Meta Video Analysis Thread (New Video)

[Koby_T]

Hey all!

Welcome to the Link board’s Video Metagame Analysis thread! This thread will serve as a place for us to discuss metagame using an analysis of relevant gameplay. So this is how it works:

· A video that is considered high level play is posted in the OP​

· The video will be changed every 2 weeks (Subject to change depending on discussion activity).​

o Personally message me your video nominations. I will discuss the nominations with members before queuing them for the next round.
​

· Old videos and analyses will be placed in the spoilers below when the OP is updated​

Video Nominations

Ideally the videos being discussed should be in the category of some of the highest level play we have recorded; however, minimum requirements are similar to our requirements to the video critique thread:

-1v1 with competitive rules

-2v2 with competitive rules may be considered with sufficient request

-Online games will rarely be considered for discussion and For Glory almost never

-I need to be able to ascertain from the video or nomination: the date of the match, player names, tournament or friendly, and offline or online​

RULES

1) Discussion should range from breaking down the Link’s general strategy to more specific things, like how he won the neutral at whatever timestamp.

2) A key component of your analysis should include explicitly how the player executed whatever strategy (i.e. “He maintained great spacing through the match” is not a worthwhile contribution without an explanation of how he did it).

a. Regardless of whether you’re analyzing the whole match or 10 seconds of round 2, be thorough.
​

3) For the sake of clarity, timestamps are very strongly recommended for your analysis. (Or do a narrated analysis!)

4) This is not a video critique. Discussion should only take a turn towards “What the player should have done” if a detailed explanation is given that provides a substantial learning moment for anyone involved in the discussion. (i.e. He could have utilted instead of jabbed because…blah blah….was more optimal there because…blah blah blah).​

Hopefully this will bring a visual connection to all of our metagame discussions.

====================================================================================

Here's a sample of the kind of discussion we are looking for:

Spoiler

3:56 & 4:10:
-Kirin sets up zone over half of FD
-Consciously lets Charizard onto the stage. A couple reasons this is a good idea:
1) Link is a stock up and at potential kill percent. Charizard is moderately difficult to gimp and at low percent. Risk of being thrown off stage ≠ benefit of damage output while ledgeguarding
2) In my opinion, Link's damage output potential is higher when controlling center stage than when ledgeguarding. This is intensified by strings available to him at low to medium percent. (Disclaimer: This is also MU dependent. Against zone-breakers or characters with 'meh' recoveries I would likely attempt the ledge guard until high percent at least.)

3:56 & 4:10 Zone Breakdown

1) Bomb U-toss (~2.5s of hang time)
2a) Rang since opponent wasn't approaching
2b) Nair to hold opponent in bomb's descent
*opponent roll-away
3) Approaching Rang/Zair

*Watching this zone unfold makes me think that Zair would've been preferred to Rang at 4:10 to avoid lag but also control the same approximate zone. Alternatively, fadeaway Rang may have worked better for maintaining spacing. Or we could just bail all together and reset neutral since the bomb is covering our retreat. What are our options in this situation to keep up the pressure? Is there definitively a best option?

4:34:
Zone Breakdown

SH> U-toss> DJ Bomb pull > F-toss> Rang

I like this zone setup because it effectively walls out aerial options without using Rang and allows for a moderately safe landing. This zone forces a grounded approach option or a retreat. Not bad vs Charizard but would be even better against characters who have strong aerial approaches. Two crucial things to execute this zone:
1) The SH
2) Bomb pull prior to the SH
A FH in the beginning would have put Link too high at the time of his F-throw. This would have given the bomb too high of a trajectory to affect aerial approaches and also given up more ground to an approaching opponent before Link could land safely.

