Z-Canceling

[BestTeaMaker]

Instructions: (From the video description)

-Jump.
- As you are landing, press Z.
- Marvel at the lack of standard lag.


So, SBU-Saiblade posted this to /r/SmashBros, and I thought it'd be a great idea to get this going here. As they explain, what happens is that moves with special landing animations can be z-canceled to reduce landing lag and get an immediate followup.

Discuss and test. I'll update this OP with information as we find more and more things.

 

[RobinOnDrugs]

This will be awesome...until it eventually gets patched out like DACUS.

 

[Mikkelmann]

Info in the video and reddit thread.

 

[LiL.Will]

I wish they gave a list of aerials that could be Z-canceled. Oh well off to training mode to see if this is actually a thing.

 

[Prawn]

Posting

10chars

 

[Alhobbies440]

The video could have done a better job at explaining the technique itself rather than showing off its application first. Oh well, personally I don't think this supposedly new tech is gonna go anywhere based on the video.

 

[TheSMASHtyke]

Yeah, this video was a really poor tutorial and is leading me to believe that they're just hitting autocancel windows for these aerials. Would love for someone to take a closer look at this and prove / debunk it's a thing.

 

[LiL.Will]

Yeah, this video was a really poor tutorial and is leading me to believe that they're just hitting autocancel windows for these aerials. Would love for someone to take a closer look at this and prove / debunk it's a thing.

Nah Diddy's Fair doesn't autocancel like that and D3's only autocancels when fastfalled or at the apex of his shorthop. The video is still questionable though.

In the video they said certain animations but they never broke down what animations are able to be Z-cancelled Im guessing the animation must look like Diddy's to where he is helpless on the floor or something.

 

[BestTeaMaker]

Probably the most important thing I saw was that Sheik shield-breaker combo that was possible due to this. If this is true, this can help drastically reduce the shield game and help increase the aggression in the meta.

 

[Ulevo]

This looks like hogwash to me unless someone can appropriately break down what is happening and give me something I can replicate in training mode. Visually I see no difference in speed.

 

[Alhobbies440]

Nah Diddy's Fair doesn't autocancel like that and D3's only autocancels when fastfalled or at the apex of his shorthop. The video is still questionable though.

In the video they said certain animations but they never broke down what animations are able to be Z-cancelled Im guessing the animation must look like Diddy's to where he is helpless on the floor or something.

They were probably too excited to explain it properly because of what this could potentially do for competitive play. Hopefully they or someone else puts out a video going into greater detail on the matter if this is real.

 

[Flamecircle]

Probably the most important thing I saw was that Sheik shield-breaker combo that was possible due to this. If this is true, this can help drastically reduce the shield game and help increase the aggression in the meta.

I dunno if I want a shiek only meta.

 

[GdspdUblkprzdnt]

Mowhere does it explain the inputs. Is it just like l-cancelling in Melee? Input Z before you land during an aerial with a special landing animation?

 

[LiL.Will]

Mowhere does it explain the inputs. Is it just like l-cancelling in Melee? Input Z before you land during an aerial with a special landing animation?

Yeah it's supposed to be just like Melee's L-cancel input except press Z (or what you mapped as your grab button)

 

[Teshie U]

*sigh*
I dont have a grab button.

 

[Flamecircle]

I'm sure you guys are trying this right now. Any luck? I can't make anything work.

 

[Virgule]

They also say that they found another thing on reddit and they will upload it later.
Personnaly I really doubt the truth of this video, the overall explanation's quality is pretty bad and this seems far too big to only be discovered today(plus there is a false comment that deny the sheik combo seen on the video).

Remind me the rayman leak...

 

[Mikkelmann]

sorry for bad quailty we'll give get a better one out soon.

 

[20YY SS | Saiblade]

Hey guys, sorry for bad quality, leader of SBU here, will be posting better video soon.

 

[20YY SS | Saiblade]

About the quality again, we were super excited and wanted to get this out as soon as possible, we will be making a new video asap.

 

[LiL.Will]

This feels like IASA frames honestly after watching the video again where the player is doing Diddy's D-air it reminds me of this video.

 

[Virgule]

About the quality again, we were super excited and wanted to get this out as soon as possible, we will be making a new video asap.

