Why can't 2015 be the Year of the Luigi

[Th3 Ice King]

I recently started wavedashing consistently. I am rising out of trash tier and into scrub tier. I am finding many players have a tough time against Luigis regardless of their experience. I have made comments about 2015 being the year of the Luigi, but I have not looked at the Global picture of Luigi players. Repeatedly I have been told last year was "supposed" to be the year of the Luigi and that the Luigi is dead. Why?

 

[Dapplegonger]

Last year was not the Year of Luigi in terms of Smash, last year was the Year of Luigi because Nintendo released a bunch of stuff centering around Luigi to commemorate the 30th anniversary of Mario Bros. A bunch of Luigi games, a Luigi themed 3DS, and a bunch of Luigi themed merchandise were released. It really has nothing to do with Smash Bros. It's more of a joke amongst Luigi players because last year was supposedly our time to shine.

The people who are struggling against you likely don't know the matchup very well. And you can't really claim that, just because people do poorly against your Luigi, everybody does. He's not a great character, he's got a lot of flaws, he struggles against several top tier characters.

Eddy Mexico is probably the best Luigi out there, but even then he's not top top level. He's won SSS in SoCal before, which is a pretty stacked region. But other than that, his placings have been more akin to those of a high level player. Until a Luigi player is able to show up and push into top level player status, I don't think we can really qualify anything as the year of Luigi. If you're interested in what is considered to be top level Luigi play, you can look for Eddy Mexico, Abate, Vudujin, Vist, or Blea Gelo. Maybe ROFL.

 

[Th3 Ice King]

Recently discovered how to defeat luigi bane (marth). Let him attack (shield) then wavedash in down throw and follow up with an aerial, then back off. Luigi vs Marth is freaking painful. Fortunately I am now beating player that I never thought I would. The play style against a marth may be lame, so far its proving effective. Gonna try and get a few sets on a really good marth main in KY "Reeve" and see how that works out.

I know Luigi has flaws, but I still have this gut feeling we havn't discovered something about Luigi yet. On a side note he's hella fun to play.

 

[Dapplegonger]

You say you are just getting into scrub tier. No offense, but I don't think you learning how to take on Marth is going to change the metagame. Top tier Luigi players know the matchup and what steps they should take, it's just hella hard because Marth has such an easier time in the matchup. The game has had 14 years to develop at this point; unless people discover some groundbreaking new tech with Luigi, chances are there won't be a "Year of Luigi" in the sense that we won't see Luigi taking any nationals.

Now if you are doing well with Luigi, that's great! That's a lot better than I can say of myself. Tiers don't really matter very much until high/top level, and we see low/mid level players succeeding with really any character. But at the top level of play, Luigi just struggles too much.

 

[Th3 Ice King]

We shall see sir, we shall see. High tiers tend to get all the attention and will have discovered more on the character because of time invested by a high quantity of players. I may just be blowing smoke or have a case of blind faith in the character I chose to play, but after the year 20xx there will be a Luigi Reckoning. I can feel it in my bones.

 

[BluEG]

There is a lot of advanced Luigi tech that the top Luigis (other than Abate) have yet to start implementing.

There is also some new tech that I discovered recently and some new tech that Verda Stelo discovered. Here is not the time and place to reveal either, they would each need their own respective thread. Know that the limit of Luigi has not yet been pushed, heck, possibly our most useful advanced tech (pivot forward tilt) is entirely unused. (It's really ****ing hard to perform consistently.) one day my friends...one day. Luigi is hard

 

[sskylann]

There is a lot of advanced Luigi tech that the top Luigis (other than Abate) have yet to start implementing.

There is also some new tech that I discovered recently and some new tech that Verda Stelo discovered. Here is not the time and place to reveal either, they would each need their own respective thread. Know that the limit of Luigi has not yet been pushed, heck, possibly our most useful advanced tech (pivot forward tilt) is entirely unused. (It's really ****ing hard to perform consistently.) one day my friends...one day. Luigi is hard

Ummm... when are we going to here about this new tech? I'm anxious to hear about it. I agree that pivot forward tilt is really difficult, and underused. I think every top Luigi would benefit from it quite a bit.

 

[Dapplegonger]

There is a lot of advanced Luigi tech that the top Luigis (other than Abate) have yet to start implementing.

There is also some new tech that I discovered recently and some new tech that Verda Stelo discovered. Here is not the time and place to reveal either, they would each need their own respective thread. Know that the limit of Luigi has not yet been pushed, heck, possibly our most useful advanced tech (pivot forward tilt) is entirely unused. (It's really ****ing hard to perform consistently.) one day my friends...one day. Luigi is hard

Wow. I am constantly amazed by the sheer amount of things we have yet to learn about this game. I don't know if it will be enough to make the character top tier and start a true Year of Luigi, but it is nice to hear that stuff like this is coming.

