I recently noticed PPMD's comment on Smash 4's competitive viability in which he expressed it as a game that is extremely shallow citing Melee's options to play the game at differing speeds vs the inability to do so in Smash 4. I'm wondering what constitutes a game with proper depth. What is Smash 4's depth? How exactly do Custom moves factor into this?
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What is Depth?
- Thread starter Neoleo21
- Start date
Pyr
Smash Lord
For me, Depth is Yomi. How far can the Yomi of a game go? For Smash 4, it goes rather deep. Custom moves will only add layers to Yomi both pre, and during, a match.
I will say that game speed =/= depth, and comparing 4 to Melee is like comparing SF to KoF. They're different games with the same base fundamentals.
I will say that game speed =/= depth, and comparing 4 to Melee is like comparing SF to KoF. They're different games with the same base fundamentals.
ATH_
Smash Ace
Depth is the game's difference between mastering and beginning. A game like Melee and Smash 4 have very good depth because they are easy to pick up and be a beginner since all buttons will do something. However, the games are very hard to master because of all of the factors that leads into them
A game that is easy to pick up but is hard to master has extreme depth.
A game that is easy to pick up but is hard to master has extreme depth.
ぱみゅ
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You can'r define depth based on speed alone.
There are millions of factors, and in this game most of them are more passive rather than active, and that's a different kind of depth than just Yomi.
Yomi is about interaction between players.
This game allows players to learn the other players, characters, mechanics, STAGES, and if pushed hard enough, even Custom Moves. Knowing them and begin using them to your advantage, is a very different kid of depth.
There are millions of factors, and in this game most of them are more passive rather than active, and that's a different kind of depth than just Yomi.
Yomi is about interaction between players.
This game allows players to learn the other players, characters, mechanics, STAGES, and if pushed hard enough, even Custom Moves. Knowing them and begin using them to your advantage, is a very different kid of depth.
Raijinken
Smash Master
Depth doesn't determine how good a game is at any level (else most sports really wouldn't be that "good" and games like Dota would be the epitome of design, neither of which is objectively true), though it certainly helps keep people's attention.
That said, Smash4's depth is partially limited by rulesets. Custom moves add these options that so many people like, yet due to their hidden status, many players shun an excellent source of variety. Stage selection also limits depth. Strategies change significantly between hazards, walkoffs, flatplats, and so on. And yet ancient customs dictate the trend and lock us out of certain varieties of play just because they have elements that were considered "uncompetitive" in past iterations of the series. Heck, random and min-max based as it is, Equipment could add extra depth if we were willing to go to such extents.
There's a lot of base-level depth, and there's room for more if we want to adopt rules that let us use it.
Also, as someone studying Japanese, I always love it when people use "Yomi" as their definition of depth. Since in Japanese, that means "Reading". Which Smash4 has plenty of.
That said, Smash4's depth is partially limited by rulesets. Custom moves add these options that so many people like, yet due to their hidden status, many players shun an excellent source of variety. Stage selection also limits depth. Strategies change significantly between hazards, walkoffs, flatplats, and so on. And yet ancient customs dictate the trend and lock us out of certain varieties of play just because they have elements that were considered "uncompetitive" in past iterations of the series. Heck, random and min-max based as it is, Equipment could add extra depth if we were willing to go to such extents.
There's a lot of base-level depth, and there's room for more if we want to adopt rules that let us use it.
Also, as someone studying Japanese, I always love it when people use "Yomi" as their definition of depth. Since in Japanese, that means "Reading". Which Smash4 has plenty of.