Yoshi...

[DMG]

What do you guys do against him? I personally do not have very much trouble but I wanted to know what the rest of the Wario guys thought about that fight. I have been arguing for Wario in the Matchup Chart thread and people there seems to think that Wario has trouble against Yoshi's Egg Toss and that his Ground game is faster and better than Wario's.

I think that this matchup is in favor of Wario but I have had a lot of dissenting opinions. What do you guys think?

 

[PhantomX]

I agree w/ you. Yoshi can fare better against Wario than one would think... but not enough. Also... bite gimps Yoshi SO easy.

 

[Blarfenzo]

I barely fight any Yoshi's but when I do he doesn't seem to be a bad match up at all, sure he's faster on the ground but Wario is much faster in the air.

 

[DMG]

I agree w/ you. Yoshi can fare better against Wario than one would think... but not enough. Also... bite gimps Yoshi SO easy.

I mentioned that and they said it is sooo hard to gimp or edgeguard Yoshi. And apparently his Egg Toss is supposed to be a great projectile...

Is there something important I am missing or are they just misjudging Wario?

 

[Warlock*G]

Yoshi sucks...

>_>

you in with his tongue.

 

[PhantomX]

I mentioned that and they said it is sooo hard to gimp or edgeguard Yoshi. And apparently his Egg Toss is supposed to be a great projectile...

Is there something important I am missing or are they just misjudging Wario?

I play both charas, as you know... and while the egg toss is amazing, it's not enough to make the game. He is hard to gimp if you don't get within bite range, but if you do, he's dead, end of story. Also, Yoshi suffers from extreme predictability in kill moves (he has like... up air, and fsmash... since Upsmash is usually stale), which gives Wario an edge. Really Yoshi's only frightening moves are the back air, and the neutral air/a combos b/c of their high priority. If you're smart, eggs are avoidable as the attacks that follow. Make sure if you gimp that you do it right though, as they might be able to recover w/ egg toss.

 

[Ace55]

I barely fight any Yoshi's but when I do he doesn't seem to be a bad match up at all, sure he's faster on the ground but Wario is much faster in the air.

???

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=167952

And LOL @ Warlock*G

 

[Blue sHell]

I hope the people in the matchup thread notice that if you jump off the edge and bite Yoshi it completely ignores the superarmor. Thus you could kill him at like 50% if you make him double jump while off the stage.

Yoshi's UpSmash out prioritizes Dair and fair. And his ground game is obvvvvviously better than Wario's. But Wario is quicker, he absolutely does not have problems with eggs if the Wario player is smart, and he has tons more safe ways to approach as opposed to Yoshi. I'm not saying that the matchup is a complete domination on Wario's end, but its clear people aren't fighting good Warios if they think Yoshi has the advantage.

 

[Wario Nut]

Any tips on stopping egg camping Yoshis?

I've tried the bike and jump approaches but I just get shot.The only thing that works are dash attacks which are soon punished if used to often. Any help!

 

[Blarfenzo]

Hmm I guess I'm pretty ignorant about Yoshi, should practice on him more. Really didn't expect him to be the fastest in the air.

 

[Christopher Rodriguez]

Yoshi's bair is ridiculous.. one of the harder matchups for me. If you find a way around bair to utilt, good. I usually play this match pretty gay and gimp a ton when I have the chance. Those eggs are..gah. x_x

 

[DMG]

Yoshi's bair is ridiculous.. one of the harder matchups for me. If you find a way around bair to utilt, good. I usually play this match pretty gay and gimp a ton when I have the chance. Those eggs are..gah. x_x

Really? I've played Yoshi's that use every trick in the book and I don't have too much trouble with them. I NEVER have trouble with eggs but that may just be me. What exactly about the fight is hard for you Deff?

@Wario nut: You can air dodge them pretty easy. Just do a SH when they are coming towards you and air dodge. That works for me 95% of the time. Eventually, most Yoshi's will stop throwing eggs and focus on countering your aerial game.

 

[Christopher Rodriguez]

Well in my experience, Yoshi for me seems to have a trick for nearly everything Wario has. I could on listing for a while but I'd rather not. I don't lose the match much,, but it just feels like an annoyance to get rid of a Yoshi and a boring matchup.

 

[DMG]

Well in my experience, Yoshi for me seems to have a trick for nearly everything Wario has. I could on listing for a while but I'd rather not. I don't lose the match much,, but it just feels like an annoyance to get rid of a Yoshi and a boring matchup.