==================================================================================

SlayerZ (Peach) vs Scizor (Link)

Fire&Dice Monthly 2 - Jul 3, 2015

Relevant MU threads:
Link vs Peach
<No MU for Link on Peach boards>

*Note* Smash Version 1.0.9 in this video (See patch notes)

===================================================================================

 

[Koby_T]

Old Videos

HoM@LoN (Charizard) vs Kirinblaze (Link) (Starts at 2:26)

Smash Attack 3 - SSB4 Singles Bracket
2/8/2015

Relevant MU threads:
<No MU for Charizard on either character's boards>
Link vs R.O.B.


*Note* Smash Version 1.0.4 in this video (See patch notes)

Spoiler

Fox is Openly Deceptive:

2:40- He back throws and reads the double jump by doing a FH Fair. This puts a lot of pressure on the opponent and is a good example of controlling the stage; the pressure situation was not capitalised on further but it ensured a safe retreat. Something similar is seen later on at 2:49 when he reads the DJ and keeps him off-stage with Zair. Really good stage control.

2:42- After throwing a bomb up close on Charizard's shield he knew that Link's best option in this situation is to simply create more space between Link and Charizard; this is because Link's moves are too slow and would be beaten by a grab OoS not to mention that they would be unsafe on shield at this point still, so instead he dashed away and in this case used boomerang, though something like F-tilt once at a good distance would have also been a good idea. The point to make here is that you don't always have to feel like you must spotdodge or roll in this kind of situation because you feel the grab is coming; often just dashing away will suffice and you'll retain control of your character. A lot of Link's game involves playing around people's shield game in a safe way.
Also recognising the FH Fair follow up was good too.

6:19- He sees the Charizard coming and adjusts his spacing with a dash away JC throw backwards. This is far superior to either just throwing it immediately or trying to jump away in this situation as it forces the opponent into their shield and spaces you out of range of their OoS options.

6:22- He sees the shield up and instead of going for an obvious grab, he jumps straight through and Nairs which keeps him safe from being punished, covers the roll away option and gets him out of being boxed into the corner giving him control of the stage again. While he could have gone for an option to read and punish a spotdodge, a roll would have meant that he'd still be under pressure from being boxed in.
Dammit DF mentioned it too.

7:23 and 7:47- you'll notice he lands a boomerang and it's just spaced enough to make Charizard want to grab but the shield pushback was just enough to make it too far away to actually get him. From this distance Kirin feels safe to throw out some Jabs which would have been fine regardless of whether the Charizard was smart enough to hold shield or not because Charizard's options OoS won't reach from there. Even with the nerfed Jab 1, throwing one or two jabs in this situation is fine imo. Even immediately after at 7:49 when Charizard goes for the F-smash, while Kirin rolled in this case, a Jab would have worked just fine. It's possible that Kirin was expecting a rock smash after conditioning the Charizard to expect the jab because a shield drop rock smash would super armor through it and at that distance a roll behind the rock smash would avoid it (any more distance and I'd recommend grabbing instead or just dashing away if you expect a rock smash.

12:35- He sees the missed tech and dashes in to close the distance and goes into shield. Because ROB was on the edge of the stage this covers every single option and we can see here that he reacts to the roll towards him with an U-smash OoS for good damage.

Dumbfire:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=95&v=KqjcZ4QWB5o

 

[Koby_T]

Also saved because reasons.

 

[Dumbfire]

Here's my contribution, a little rushed and confused in places (I somehow thought Kirin won game 1 and lost game 2, oops), but it'll be better in the future:

(I really don't feel like typing everything out, this is way easier.)

 

[Koby_T]

Here's my contribution, a little rushed and confused in places (I somehow thought Kirin won game 1 and lost game 2, oops), but it'll be better in the future:


(I really don't feel like typing everything out, this is way easier.)

One thing you mentioned jumped out at me and brought up a question. You mentioned the arrow not being a great projectile. I'm not aware of changes to the bow since this match but what would you say are the uses for bow in Link's everyday spam game? How would you define its purpose when setting up a zone? Or is it mostly/entirely outclassed by the utility the bomb/rang provide?


