Clone Character Hate

[J04KlM]

And what is your point? Just because they previously were poorly designed does not mean they will stick to that status in the next installment.

I want an answer.

 

[Spinosaurus]

I want an answer.

Check back.

 

[MagnesD3]

if MagnesD3 was in charge of the roster from the beginning I bet you we would have never gotten Captain Falcon and Ness.

Let's all be grateful that he isn't.

Yes I would have. F Zero had sequential entries and Mr. Falcon was the lead racer, Ness would eventually be a retro due to him coming from an old beloved/good game. I guess it shows how much you know about what Id pick or not. Oh thats right you wouldnt know the first thing about it. I dont pick random characters k

 

[SmasherP83]

I want an answer.

Marth. Ganondorf. Although I wouldn't say they were poorly designed just....changed in appearance.

 

[Moon Monkey]

The only reason why am not a fan of clones is, because typically whenever there are 2 characters with the same exact moves with different properties there always happens to be a better of the two; which renders the other character useless.
Example: Marth > Roy, Pikachu > Pichu, Dr. Mario > Mario (Melee) , Captain Falcon > Ganondorf (Melee)

The only exception I would say would be Fox and Falco since they have their own distinct quirks that make them equally useful.

 

[Zol]

I honestly feel like Dark Pit gets more hate than he deserves. Trying to avoid being bias as a Kid Icarus fan, his addition in the game as a clone isn't any worse than Dr. Mario or Lucina. The argument I'm seeing more people put up is that Dark Pit is just pit, but with a different color. In that case, Dr. Mario is just Mario with a coat on..but he doesn't seem to be getting the hate that Dark Pit has, and the Mario series already has more reps than the Kid Icarus series does (Understandable, with it being Nintendo's mascot franchise, but nevertheless) People go on about how Lucina is also welcome because some of them wanted her and because she's her own character in Awakening, but Dark Pit is his own character in Uprising as well. Yes, story wise, he's also a clone of Pit, but he has his own personality that makes him unique, just like Lucina has her own personality that makes her different from Marth.

Maybe I'm just ranting here, but it just irks me that Dark Pit has been put at the bottom and that Dr. Mario, who is ACTUALLY the character Mario himself, is getting by with less hatred and it feels as though it's just because he was in a Smash Bros. game in the past, making it more acceptable. I like the fact that Dark Pit is in the game because he's an awesome character, but I would have been just as fine with him not being there, same goes for Lucina. But even with that in mind, I feel as though many more people would be upset if Lucina hadn't made it in, even if they knew she would be a clone. Rant over, sorry about this.

it's because Pit is an extremely hateable character

so an edgy, black reskin of him wont be well received either

 

[CrimsonYoshi]

Geez, Sakurai should've taken Dr Mario out just because all you entitled kids would whine.. They had some extra development time and said "hey, this could work". They didn't say Dr Mario has PRIORITY, they said they had JUST ENOUGH TIME for a clone.


also most of you want Roy and mewtwo only because they were in melee not for other reasons. I preferred Roy, but don't grow a romantic attachment to him. Same goes for Mewtwo. They both weren't exceptionally interesting, it's just something you can't have and now want.

 

[Lord Goomy]

Sales doesnt equal importance to the series thats like saying because donkey kong tropical freeze sold the best out of all the donkey kongs we should add that Walrus guy as a character. Also Ive always seen Lyn as a historical piece since she was the first protagonist that opened up the western world to Fire Emblem, its why she was so popular in the pre brawl era.

She was the first protagonist, along with Eliwood and Hector. In all honesty, Rekka no Ken didn't open up the Western world to FE. Marth did, in Smash. Marth was the significant character from FE in melee, and Roy was just there as advertising. Also, according to how you claim being in multiple games determines if a character is important enough to be included, then Lyn is in no way deserving as she only appeared in Rekka no Ken.

 

[MagnesD3]

She was the first protagonist, along with Eliwood and Hector. In all honesty, Rekka no Ken didn't open up the Western world to FE. Marth did, in Smash. Marth was the significant character from FE in melee, and Roy was just there as advertising. Also, according to how you claim being in multiple games determines if a character is important enough to be included, then Lyn is in no way deserving as she only appeared in Rekka no Ken.

If you look at my merits History is one of them (its the reason im ok with mii's) Lyn is definitely a representative of that history as she was the beginning of FE to the outside world.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I thought it was obvious why the three clones were added over other potential clones. Lucina, Dark Pit, and Dr. Mario were made to be alternate costumes for Marth, Pit, and Mario, then they later decided to make them there own characters and only make very little changes. Since they had already existing models it was extremely easy to make them there own characters. It also makes sense for those three to be straight up clones since one of them imitates the other (Lucina) another is a mirrored clone of the other (Dark Pit) and the last one is the same character in different clothes (Dr. Mario) Sakurai might feel that characters like Impa and Dixie deserve more than being straight up clones. As for Alph Sakurai may have felt that the Pikmin are what really matter, more so then the Captain and that it doesn't make any sense for the Pikmin's stats to be different and having rock Pikmin wouldn't be enough.

