your ledge guarding strategy

[Renegade TX2000]

So on paper if they are holding onto the ledge is to hold jab to beat the usual ledge stand, ledge jump, ledge attack. If they roll then you can decide what is the best punish for that character... Since people love to wait for us by the ledge we have to master guarding the ledge. Our worse enemy is the regular ledge get up that bs has way too much damn invincibility. How long are they invulnerable for before we can actually punish them before they can react. Will post more on this topic but i did this from my phone.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Holding Jab has gaps in it that allow Ledge Climb to beat it sometimes; that's not a reliable defense against it and letting go of Jab after you see that the ledge option they chose isn't Ledge Jump leaves you vulnerable if they Ledge Climb.

D-Tilt's incredibly fast animation seems like it would work to cover both Ledge Jumps and Ledge Climbs simultaneously by reacting to the opponent moving from the ledge at all. Most Ledge Jumps are vulnerable at around Frame 12, while most Ledge Climbs are vulnerable at around Frame 32. D-Tilt hits on Frame 3 and is finished on Frame 21, so a well-timed D-Tilt will hit a Ledge Jump user into a combo position and will end in enough time for you to use another move (likely a Jab or tilt) to catch a Ledge Climb. It also has the advantage of having great range, so opponents using a Ledge Drop -> double-jump aerial will trade with you at worst and lose to D-Tilt at best. With good timing, this seems like it's one of the best ledge coverage options in the game, period, and with Forward-B having increased knockback in the 1.06 patch, this could be a strong game-ending thwomp on the last stock.

Jab being Frame 1 means it should be a really good tool for catching the end of a Ledge Climb on reaction; that can lead to a lot. Full Jab combo for damage and Jab1 -> Jab2 -> Up-B as a hit confirm into a KO move both work from the advantaged side, while rolling behind the opponent and doing a Rapid Jab slides you off the level after six rapid Jab hits, allowing stuff like Rapid Jab -> Forward-B and Rapid Jab -> KO Punch.

People being afraid of our superior poking tools often leads to a lot of shielding post-Ledge Climb, so a well-timed grab does good, with two pummels -> throw dealing solid damage. D-Throw/F-Throw is a decent DI mix-up in that, too; an opponent can escape a D-Throw -> Up-B by holding away, but F-Throw sends at a sharper angle in that case, sending them further away, which can be great for resetting the situation and for edgeguarding (which is heavily matchup-dependent, obviously).

 

[PHYTO-1]

use unira, bumper, smokeball (let it bounce up and down near the ledge), x-bomb, smart bomb work great.

if i use my final smash i'll attack the with dsmash spam

 

[Laitome]

Ok here's the general gist of Mac edgeguards:

• If they jump from ledge > hold jab
• If they do a regular getup > hold jab and you may get them, well timed f-tilt works better, or downsmash
• If they roll from ledge > downsmash or back-roll f-tilt
• If they attack from ledge > downsmash and armor through it or shield and upsmash
• If they jump to the ledge > downsmash
• If they recover towards the ledge > downsmash and deny them if you know the timing
• If they let go then approach with an aerial > Shield and punish with f-tilt or jab, or downsmash

Downsmash is the magical key in mac edge guards. It covers reaching for the ledge and it denies all but one ledge getup option. On paper a perfect Mac player can make sure his opponent can never grab the ledge AND restrict them to a single option with a single move which is crazy scary.

 

[HenshinRiderMV]

my personal favourites are down smash or if your feeling a bit tryhardy just use nair when they get close OR if your feeling super pro and your a stock up jump at them and use counter (for ness and others whom use attacks for recoverys)

 

[Renegade TX2000]

Holding Jab has gaps in it that allow Ledge Climb to beat it sometimes; that's not a reliable defense against it and letting go of Jab after you see that the ledge option they chose isn't Ledge Jump leaves you vulnerable if they Ledge Climb.

D-Tilt's incredibly fast animation seems like it would work to cover both Ledge Jumps and Ledge Climbs simultaneously by reacting to the opponent moving from the ledge at all. Most Ledge Jumps are vulnerable at around Frame 12, while most Ledge Climbs are vulnerable at around Frame 32. D-Tilt hits on Frame 3 and is finished on Frame 21, so a well-timed D-Tilt will hit a Ledge Jump user into a combo position and will end in enough time for you to use another move (likely a Jab or tilt) to catch a Ledge Climb. It also has the advantage of having great range, so opponents using a Ledge Drop -> double-jump aerial will trade with you at worst and lose to D-Tilt at best. With good timing, this seems like it's one of the best ledge coverage options in the game, period, and with Forward-B having increased knockback in the 1.06 patch, this could be a strong game-ending thwomp on the last stock.

Jab being Frame 1 means it should be a really good tool for catching the end of a Ledge Climb on reaction; that can lead to a lot. Full Jab combo for damage and Jab1 -> Jab2 -> Up-B as a hit confirm into a KO move both work from the advantaged side, while rolling behind the opponent and doing a Rapid Jab slides you off the level after six rapid Jab hits, allowing stuff like Rapid Jab -> Forward-B and Rapid Jab -> KO Punch.

People being afraid of our superior poking tools often leads to a lot of shielding post-Ledge Climb, so a well-timed grab does good, with two pummels -> throw dealing solid damage. D-Throw/F-Throw is a decent DI mix-up in that, too; an opponent can escape a D-Throw -> Up-B by holding away, but F-Throw sends at a sharper angle in that case, sending them further away, which can be great for resetting the situation and for edgeguarding (which is heavily matchup-dependent, obviously).

You know about his grab game... Honestly his grabs are trash, when I play against lil mac I feel comfortable shielding looking for an opportunity. If his fthrow, back throw lead to tech chases I feel like that would fix his offense game making ppl fight to the pace of mac, but i feel like shielding ruins a lot of macs momentum half of the time.