LOL, I know what you mean by boring. It gets really repetitive after awhile and it is annoying to face Yoshi cause usually the first thought is "Hey, this guy sucks for picking him" and then you realize that Yoshi isn't that big of a pushover.

 

[Ryan-K]

Yeah I have never been able to bite the bair or anything. Eggs have a huge range too and he is like wario with slightly more range and a projectile. You can bite gimp his recovery but if they can grab the edge with just egg throw they should be doing that instead

 

[PhantomX]

Yoshi's back air is annoying... but hell... just by walking backwards you can avoid it, since it's so predictable... Wario also has the advantage of being able to react a lot quicker than Yoshi does... and he has the advantage of unpredictability as well (seriously... maybe it's just because I play Yoshi... but everything they can do just seems so obvious).

Wario's air dodge is also > Yoshi's back air

Only thing about Yoshi's that really annoys me is the fact that their hip drop outprioritizes the up air

 

[Ryan-K]

Yoshi's back air is annoying... but hell... just by walking backwards you can avoid it, since it's so predictable... Wario also has the advantage of being able to react a lot quicker than Yoshi does... and he has the advantage of unpredictability as well (seriously... maybe it's just because I play Yoshi... but everything they can do just seems so obvious).

Wario's air dodge is also > Yoshi's back air

Only thing about Yoshi's that really annoys me is the fact that their hip drop outprioritizes the up air

Wait how can wario react quicker? Just wondering because that doesn't make sense to me.

You can also avoid wario's dair by walking backwards but that doesn't make it any less amazing lol. In fact yoshi has more air movement than wario, and yoshi's bair either ends before he lands or has very little lag.

 

[PhantomX]

Wait how can wario react quicker? Just wondering because that doesn't make sense to me.

You can also avoid wario's dair by walking backwards but that doesn't make it any less amazing lol. In fact yoshi has more air movement than wario, and yoshi's bair either ends before he lands or has very little lag.

I meant react quicker w/ respect to options and the speed of the attacks.

Most of Wario's moves come out faster than Yoshi's generally, and he has more approach options than nair and back air... seriously, if you predict the back air and block all the way through it, you can fair the Yoshi before he has a chance to react (even easier if you air dodge through the Yoshi to begin with). Then again, I'm probably one of the few that loves poking with fairs.

Also, I'm not 100%... but Yoshi's back air acts like a disjointed hitbox (as opposed to Wario's down air, where he becomes the hitbox), so it's actually easier to get around it than down air... that's just my opinion, of course, though.

 

[DMG]

Lol even after Blue sHell went into the Matchup Chart Thread and threw his analysis in there, they basically rejected it. Apparently having a top notch Wario main come in and give a good opinion isn't enough these days. 0.0

Seriously, why would people think Yoshi has the advantage? I really do not honestly see where he gets an advantage for this matchup and I am tired of my reasoning/thoughts falling on deaf ears in that Matchup Chart thread. It's ridiculous enough when people say things like "Yoshi's Fsmash is faster than Wario's Fsmash" but it is just flat out absurd when they ignore everything Blue sHell said or they try to counter it with "phail" logic.

 

[Wario Nut]

Really? I've played Yoshi's that use every trick in the book and I don't have too much trouble with them. I NEVER have trouble with eggs but that may just be me. What exactly about the fight is hard for you Deff?

@Wario nut: You can air dodge them pretty easy. Just do a SH when they are coming towards you and air dodge. That works for me 95% of the time. Eventually, most Yoshi's will stop throwing eggs and focus on countering your aerial game.

Hey dr. mario guy, I tried this tactic last night(I had to change my e-mail so I didn't get my account reactivated until this morning)but,after a few tries he'd throw an egg and then dash attack me.Is there any other good approach methods to throw in there?

Hey PhantomX, Wario's up smash out prioritizes the Yoshi Bomb so that should end your problems, but just watch out for the flutter kick.

 

[PhantomX]

Hey dr. mario guy, I tried this tactic last night(I had to change my e-mail so I didn't get my account reactivated until this morning)but,after a few tries he'd throw an egg and then dash attack me.Is there any other good approach methods to throw in there?

Hey PhantomX, Wario's up smash out prioritizes the Yoshi Bomb so that should end your problems, but just watch out for the flutter kick.

Yeah, I know this... it's only an issue when I chase for the upair finish, haha.

 

[DMG]

Hey dr. mario guy, I tried this tactic last night(I had to change my e-mail so I didn't get my account reactivated until this morning)but,after a few tries he'd throw an egg and then dash attack me.Is there any other good approach methods to throw in there?