 

[SciCore]

Nobody has yet to provide proof that Awakening "saved" Fire Emblem. Did nintendo threaten to never make a new one or something?

Nintendo was basically going to cancel the series if Awakening didn't sell at least 250,00 units.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/st...s-saved-the-series-cancellation/1100-6408782/

 

[MagnesD3]

I thought it was obvious why the three clones were added over other potential clones. Lucina, Dark Pit, and Dr. Mario were made to be alternate costumes for Marth, Pit, and Mario, then they later decided to make them there own characters and only make very little changes. Since they had already existing models it was extremely easy to make them there own characters. It also makes sense for those three to be straight up clones since one of them imitates the other (Lucina) another is a mirrored clone of the other (Dark Pit) and the last one is the same character in different clothes (Dr. Mario) Sakurai might feel that characters like Impa and Dixie deserve more than being straight up clones. As for Alph Sakurai may have felt that the Pikmin are what really matter, more so then the Captain and that it doesn't make any sense for the Pikmin's stats to be different and having rock Pikmin wouldn't be enough.

Im hoping you are right about Impa and Dixie (and Lucas/Wolf )

Nintendo was basically going to cancel the series if Awakening didn't sell at least 250,00 units.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/st...s-saved-the-series-cancellation/1100-6408782/

hmm. This changes things. (Maybe Robin had merit as a history piece?)

 

[L9999]

If you look at my merits History is one of them (its the reason im ok with mii's) Lyn is definitely a representative of that history as she was the beginning of FE to the outside world.

Actually the beggining of any Fire Emblem in America was an OVA that nobody remembers starring Mars. Yes, figure out who is Mars. He is in Melee.

 

[SmasherP83]

Actually the beggining of any Fire Emblem in America got was an OVA that nobody remembered starring Mars. Yes, figure out who is Mars. He is in Melee.

I remember it.

 

[MagnesD3]

Actually the beggining of any Fire Emblem in America was an OVA that nobody remembers starring Mars. Yes, figure out who is Mars. He is in Melee.

I mean for the game series. If we want to count first time ever it would be melee. (unless the ova was out even before that lol)

 

[L9999]

I mean for the game series. If we want to count first time ever it would be melee. (unless the ova was out even before that lol)

The OVA was before. The opening even had the subs " based on the popular videogame series" even though Fire Emblem didn't even existed in america yet.

 

[Naoshi]

Geez, Sakurai should've taken Dr Mario out just because all you entitled kids would whine.. They had some extra development time and said "hey, this could work". They didn't say Dr Mario has PRIORITY, they said they had JUST ENOUGH TIME for a clone.


also most of you want Roy and mewtwo only because they were in melee not for other reasons. I preferred Roy, but don't grow a romantic attachment to him. Same goes for Mewtwo. They both weren't exceptionally interesting, it's just something you can't have and now want.

While I'm on your side about clones, but what is with your assumption that people only want Mewtwo back just because he was in Melee? You do realize he's a popular Pokemon right?

 

[MagnesD3]

The OVA was before.

Where in the world did that air lol

 

[J04KlM]

Roy isn't really as popular in Smash BECAUSE of his poor design in Melee.

What you're arguing about is insignificant to me.

In that case, Ganondorf and Captain Falcon aren't as popular either because of their poor designs in Brawl.

Roy is popular enough to warrant a return in a future Smash, while it's true he's nowhere on top of the priority list regarding FE characters he does have his group of cult fans. Remember that Roy, along with Marth, being in Melee brought interest for Fire Emblem in the west. Causing the franchise to be popularized outside Japan and started releasing games worldwide. This would never have happened if it wasn't for Roy or Marth's inclusion in Melee.

 

[SmasherP83]

While I'm on your side about clones, but what is with your assumption that people only want Mewtwo back just because he was in Melee? You do realize he's a popular Pokemon right?

I like Mewtwo but let's be honest he's overrated. I'd rather have some new pokemon appearing then old.

 

[Naoshi]

Im hoping you are right about Impa and Lucina (and Lucas/Wolf )

Sakurai pretty much confirmed that Lucina was going to be a Marth alt until he realized she would have some property differences, so her being an alt was unfeasible. That's why she has her own slot in the roster.

I like Mewtwo but let's be honest he's overrated. I'd rather have some new pokemon appearing then old.

I'm never a fan of the term "overrated" to be quite honest. And I don't see the issue of bringing back a unique veteran.

I think it'd be awesome if he comes back, ideally he can come back via DLC along with a new Pokemon. (Although we already have Greninja as the new Pokemon in the roster, but it'd be awesome to have a Gen 3 rep.)

 

[L9999]

I like Mewtwo but let's be honest he's overrated. I'd rather have some new pokemon appearing then old.

Going by that all the Pokemon in Smash except Pichu and Ivysaur are overrated or where at one point in history. Mewtwo, Pikachu and Charizard are SKY HIGH overrated, especially Zard and M2. Jiggs and Squirtle were thanks to the anime and Jiggs is popular in Melee, for something she got high in the tier lists. Lucario and Greninja are overrated in competitive Pokemon. But to his credit, Mewtwo is unique.