Interestingly enough, there is supposedly a new tech that is being hidden for Jigglypuff in Smash 4 by a top player (Serynder), which just so happens to be my main in that game. So now, I must wait patiently for the top players for my mains to start revealing their secrets to the masses so I can start using them.

Just wondering, will we see it performed possibly at Evo, or at least revealed after?

 

[BluEG]

Wow. I am constantly amazed by the sheer amount of things we have yet to learn about this game. I don't know if it will be enough to make the character top tier and start a true Year of Luigi, but it is nice to hear that stuff like this is coming.

Interestingly enough, there is supposedly a new tech that is being hidden for Jigglypuff in Smash 4 by a top player (Serynder), which just so happens to be my main in that game. So now, I must wait patiently for the top players for my mains to start revealing their secrets to the masses so I can start using them.

Just wondering, will we see it performed possibly at Evo, or at least revealed after?

I guess I can briefly describe each technique. Might as well as advance Luigi when we can!

The one I've been messing around with incorporates the 'platform warp' technique you might already be familiar with. If you start a platform warp close to the middle of a platform then hold the joy stick in either horizontal direction, you can use any aerial and have it instantly edge-cancel when the hit boxes come out.

Most useful for random movement (low commitment hitbox) and reading tech rolls on platform with a 0-lag nair.

http://gfycat.com/SlimyForsakenGelada#



What Verda Stlo discovered is that Luigi can wavedash BACK onto a platform after edgecancelling any aerial

The two techniques can be performed in tandem to some awesome effect. (Edgecancelling Nair -> wavedash Uptilt -> punish -> etc)

 

[TRYHARD86]

Thanks for all the awesome tips!!!!!!

 

[Th3 Ice King]

Yeah No joke, I have practice to do!

 

[Dapplegonger]

Ice King, I'd suggest going through this video and perfecting that stuff before moving on to anything mentioned in here. From the looks of it, the stuff BluEG mentioned is crazy difficult in comparison to the stuff in the video, and probably won't make a difference until top levels of play.

 

[BluEG]

Master your fundamentals before experimentation with advanced techniques. The ones I posted above are not intuitive at all...still not sure how To best utilize them.

 

[BatSox]

BluEG, I played around with the platform warp nairs for a while. I haven't looked at frame data yet, but I have to say I'm not convinced that the hitbox even makes it out before the animation is cancelled. Or maybe the hitbox stays below the platform? If that's the case, I don't know what it could be that useful for.

The other interesting new tech that was discussed is the edge cancel -> waveland immediately. Does anyone know if you can waveland back on without using your second jump?

 

[Blea Gelo]

i think 2016 cooould b the year of luigi. to late for 2015 i think

 

[EarthCrash]

With the character still having untapped potential, Abate's and Eddy Mexico's placements in CEO and EVO, respectfully, and adding on to the fact that Dr. Mario is being less and less used by the Top Players, I do see the Luigi Metagame getting the spotlight soon.

 

[BluEG]

BluEG, I played around with the platform warp nairs for a while. I haven't looked at frame data yet, but I have to say I'm not convinced that the hitbox even makes it out before the animation is cancelled. Or maybe the hitbox stays below the platform? If that's the case, I don't know what it could be that useful for.

The other interesting new tech that was discussed is the edge cancel -> waveland immediately. Does anyone know if you can waveland back on without using your second jump?

Yes, the hitbox does come out. Have tested on a 20xx set up to confirm. I don't know what it's useful for yet either :/ still experimenting. It seems good to me chiefly because it requires almost 0-commitment. The hit box comes out and the lag is canceled immediately. There's gotta be some applications out there!

And yes, you can waveland without double jumping. You have to waveland almost immediately after edge canceling (maybe a 4-5 frame delay), it's sweet.

 

[BatSox]

While we're on the topic of cool luigi tech, I've been experimenting with this.
https://gfycat.com/ImpressionablePastClingfish

Sorry for the low quality (video, not game play :-D)

 

[Thomdore]

@ Batsox, I think there are better options too punish a rest at 85%. Was cool too watch tho. Vududash->Hit the opponent with the fireball at max distance on opposite platform->WL on the other platform and UpB. That's a swag way too kill.

 

[BatSox]

@ Batsox, I think there are better options too punish a rest at 85%. Was cool too watch tho. Vududash->Hit the opponent with the fireball at max distance on opposite platform->WL on the other platform and UpB. That's a swag way too kill.

I experimented for a while. At really low percents you can just throw the fireball lower. It's probably a good idea to release the fireball lower anyway...

I would still imagine that this is close to impossible to land if someone knows its coming.