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3:56 & 4:10:
-Kirin sets up zone over half of FD
-Consciously lets Charizard onto the stage. A couple reasons this is a good idea:
1) Link is a stock up and at potential kill percent. Charizard is moderately difficult to gimp and at low percent. Risk of being thrown off stage ≠ benefit of damage output while ledgeguarding
2) In my opinion, Link's damage output potential is higher when controlling center stage than when ledgeguarding. This is intensified by strings available to him at low to medium percent. (Disclaimer: This is also MU dependent. Against zone-breakers or characters with 'meh' recoveries I would likely attempt the ledge guard until high percent at least.)

3:56 & 4:10 Zone Breakdown

1) Bomb U-toss (~2.5s of hang time)
2a) Rang since opponent wasn't approaching
2b) Nair to hold opponent in bomb's descent
*opponent roll-away
3) Approaching Rang/Zair

*Watching this zone unfold makes me think that Zair would've been preferred to Rang at 4:10 to avoid lag but also control the same approximate zone. Alternatively, fadeaway Rang may have worked better for maintaining spacing. Or we could just bail all together and reset neutral since the bomb is covering our retreat. What are our options in this situation to keep up the pressure? Is there definitively a best option?

4:34:
Zone Breakdown

SH> U-toss> DJ Bomb pull > F-toss> Rang

I like this zone setup because it effectively walls out aerial options without using Rang and allows for a moderately safe landing. This zone forces a grounded approach option or a retreat. Not bad vs Charizard but would be even better against characters who have strong aerial approaches. Two crucial things to execute this zone:
1) The SH
2) Bomb pull prior to the SH
A FH in the beginning would have put Link too high at the time of his F-throw. This would have given the bomb too high of a trajectory to affect aerial approaches and also given up more ground to an approaching opponent before Link could land safely.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Reviving the thread now that testing for the last patch has ended. I'll leave this one up for one more week before looking for a more recent video.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

I totally forgot about this.

Ok so this is going to be difficult because I'm so used to seeing the negatives in everything but I guess I'll try.
I'll avoid repeating what has already been said by DF and Koby, but just know that I agree with them (from memory).

2:40- He back throws and reads the double jump by doing a FH Fair. This puts a lot of pressure on the opponent and is a good example of controlling the stage; the pressure situation was not capitalised on further but it ensured a safe retreat. Something similar is seen later on at 2:49 when he reads the DJ and keeps him off-stage with Zair. Really good stage control.

2:42- After throwing a bomb up close on Charizard's shield he knew that Link's best option in this situation is to simply create more space between Link and Charizard; this is because Link's moves are too slow and would be beaten by a grab OoS not to mention that they would be unsafe on shield at this point still, so instead he dashed away and in this case used boomerang, though something like F-tilt once at a good distance would have also been a good idea. The point to make here is that you don't always have to feel like you must spotdodge or roll in this kind of situation because you feel the grab is coming; often just dashing away will suffice and you'll retain control of your character. A lot of Link's game involves playing around people's shield game in a safe way.
Also recognising the FH Fair follow up was good too.

6:19- He sees the Charizard coming and adjusts his spacing with a dash away JC throw backwards. This is far superior to either just throwing it immediately or trying to jump away in this situation as it forces the opponent into their shield and spaces you out of range of their OoS options.

6:22- He sees the shield up and instead of going for an obvious grab, he jumps straight through and Nairs which keeps him safe from being punished, covers the roll away option and gets him out of being boxed into the corner giving him control of the stage again. While he could have gone for an option to read and punish a spotdodge, a roll would have meant that he'd still be under pressure from being boxed in.
Dammit DF mentioned it too.

