Zelda Ledge Steal potential

[Chauzu]

I felt like making a new thread for this so we can collect data in the future.

So some of you might not be familiar with this ledge steal / trump yet but basically it's when you jump down and grab the ledge right after the opponent has grabbed it to push it out and attack it.

I found one setup vs. Fox that lets Zelda get a sweetspot bair in:

HOWEVER I can't say for 100% certainity that this is a real thing. It depends on how CPU's work in this game. I think that they try and jump at the earliest opportunity in these situations. In that case, yes this is indeed a thing since we got a 100% safe safe setup into bair kill against Fox. If not and the CPU could have jumped / dodged earlier then it's not that big of a deal (would mostly be to surprise opponents unprepared).

I have tried this against Metaknight and Diddy as well and it did not work. Why? They jumped way too early. I might try more in the future but we'd need to know if this is a real thing worth the effort first.

Unfortunately except for bair I don't think any of Zelda's other moves are viable for this but yeah it's hard to test vs CPU's unfortunately so it can't be ruled out either.

So yeah sorry again if this is absolutely nothing and I'm wasting everybody's time.

 

[Toadallstar2]

Protip: Try watching in HD, Speed at 0.25, and fullscreen to get a better view.

Thanks for sharing. Yes, it's worth investing in tips such as these. Seemingly difficult to pull off. I wonder even if we can jump ourselves and do a nair or uair or something. Worth playing around.

 

[BJN39]

Well, it would be no surprise to me if something like that worked. As I've at leas been seeing a lot of Sheik doing BAir off a ledge steal pop out. IDK if it's actually reliable though. It'll definitely need some more testing.

 

[Chauzu]

Ok, I have done more testing vs. Fox.

In the video it might look like Fox waits a long time to jump. And yes Fox can jump a bit earlier - like if you compare to the ground level, like a bit above that is the earliest Fox can jump. And Fox can't air dodge until later so it definately cannot air dodge Zelda's bair.

So the question is if he can jump before Zelda can nail the bair. I've been trying with Zelda and it is possible to hit the lightning kick higher up in the air than I showed in my video. I can't promise yet that this is a real thing but I'm starting to have hope that this setup will work at least against Fox reliably and if it works against one char it might work against more.

And if we can make this work reliably against other characters with Fox - that have a very easy recovery to read so easy to time the ledge steal - Zelda should get some easier match-ups. Because as I've said, if I'm proven right with this we're talking a guaranteed bair sweetspot by the ledge if executed correctly.

I really hope I'm proven right at least lmao! If I found proof that this works 100% I'll post another vid.

 

[Chauzu]

Ok, here's the vid:

And with this I'll consider my testing with this over.

It's hard to say with this as well, we'd really need to do human vs. human testing but yeah, not so easy with 3DS.

So yeah no conclusive evidence imo.

 

[Boasting Toast]

This is a technique called "vexxing", found by Vex himself. Not guaranteed, but still viable if done correctly.

 

[Chauzu]

This is a technique called "vexxing", found by Vex himself. Not guaranteed, but still viable if done correctly.

Yeah, I know it's not something I discovered or anything, just tried to see if it had any uses for Zelda and it seems like it has potential against some characters. I tried to see if it was guaranteed vs. Fox but the evidence is pretty meh, we're talking frames I think.

 

[TimeSmash]

Any info is good info

 

[Chauzu]

Ok, so the earlier vids have been a bit meh, I can't argue with that. I got a bit ahead of myself.

But thanks to other people finding out more about this mechanic I've finally made it work. The (hopefully <3) guaranteed bair kill is real.

The key to making it work is all about timing. You need to grab the ledge like immediately after the opponent does it and if you do you can nail the bair into them. I dunno why but with this timing you can move faster while the opponent can't move yet. It will be hard to master but few characters will have better punishes than Zelda.

Now I can't bother testing if these are escapeable, it's kinda hard with only one 3ds. But I think they are. I'll not happily be proved wrong but if that's the case, fine. I'm pretty hyped though.

If it does indeed work like I hope, then the next question is if it works against the entire cast. The timing is also a bit different on some, for example Falco / Fox are harder to nail imo.

Now I'm just hoping this isn't another time waste for everybody.