This is understandable, I only ask to trust you but this is a bit hard right now. Any idea when you'll be able to upload a new video (and about this "other" discovery") ?

 

[20YY SS | Saiblade]

This is understandable, I only ask to trust you but this is a bit hard right now. Any idea when you'll be able to upload a new video (and about this "other" discovery") ?

Thanks for understanding.
We'll be uploading a new video probably tomorrow, and the other discovery I revealed on reddit as we won't be able to make a video for it soon, we have found a big variety of wavedash/waveland-esque techniques on a variety of characters, we'll be updating this asap.

 

[Jehtt]

This really sounds like Clickbait to me. A vaguely explained topic that you "promise will be covered tomorrow." Surely you see why this sounds like a cheap way to get views.

 

[20YY SS | Saiblade]

This really sounds like Clickbait to me. A vaguely explained topic that you "promise will be covered tomorrow." Surely you see why this sounds like a cheap way to get views.

We honestly don't care about the views, we only want to influence the meta.

 

[RealityReloaded]

This really sounds like Clickbait to me. A vaguely explained topic that you "promise will be covered tomorrow." Surely you see why this sounds like a cheap way to get views.

Eeh, keep in mind that a lot of the people on these boards are kids, so they might not be able to post footage immediately. They mentioned earlier that they were excited to share the news - they could simply have been a bit overeager, and may not have realized what an impact this kind of stuff could have. Considering that we're all here due to our passion for the game, I think we can all understand that to some extent.

Put simply - don't condemn a bunch of fellow smashers just because things might look a bit iffy. If it turns out to be wrong, they won't maintain any numbers anyway. There's little to be lost, and plenty to be gained.

 

[RobinOnDrugs]

I will reserve judgement until tomorrow. As exciting as this is, there is some skepticism with this announcement.

 

[Jehtt]

Put simply - don't condemn a bunch of fellow smashers just because things might look a bit iffy. If it turns out to be wrong, they won't maintain any numbers anyway. There's little to be lost, and considering that we're all here due to our passion for the game, I think we can all understand their eagerness - however over-the-top it might have been.

I'm not trying to condemn anybody; I'm just trying to be skeptical. There have been too many disappointing announcements (or lack thereof) recently for me to get excited.

 

[Pazx]

Done some testing, no dice. Looks to me like auto cancel windows, but will await new footage.

 

[20YY SS | Saiblade]

Well guys, I have to go to sleep for statewide testing tomorrow, I'll be updating you guys asap, thanks for bearing with me.

 

[Charey]

Thanks for understanding.
We'll be uploading a new video probably tomorrow, and the other discovery I revealed on reddit as we won't be able to make a video for it soon, we have found a big variety of wavedash/waveland-esque techniques on a variety of characters, we'll be updating this asap.

Maybe you could post of list of aerials here that you have found that this works for so we can start trying to figure out if this is really something new?

Forgive me for being skeptical but I find it hard to believe something as simple as hitting Z when landing would go this long without being discovered, more so with L and Z canceling already being a thing in previous Smash games.

 

[BestTeaMaker]

I've been trying to do this with DDD, but haven't gotten much. This might be just certain moves autocanceling.

Although, concerning Diddy's dair, I did find that you don't necessarily need to air dodge in the beginning. What happens is that if you perform his dair right as you land, it autocancels, but doesn't attack. If you do land the dair, you suffer the landing lag either way, whether hitting the shield or the player.

I await future videos to see if this this can be a thing. But for now, it looks like it may be just autocancelled aerials.

 

[Jehtt]

I've been trying to do this with DDD, but haven't gotten much. This might be just certain moves autocanceling.

Although, concerning Diddy's dair, I did find that you don't necessarily need to air dodge in the beginning. What happens is that if you perform his dair right as you land, it autocancels, but doesn't attack. If you do land the dair, you suffer the landing lag either way, whether hitting the shield or the player.

I await future videos to see if this this can be a thing. But for now, it looks like it may be just autocancelled aerials.

Probably some IASA frames in there too. I can't test right now though.

 

[TheSMASHtyke]

I think we can leave it at this.

 

[Malkasaur]

If this is true then it would have to be intentional.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Deconfirmed and debunked. Gonna go ahead and close this.