 

[MagnesD3]

Sakurai pretty much confirmed that Lucina was going to be a Marth alt until he realized she would have some property differences, so her being an alt was unfeasible. That's why she has her own slot in the roster.


I'm never a fan of the term "overrated" to be quite honest. And I don't see the issue of bringing back a unique veteran.

I think it'd be awesome if he comes back, ideally he can come back via DLC along with a new Pokemon. (Although we already have Greninja as the new Pokemon in the roster, but it'd be awesome to have a Gen 3 rep.)

Lucina was supposed to be dixie. Derp :S

 

[SmasherP83]

Sakurai pretty much confirmed that Lucina was going to be a Marth alt until he realized she would have some property differences, so her being an alt was unfeasible. That's why she has her own slot in the roster.


I'm never a fan of the term "overrated" to be quite honest. And I don't see the issue of bringing back a unique veteran.

I think it'd be awesome if he comes back, ideally he can come back via DLC along with a new Pokemon.

I'm fine with him coming back but his moveset was awful in my opinion, Where as someone like Lucario his moveset seemed more "useful"

EDIT: Or more freshened out.

 

[Naoshi]

I honestly don't think any Pokemon is overrated.

I'm fine with him coming back but his moveset was awful in my opinion, Where as someone like Lucario his moveset seemed more "useful"

EDIT: Or more freshened out.

They can just buff him and improve his moveset. Didn't Mewtwo turned out well in Project M without changing his moveset significantly though?

I mean, I am aware Mewtwo didn't play well in Melee. One of the main reasons why I want him back (aside from being one of my favorite Pokemon) is so be can be given another chance and play better. He's THE legendary Pokemon to many, and I feel he earned his spot pretty well. It's just his execution that needs work.

 

[L9999]

I honestly don't think any Pokemon is overrated.

Tell Charizard that.

 

[MagnesD3]

Mewtwo should have been in brawl and this game end of story.

 

[J04KlM]

I'm fine with him coming back but his moveset was awful in my opinion

Why do i have to keep explaining this to you people.

Just because they were bad in a previous installment doesn't mean they likely will be bad in a new installment.

 

[SmasherP83]

Mewtwo should have been in brawl and this game end of story.

Rather have new pokemon to have a chance.

 

[Cyberguy64]

What if, instead of making clones, they had put more effort into the customization and costumes so we could build our own clones? That's my main issue with them, besides Dark Pit being a beacon of Sakurai's hubris.

 

[SmasherP83]

Why do i have to keep explaining this to you people.

Just because they were bad in a previous installment doesn't mean they likely will be bad in a new installment.

Like I wouldn't know.

 

[Naoshi]

Tell Charizard that.

I'm not a huge Charizard fan (I largely prefer Blastoise. BLUE VERSION 4EVER) but kids loves badass dragons. His popularity makes sense.

Mewtwo should have been in brawl and this game end of story.

I agree, but sacrificing clones isn't going to bring him back.

There's always DLC or whatever connectivity Wii U might have though? Who knows

 

[King Donkey Kong]

Dr. Mario: I can see why he can't be an alt of Mario due to pills and mario tornado/dair. But still...why do we need this character? He's Mario...in a new costume...we got Rosalina and Bowser Jr. and all the Koopalings...wtf

Lucina: Loved FE:A, not a huge fan of hers, but she could have been a Marth alt as they intended, at least she's not Marth in a wig...

Dark Pit: Sakurai bias, that is all.


I would rather they drop these 3 and give Toon Link and Ganondorf their own movesets. -.- Falco fighting like Fox makes sense I suppose, I don't have a problem with it aside from his final smash not involving Arwings.

 

[MagnesD3]

Rather have new pokemon to have a chance.

Id rather have the Iconic Legendary Pokemon who all poke fans know and love. Even Casuals know Mewtwo.

 

[SmasherP83]

Id rather have the Iconic Legendary Pokemon who all poke fans know and love.

so what if they know Mewtwo? Everyone knows Lucario I don't see the point.

 

[J04KlM]

Like I wouldn't know.

Doesn't sound like it. "but his moveset was awful in Melee".

That's completely irrelevant to how he would be designed in a new Smash game.

 

[SmasherP83]

Doesn't sound like it. "but his moveset was awful in Melee".

That's completely irrelevant to how he would be designed in a new Smash game.

Well I was only talking about Melee not anything else. If I were I would've worded that differently then how that turned out.

 

[Naoshi]

I'd seriously never understand the stupid "SAKURAI BIAS" accusations that Dark Pit has. He's just a clone of another character, like the other 5 clones in the game. How is this any different?

 

[SmasherP83]

I'd seriously never understand the stupid "SAKURAI BIAS" accusations that Dark Pit has. He's just a clone of another character, like the other 5 clones in the game. How is this any different?

My same exact thoughts.

 

[WolfieXVII ❂]

Yay more flamebait!
@Backgammon pls "help" these guys realize certain threads don't need to exist