7:23 and 7:47- you'll notice he lands a boomerang and it's just spaced enough to make Charizard want to grab but the shield pushback was just enough to make it too far away to actually get him. From this distance Kirin feels safe to throw out some Jabs which would have been fine regardless of whether the Charizard was smart enough to hold shield or not because Charizard's options OoS won't reach from there. Even with the nerfed Jab 1, throwing one or two jabs in this situation is fine imo. Even immediately after at 7:49 when Charizard goes for the F-smash, while Kirin rolled in this case, a Jab would have worked just fine. It's possible that Kirin was expecting a rock smash after conditioning the Charizard to expect the jab because a shield drop rock smash would super armor through it and at that distance a roll behind the rock smash would avoid it (any more distance and I'd recommend grabbing instead or just dashing away if you expect a rock smash.

12:35- He sees the missed tech and dashes in to close the distance and goes into shield. Because ROB was on the edge of the stage this covers every single option and we can see here that he reacts to the roll towards him with an U-smash OoS for good damage.

 

[Dumbfire]

One thing you mentioned jumped out at me and brought up a question. You mentioned the arrow not being a great projectile. I'm not aware of changes to the bow since this match but what would you say are the uses for bow in Link's everyday spam game? How would you define its purpose when setting up a zone? Or is it mostly/entirely outclassed by the utility the bomb/rang provide?

Inspired by Kirin and Hyrule Hero I have been using them more. I will get back to it some day.

 

[Koby_T]

New video! Thought it might be good to take a look at a match in which the Link actually loses. I'll edit my contribution into this post. Remember that the latest patch isn't showcased in this match!

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Copied the link from the OP for convenience.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byHUSJ2wEoI

0:47- Notice that he holds on to his bomb instead of throwing it almost immediately. He's looking for the best opportunity to throw it. If he had thrown it down out of the FH it would have achieved nothing as he saw the shield was up. Throwing bombs at shields isn't that great unless they're cooked if you'll remember because a non-powershielded bomb becomes immediately inactive to the one who shielded and will not detect their hurtbox and will only explode when the fuse runs out. Instead he opts to fast fall and throw it forwards and was unlucky not to hit Peach out of the roll. The point is, effective use of bombs; don't just waste them. (Again at 1:29)

0:55- Retreating SH Fair FF. Throwing it out just in case Peach approached. It can be a fairly safe spacing tool and at 0% could have started a combo.

1:04- Nice Tether to Ledge Jump to DJ Dair. He knows that even if he doesn't hit Peach, out of the DJ at that height the Dair will land laglessly if he doesn't fast fall (he fast falled right at the end at 1:41 and just look at what happens), but then when he does connect the Dair, the pogo gives him more time in the air which allows him to fast fall and still land laglessly. The lagless Dair often catches people off-guard if they don't know the matchup.

1:33- Alright let's just review this situation real quick. Peach has a Bob-omb and you're recovering. He uses airdodge thinking that maybe he'll tether while holding the bomb but then backs out when he sees Peach get in place to cover that option. He has a bomb so he can use two Up-B's if he needs to, but then seeing the Bob-omb already dropped he recovers immediately while hugging the stage. As risky as this situation is, keep in mind that if you hit the Bob-omb that Peach is holding, unlike our bombs, it will explode because it has an active hurtbox while being held. So anything, e.g. an arrow, boomerang, bomb, Zair, if you hit the bob-omb Peach is getting blown up. Worth keeping in mind.

1:54- Opting to FF airdodge to the ledge. Smart.

2:23- Nair to Dash attack is pretty legit just in general.

2:37- Clearly baiting an option he can punish. Nice and patient, not like the F-smash at 1:51. Walk away F-tilt is so much better imo.

3:09- Having seen the trade, instead of trying to capitalise (and potentially failing to do so) he instead immediately resets to neutral and gets better stage positioning because he doesn't want to be on that platform or above Peach, and the switch of positions pays off for him. Stage control and positioning are often much more important than immediate potential damage. Knowing when to back off and reset is important.

3:40- This is a Link AT called 'Pick a Better Character'. Flawlessly executed. You can tell he's had a lot of practice; a lot lab time went into this one.

 

[Dumbfire]