Hey PhantomX, Wario's up smash out prioritizes the Yoshi Bomb so that should end your problems, but just watch out for the flutter kick.

Shield his Dash attack or when you do the short hop, quickly do a DJ and then airdodge. If he throws another egg or tries to pursue you in the air, you can air dodge that too and hit him when you get to the ground. I haven't seen any fights from you or the Yoshi player so it's kinda hard to see exactly what he/you are doing in situations like that. Can you upload a video or send me a replay of a match or something like that? It would help me out in figuring out what is going on.

I didn't think Upsmash would beat out the Down B, I thought they would trade hits. I guess not though.

 

[Deleted member]

I guess ill tell u my opinion since im a yoshi main who fights warios =/ Eggs arent too much trouble for wario he can SHAD to dodge them, or just shield, but hes so fast, so its hard to predict where to throw the egg. Also, yoshi shouldnt be getting gimped by the bite, against wario, they should always be airdodging in their double jump. Wario can have a somewhat difficult time approaching yoshi due to his rangy bair and his amazing pivot grabs, so see what he does when u approach with a fair and pull out, and if he pivot grabs u can try to lure out another one then punish. A big advantage wario has in this matchup is that wario is amazing at pressuring shields, and yoshi is amazing at not being able to overcome shield pressure. If the yoshi doesnt airdodge while recovering gimp his ***. Also for kill moves, watch for the fsmash, it pulls back.

 

[DMG]

I guess ill tell u my opinion since im a yoshi main who fights warios =/ Eggs arent too much trouble for wario he can SHAD to dodge them, or just shield, but hes so fast, so its hard to predict where to throw the egg. Also, yoshi shouldnt be getting gimped by the bite, against wario, they should always be airdodging in their double jump. Wario can have a somewhat difficult time approaching yoshi due to his rangy bair and his amazing pivot grabs, so see what he does when u approach with a fair and pull out, and if he pivot grabs u can try to lure out another one then punish. A big advantage wario has in this matchup is that wario is amazing at pressuring shields, and yoshi is amazing at not being able to overcome shield pressure. If the yoshi doesnt airdodge while recovering gimp his ***. Also for kill moves, watch for the fsmash, it pulls back.

Thank you for your input. Seriously, I like it when I can get input from both sides. So thanks

Can you go post something like this in the Matchup Chart thread? We have been discussing Wario vs Yoshi but you can tell they aren't too in tune with Yoshi when one of the guys says "Yoshi's Fsmash is faster than Wario's Fsmash" lol. I don't think they are accurately representing him and it would be nice to get a real Yoshi main in there to talk about it.

 

[Ryan-K]

ignore the matchup chart.

Seriously the melee one was also outrageously inaccurate. Generally anything managed by the general brawl community and not the back room (which still has its problems) or the general community of the character are inaccurate.

Sometimes in terms of a matchup two communities inadvertently come to the same conclusion, or similar tactics. Either way the numbers don't matter, what counts is how you fight a matchup and how difficult it is, what you can counterpick, etc.

Fighting over numbers in a matchup chart is a lost cause because your reasoning will get lost in the thread anyway.

 

[Wario Nut]

Thanks for the suggestions I'll have to try switching things up more.We play each other all the time so I think part of my problem is we can almost predict what the other person is going to do.

Also, sadly,I don't have the equippment to make a video for you guys.

 

[DMG]

ignore the matchup chart.

Seriously the melee one was also outrageously inaccurate. Generally anything managed by the general brawl community and not the back room (which still has its problems) or the general community of the character are inaccurate.

Sometimes in terms of a matchup two communities inadvertently come to the same conclusion, or similar tactics. Either way the numbers don't matter, what counts is how you fight a matchup and how difficult it is, what you can counterpick, etc.

Fighting over numbers in a matchup chart is a lost cause because your reasoning will get lost in the thread anyway.

I have slowly started to realize what you talked about there. I do like contributing to the chart, but I have to go so far out of the way and even when someone gets something changed, they don't get credit for it. Just seems not worth my effort at this point.

Wario Nut: It's cool. If you do get a chance to record it or a friend can record it, then see if you can get it uploaded somewhere.

 

[Wario Nut]

Well I would except my friends don't have any recording equipment.Maybe I should invest in some.

Anyway, thanks for the help. I still win half of the time, but I was looking for a better way to close with him besides spot dodging until I am close enough to dash attack.