still popular enough to warrant staying in my book.

 

[grizby2]

You people annoy me so much... have you ever played Wolf? EVER? EVER EVER EVER?

I will tell you their similarities... ahem... d special and final smash. If Wolf gets cut because they couldn't give him a different Final Smash I will flip. His d special doesn't even really count because all Fire Emblem characters have the same d special too. It is series specific. Not to mention they did change the design and color. His Blaster is NOT even close to the same. It has a blade at the end of it (which is functional) and the blaster projectile is slightly larger and much slower. So you can't say it is similar. The similarities end at they are both blasters. His recovery move is completely different too. People seem to be under the impression that it is Fox/Falco's but without the fire.

TL;DR- Pick up your controller and go play Fox and Wolf back to back. FALCO is WAY MORE of a CLONE than WOLF. So he is unique to Fox. I guess a shared series move is just too much. Nobody complains about FE characters though. Wolf was added last minute I believe... so they didn't have time to change his Final Smash.

Anyways. Sorry for flipping out. I just don't like people telling other people that they are similar. It perpetuates the problem. The share 2 moves that are visually different. The rest ARE different.

this^^^!
especially for ness/lucas arguments.
lucas is more luigified than luigi or falco, but we all know luigi and falco probably won't go ANYWHERE, so why should lucas leave the scene?


if anyone is leaving,it'll be: snake, PKMN trainer, toon link, lucario, or ike.(this is my personal order from greatest to least)

though it kinda saddens me that most of the "might be cut" characters have pretty good original movesets aside from toon link. but even in brawl, they did luigify him a bit more than people tend to recognize. if the development team does it right, toon link can make a great comeback in SSB4 in the same way falco did in brawl.

 

[Shorts]

I think we'll see three. One being Snake, one being a Pokemon character, and the final being someone else.

The thing about Lucas Toon Link and Ganondorf having cloney B-Moves is that THEY ABSOLUTELY DON'T NEED TO. They both have more than enough to work with. Wolf, Luigi, Falco, not as much. But those three? Definitely.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Lucas and Ike are in danger the most unfortunately imo . But I believe they can hang in there!


Also unlike many people here I don't expect Lucario to go ANYWHERE, as much as I hate him.
He has:
1. Relevancy (lol why is this even a thing for Pokemon where there's Pokemon Trainer with Gen 1 starters?)
2. Popularity (in all subset of the Pokemon fanbase)
3. Marketing (to this day)
4. Uniqueness (Aura and an elegant martial arts inspired moveset)
5. Diversity (A gen 4 Pokemon rep and a nice complement to the roster.)
Yeah...

 

[@tomic]

The only one that would surprise me to see return would be Snake. He definitely seemed like a one-off character and he only got in because Kojima begged for him to be added. He arguably fit the more realistic visual style of brawl, but I'm not sure he'd go well with this brighter, more colorful look.

I also think Ike goes in favor of Chrom, but I could see Ike coming back.

 

[RODO]

Wolf seems like a given to me. So does Toon Link. They need to work on making the original Link better anyway

 

[SpaceJell0]

To me the only characters I'm almost absolutely sure won't make it are Toon Link, Ike, and Lucario as Lucario and Ike are no longer relevant and Toon Link is just a more efficient clone of Link. The weird cases are Falco, Wolf, Snake, and Lucas as their fates can be on either side of the absolutely cut and definitely not cut spectrums. (Besides Lucas has a large following in the US due to the fan translations)

Pokemon Trainer I feel is a hard cut to decide, on one end he is hard to program and is a bit gimmicky and on the other he is the protagonist, iconic, and only Pokemon character I liked playing as personally. Jigglypuff seems to be hanging on a thread, she is seen as "cemented" into the Smash scene by some due to her veteran status and Fairy type relevancy but let's look at it from the other side... For one she was never meant to be taken seriously, her appearance was partly due to the anime attention (which Sakurai said himself was how he determined most Pokemon characters) but she is now no longer relevant anime-wise and in my opinion, she feels like the "What she's still here? Oh well" character and she was only good in Melee. A weird case she is...

Ganondorf is also weird considering his heavily cloned moveset and questionable relevancy (Guys it's a remake, that doesn't make something relevant) but at the same time he does feel like the truly evil character in Smash ( Sorry Bowser, the Mario RPG series has mocked your evilness ) so we'll have to wait and see. R.O.B. seemed as though Sakurai wanted to "Game & Watch" us again but R.O.B.'s character felt kinda stale and clunky despite his tragic development in the SSE however he does have a unique moveset which Sakurai emphasizes. Ice Climbers seems to be reliant on whether or not the 3DS can handle them as Sakurai seemed to be hinting that he wants them to be back in ( He also said they were a childhood memory of his) so they're situational. Finally, Olimar is coming back no question. He's not being replaced by the newer ones as it is confirmed he is in Pikmin 3 somewhere (Looking forward to how the Rock and Winged Pikmin play!).

That's my two-cents, Critiques? Comments? Death Threats?

 

[Deleted member]

Not sure if there will be any, but should they happen, the possibilities are Snake, Sonic, Toon Link, Lucario, Ike and Pokémon Trainer. Snake and Sonic are dependent on if Sakurai wants to bring back guests (although Sonic has the best shot) and Toon Link could go to be replaced by a child Link. Lucario, Ike and Pokémon Trainer are also possibilities, but I don't think they will get cut (and if the former two do get cut by time constraints, should DLC happen, I see those cuts rectified via DLC).