VS Pikachu - Matchup Discussion and Analysis

[A_Kae]

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Pikachu Matchup Thread

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[Zio~]

I believe marth has an little bit of advantage because of the range he has, just a few days ago I played against a really good pikachu, this pikachu beat hard a friend that was using MK, he plays way better than me, but when it was my turn to fight that pika I was able to space myself easily, was really hard for pika to land any kill move.
The only thing that could mess a marth with pika is his neutral B, but with perfect shields will be enough to overcome the neutral game with him.
I could be totally wrong so please correct me if I am

 

[Pugwest]

We lose 70:30

Pika can combo us from 0-50% off one u-tilt string, has no problem punishing us with a kill move and we can't even hit the guy half the time.

I say it's top 3 worst from my experiences.

 

[Coro_]

Hi, Marth boards~

A Marth/Lucina who knows what he's doing can be a real pain to fight, given how badly he outranges Pikachu. An aggressive Pikachu can be easily denied space with those swords, and Pika's lack of a decent kill confirm can have the Marth/Lucina living to pretty high percentages with rage, which coupled with their far earlier kills can spell the end of a stock for Pika on a single mistake.
Marth/Lucina can have issues dealing with Tjolt if used sparingly, since their options are to shield/perfect shield, stand in place and counter, or jump over, all of which Pika can capitalize on (we can run behind the jolt to go for grabs if we're baiting a shield, jump and challenge in the air if you jump, or wait and punish if you counter.) It's a bit of a guessing game in that way, and with Pika, guessing wrong can lead to taking a lot of damage from a string.
Quick Attack can be pretty problematic to Marth/Lucina, since it goes so fast it's pretty hard to punish on reaction. Still, if the Pika is using it too much, sticking a big hitbox out like fair can disrupt Pika. If used sparingly and strategically though, Marth/Lucina pretty much have no answers to it, yeah.
In the air Marth/Lucina beats Pika with range most of the time (for instance, we can't fair if you fair), but Pika's aerial hitboxes tend to linger (fair, dair, bair) and we have the extremely fast and disjointed uair, so it's up to the Marth/Lucina to space properly or be destroyed.
Overall, it's pretty much in Pika's favour, but Marth/Lucina can stand a decent chance if they capitalize on a Pika's mistakes, since a few wrong moves and it's goodbye to the lightweight yellow mouse.

 

[Vipermoon]

I want to add that Pikachu is really hard to hit for Marth. His hitboxes issues really come alive against specifically Pikachu.

Marth's lack of lingering hitboxes is precisely why he doesn't have reliable answers to Quick Attack.

Pika's Fair on stage can actually be really good in the MU because of the burst range. But you're right, it's easy to challenge. Bair is an effective edgeguard against Marth's linear recovery but of course you are always taking a risk when off-stage with Marth.

Pika's Fsmash and Usmash are mostly safe on shield drop and they work well against Marth.

Jab, however, will outrange most of Pikachu's stuff and even stuff approaches. Worth mentioning.

I currently think this is 60/40 Pika wins but if I could watch high level play of this MU (not sure it even exists) I could be swayed to 55/45.

 

[RespectingOpinions]

Yeah this matchup is bad for Marth. The big things for me is how much damage output he has compared to us, his neutral B, and quick attack. Quick attack is so stupid good against Marth, Pikachu can weave in and out of any pressure situations Marth can put on him. Not to mention Pikachu is ridiculously good on Battlefield, so Marth loses his best overall stage.

 

[Langston777]

why would you ever put yourself through this match up honestly

just go ike, you can't miss with ike

 

[Pugwest]

Forgot to mention Pikachu can gimp us with b-air, kinda like Luigi Nado only its not that bad.

Yeah f this mu

 

[DariusM27]

Need help! Pikachu keeps dthrowing me into thunder bolt (down b). Is it possible to Di out of that throw consistently?

