Why am I better at Doubles than Singles?

[TacoLord9000]

It's one of those few things that I have noticed after having played many singles and doubles matches. I have found this to be true in both my melee and pm games. Also other people have commented that I am better in doubles than I am in singles.
When I was playingand my teammate was playing we beat people that were playing high tiers, now this could just be because they sucked at doubles but I LIKE TO THINK I'M GOOD OK?
In PM me and my teammate both went and beat a team of players who are both better than us in singles. One of whom is Blast who has a ridiculously good . Look at this if you don't believe me https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmhiRO46gyw

The reason why I might be better is that I have better grasp of the positioning of the players (including my teammate) than most people. Also the characters I play might be better in doubles than they are in singles. However neither of these answers satisfy me completely, perhaps it will always be a mystery to me.

 

[Flippy Flippersen]

It is a lot harder to punish characters for their flaws when there is a partner covering up said flaws. (even if said characters also has an insane amount of flaws) At least for melee it makes sense that your unfortunate character taste benefits a lot from this. The team of blast and the unknown player could also simply be better at singles than at teams. (singles are easier to practice after all) Alternatively you and your partner have prior experience teaming with each other in different games and have better teamwork than other players who don't do team related things that often. There's a lot of reasons and I don't think you'll find the concrete answer you're looking for just by posting it on a forum.

 

[TacoLord9000]

It is a lot harder to punish characters for their flaws when there is a partner covering up said flaws. (even if said characters also has an insane amount of flaws) At least for melee it makes sense that your unfortunate character taste benefits a lot from this. The team of blast and the unknown player could also simply be better at singles than at teams. (singles are easier to practice after all) Alternatively you and your partner have prior experience teaming with each other in different games and have better teamwork than other players who don't do team related things that often. There's a lot of reasons and I don't think you'll find the concrete answer you're looking for just by posting it on a forum.

Maybe that's why I benefit from doubles because I am rewarded for my "unfortunate character taste" by having Zelda's flaws masked by a good partner while at the same time the opponents still suffer from matchup inexperience against Zelda since no one plays her. You would be surprised how far matchup inexperience can carry you in a tournament, I actually tied for fifth in my first tournament two days ago most likely due to this factor.

 

[EPsilon933]

You main Zelda

She spaces toes. They do KOs. She never combos

Zelda can't edge guard. Edge guards are a bit less of a thing in 2v2s since partners can interrupt edge guarders

Zelda can't recover in 1v1. She's better in 2v2 since her partner can interrupt an opponent edge guarding her. She recovers far. 2v2 is where she puts it to good use

 

[TacoLord9000]

You main Zelda

She spaces toes. They do KOs. She never combos

Zelda can't edge guard. Edge guards are a bit less of a thing in 2v2s since partners can interrupt edge guarders

Zelda can't recover in 1v1. She's better in 2v2 since her partner can interrupt an opponent edge guarding her. She recovers far. 2v2 is where she puts it to good use

F-tilt to bair is technically a combo at certain percents with certain characters. Same thing with Down throw if the opponent has bad DI.

 

[EPsilon933]

F-tilt to bair is technically a combo at certain percents with certain characters. Same thing with Down throw if the opponent has bad DI.

I was exaggerating. She has a few short combos, but her combo game is mostly nonexistent

 

[TacoLord9000]

I was exaggerating. She has a few short combos, but her combo game is mostly nonexistent

Are you a former Zelda main? Because you sound like one with the way you completely trash her viability. The funny thing is that I more I play Zelda the more I complain about how bad she is and the further I put her down on my own personal tier list. She is currently in last place on mine. Even Kirby is better than her.

 

[EPsilon933]

Are you a former Zelda main?

Yes

Because you sound like one with the way you completely trash her viability. The funny thing is that I more I play Zelda the more I complain about how bad she is and the further I put her down on my own personal tier list. She is currently in last place on mine. Even Kirby is better than her.

I wouldn't rate her that low. She definitely has at least a few winning match ups against the lowers tiers (Bowser, Mewtwo, MG&W, Roy, Ness)

 

[The_Most_Effectual]

I think this is another reason that we should devote more resources into doubles as a community. Tier lists and character matchup are grossly unexplored, except among the top tiers. If you are better at doubles just continue to play it! Doubles is a dying art and the more people that play it, the better. I can only imagine that you will get a lot better at singles through doubles.

 

[TacoLord9000]

I think this is another reason that we should devote more resources into doubles as a community. Tier lists and character matchup are grossly unexplored, except among the top tiers. If you are better at doubles just continue to play it! Doubles is a dying art and the more people that play it, the better. I can only imagine that you will get a lot better at singles through doubles.

Yeah the doubles metagame is quite unexplored, but I swear people don't really take doubles seriously. We always praise Melee as having a lot of depth to it, yet we put single over doubles in terms of importance even though doubles has more depth to it. It doesn't really make any sense if you think about it. Unfortunately I haven't really been able to play doubles anytime recently since everyone always wants to get better at singles when the community gets together every weekend.

 

[EPsilon933]

1v1 is just easier

With 2v2, there's more to observe, so watching it isn't as easily enjoyable for the spectators. For the players, there's more chaos they have to play through. Also, working with a partner is just an extra hassle. Having a consistent partner makes it a little bit more difficult. In 2v2, too much of the skill is about individual player skill rather than teamwork. Unlike in FPSs, there are no call outs to share information and coordinate teammates. Players just play the game and hope that their actions can work well with each other's. Besides, making call outs right next to your opponents would tell them exactly what your team is planning (I used pessimistic wording in this paragraph. Just making it clear)

 

[The_Most_Effectual]

1v1 is just easier

With 2v2, there's more to observe, so watching it isn't as easily enjoyable for the spectators. For the players, there's more chaos they have to play through. Also, working with a partner is just an extra hassle. Having a consistent partner makes it a little bit more difficult. In 2v2, too much of the skill is about individual player skill rather than teamwork. Unlike in FPSs, there are no call outs to share information and coordinate teammates. Players just play the game and hope that their actions can work well with each other's. Besides, making call outs right next to your opponents would tell them exactly what your team is planning (I used pessimistic wording in this paragraph. Just making it clear)

All very true. I'm simply fascinated by the idea of taking the game that we all love and multiplying the number of possible situations exponentially. It's something that might never be explored before the lifespan of Melee ends, which is a sad thought.

 

[TacoLord9000]

All very true. I'm simply fascinated by the idea of taking the game that we all love and multiplying the number of possible situations exponentially. It's something that might never be explored before the lifespan of Melee ends, which is a sad thought.

If the melee community mostly comes to an end, I'll still play it in my house even if it is just against the CPU. Even if we will have less members than the Smash 64 community currently has now, I think we will still survive even if we are forgotten by most people. I don't think there will ever be a smash game like Melee again, so I think people will still come back to play it even if the games are no longer streamed or watched by anyone but us.

 

[Slurzen]

you're the modern isai, who never really tried in singles

 

[TacoLord9000]

you're the modern isai, who never really tried in singles

Well Isai did try once when he destroyed Ken in that one tournament.
Isai is probably my favorite smash player of all time along with Axe. Isai while long retired from melee still enjoys playing smash 64 and I love seeing what he can do in that game.

If I can get a good consistent partner to work with maybe I can start owning noobs in double tournaments. However that's easier said than done considering I also need to put significant effort in developing my high tier characters. My Zelda is pretty good and I can definitely hold my own in doubles but at higher levels of play this will not work and this is why I need to develop a character like who is one of the better characters in doubles if I truly want my goal of being a great doubles player to come to fruition.