 

[Ako.]

pickachu players i played told me to di left or right. P.S. i thought it was up throw to up b

 

[DariusM27]

pickachu players i played told me to di left or right. P.S. i thought it was up throw to up b

That might be it, Idk

 

[Vipermoon]

Pikachu has both Dthrow to thunder and Uthrow to thunder.

 

[DariusM27]

And both can be avoided with di?

 

[Vipermoon]

And both can be avoided with di?

They both can but all Pikachu has to do is chase that DI while also chasing any air dodges or jumps you do

 

[DariusM27]

They both can but all Pikachu has to do is chase that DI while also chasing any air dodges or jumps you do

So I hit the lab with a friend. Turns out you want to always di the direction Pikachu is facing, because if you di toward Pikachu you will go straight up.

Also, the window to di can be very small if Pikachu grabs you and throws you quickly, so you probably want to mash your di rapidly, and even then you might miss it if your timing is off.

 

[Vipermoon]

So I hit the lab with a friend. Turns out you want to always di the direction Pikachu is facing, because if you di toward Pikachu you will go straight up.

Also, the window to di can be very small if Pikachu grabs you and throws you quickly, so you probably want to mash your di rapidly, and even then you might miss it if your timing is off.

Yeah Dthrow does normally put you in front, it's an 80 degree angle http://kuroganehammer.com/Smash4/Pikachu
Next time use this but cool that you checked it out. It shows Dthrow is 80 and Uthrow is 90. Also you don't mash DI you just hold it. But you have to think further. The Pika player expects you to DI away (or not DI at all) for Dthrow so they might jump forward out of habit when you actually DI backwards (straight up)! It's a mixup, you don't only want to DI the correct way if you know what I mean.

 

[Jenna Zant]

HI guys, Pikachu main here. I don't know what's up with this matchup, but I have a Marth main friend I just can't beat. He doesn't have a wii u, so he can only practice at my house, however nowadays I can't seem to beat him for the life of me. What I've noticed is that he'll work on perfect shielding all of my approaches, and he'll use fsmashes to keep me away from him. It's truly a waiting game with him. I can't really approach, because he'll just find a way to get me out of it. I don't know if it's good or not, but he often uses counter in the middle of what I thought to be air-tight combos, or as a read for another way to approach. I'd say it's more 40:60 in Pika's favor, as you have the right tools to keep us away for a while, but ultimately we'll find a way through, as Marth can't cover every option. Basically, what you can do is stay out of the way of our attacks with your tippers and range, as well as using counter to break out of Pikachu's combos, but make sure you don't become readable. Mix it up with an airdodge or a nair, as you'll get away with using counter. Pikachu's projectile will be a problem if you can't perfect shield it well, so lab that out. That's all I really know for you guys.

 

[DariusM27]

HI guys, Pikachu main here. I don't know what's up with this matchup, but I have a Marth main friend I just can't beat. He doesn't have a wii u, so he can only practice at my house, however nowadays I can't seem to beat him for the life of me. What I've noticed is that he'll work on perfect shielding all of my approaches, and he'll use fsmashes to keep me away from him. It's truly a waiting game with him. I can't really approach, because he'll just find a way to get me out of it. I don't know if it's good or not, but he often uses counter in the middle of what I thought to be air-tight combos, or as a read for another way to approach. I'd say it's more 40:60 in Pika's favor, as you have the right tools to keep us away for a while, but ultimately we'll find a way through, as Marth can't cover every option. Basically, what you can do is stay out of the way of our attacks with your tippers and range, as well as using counter to break out of Pikachu's combos, but make sure you don't become readable. Mix it up with an airdodge or a nair, as you'll get away with using counter. Pikachu's projectile will be a problem if you can't perfect shield it well, so lab that out. That's all I really know for you guys.

Thanks alot!

 

[Ark of Silence101]

This why I prefer Lucina in the Falcon/Pikachu MU, she has a better time than Marth.