Uses For Robin's Nosferatu?

Joined
Jan 19, 2019
Messages
51
Location
Canada
Switch FC
SW-2880-1949-8293
#1
I don't really use this move that often, but I feel like a command grab that heals you has to have at least a few uses. How do you like to use this move during gameplay?
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jul 4, 2015
Messages
53
Location
SoCal
NNID
GloryBlaze37
#2
Nosferatu is an excellent tool and an important part of Robin's kit. Notably, it's a command grab, meaning it works on shielding opponents.
What does this mean?

It's one of our best tools to approach an opponent on a platform above us. Being above another character makes you vulnerable. It's much easier for a grounded character to hit someone on a platform above them (up tilt, up smash, short hop aerials, etc) than for a character on a platform to hit a grounded character. However, most characters cannot hit an opponent on a platform above them who is shielding, as characters typically cannot grab while in the air. Therefore, when your opponent is on a platform above you and you jump at them, the most common reaction is going to be a shield. Nosferatu handily beats shields, doing hefty damage and healing Robin.

Nos is also great as a tomahawk grab. One of Robin's best approach options in neutral is to jump towards the opponent with a levin fair, as it's quite safe on shield if spaced correctly. If you do this enough during a match, the opponent will either keep getting hit and die (we win) or start reflexively reacting when they see you jump in. the most common option by far is that when you jump towards your opponent horizontally, they will shield in an attempt to either block or parry levin fair. This means that they are vulnerable to nosferatu. As soon as the opponent starts consistently shielding levin fair, jump at them and don't use fair at all. Instead, hit them with nosferatu as you land. We win.

As a side note, if they seem to develop a habit of spot dodging the levin fair instead of shielding it, don't use nosferatu. Instead, swing with levin fair like usual and if it whiffs, just land and start mashing A to jab. Levin fair has low enough landing lag (and jab is quick enough) that we'll typically catch the spot dodge. Again, we win.
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2019
Messages
51
Location
Canada
Switch FC
SW-2880-1949-8293
#3
Thank you for the tips and info :D
Didn't think of conditioning the opponent and using it as a mix up for a tomahawk grab before
 

SJMistery

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 18, 2016
Messages
346
3DS FC
0920-3611-4128
#4
It can be used for punishes, but it's best utility is the same as Smash 4: Just spam it until it runs out of chages, and then shoot the tome.
 

Avokha

A+B smash tech is my baby <3
Premium
Joined
Mar 23, 2015
Messages
562
Location
Corpus Christi, Texas
3DS FC
4914-3109-5720
NNID
Avokha00
#5
It can be used for punishes, but it's best utility is the same as Smash 4: Just spam it until it runs out of chages, and then shoot the tome.
I have never agreed with this tactic.

The utility of the spell is far too great to be wasted for a nerfed discard, as they no longer possess the kill power they once had. Robin is one of a select few characters that can condition opponents to stay in shield (via Levin sword and thunder spells) and then condition them back out of shield as we wish. Not only that, the psychological effects of landing Nosferatu is undeniable; dealing damage whilst at the same time healing even more can quite often put the opponent on tilt, especially if you are able to land the spell 3 times consecutively.
Discards happen all the time when playing robin, so there's really no reason at all to deliberately waste you're resources solely for a discard. You should just grab a discard when one occurs naturally if you want it.
 

SJMistery

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 18, 2016
Messages
346
3DS FC
0920-3611-4128
#6
I have never agreed with this tactic.

The utility of the spell is far too great to be wasted for a nerfed discard, as they no longer possess the kill power they once had. Robin is one of a select few characters that can condition opponents to stay in shield (via Levin sword and thunder spells) and then condition them back out of shield as we wish. Not only that, the psychological effects of landing Nosferatu is undeniable; dealing damage whilst at the same time healing even more can quite often put the opponent on tilt, especially if you are able to land the spell 3 times consecutively.
Discards happen all the time when playing robin, so there's really no reason at all to deliberately waste you're resources solely for a discard. You should just grab a discard when one occurs naturally if you want it.
To each his own. I find the stantard grab to be more practical due to, you know, not being unsafe on hit on half the cast.

And speaking of wich, there is any updated chart for the new knockback values and potential kill % of the tomes?
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2019
Messages
51
Location
Canada
Switch FC
SW-2880-1949-8293
#7
I have never agreed with this tactic.

The utility of the spell is far too great to be wasted for a nerfed discard, as they no longer possess the kill power they once had. Robin is one of a select few characters that can condition opponents to stay in shield (via Levin sword and thunder spells) and then condition them back out of shield as we wish. Not only that, the psychological effects of landing Nosferatu is undeniable; dealing damage whilst at the same time healing even more can quite often put the opponent on tilt, especially if you are able to land the spell 3 times consecutively.
Discards happen all the time when playing robin, so there's really no reason at all to deliberately waste you're resources solely for a discard. You should just grab a discard when one occurs naturally if you want it.
Although I think that wasting it for a tome isn't the best use of Nosferatu's potential either, aren't there some pretty early kill confirms from tome->thoron? Using nos for a discard might become a more viable strategy depending on how consistent those kill confirms turn out to be.
 
Last edited:

Avokha

A+B smash tech is my baby <3
Premium
Joined
Mar 23, 2015
Messages
562
Location
Corpus Christi, Texas
3DS FC
4914-3109-5720
NNID
Avokha00
#8
Although I think that wasting it for a tome isn't the best use of Nosferatu's potential either, aren't there some pretty early kill confirms from tome->thoron? Using nos for a discard might become a more viable strategy depending on how consistent those kill confirms turn out to be.
There are kill confirms with discards>thoron, and I suppose you could deliberately discard something if you manage to get the opponent at that precise percent that true combos. But like I said, discards happen naturally all the time, so you shouldn't be purposefully wasting resources just to grab a discard, normally. The only good reason to waste uses is using the last use of elwind so you don't get caught by the dreaded single blade offstage, or for the above kill confirm imo.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Nov 21, 2014
Messages
20
#9
There are kill confirms with discards>thoron, and I suppose you could deliberately discard something if you manage to get the opponent at that precise percent that true combos. But like I said, discards happen naturally all the time, so you shouldn't be purposefully wasting resources just to grab a discard, normally. The only good reason to waste uses is using the last use of elwind so you don't get caught by the dreaded single blade offstage, or for the above kill confirm imo.
Completely agree here. Also have you noticed that a single blade will not let you ledge snap? Don't know why they needed to add the extra salt there.

I use Nosferatu a lot. It is great after taking a stock and the opponent comes in fresh, you can heal for an easy 20%.
Try to Nosferatu at an opponents feet when they are on a platform above you.
It usually catches them off guard.

Nosferatu also has better reach than a standard grab.

Also you can combo into Nosferatu off of arc fire or arc thunder.
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2019
Messages
51
Location
Canada
Switch FC
SW-2880-1949-8293
#10
Completely agree here. Also have you noticed that a single blade will not let you ledge snap? Don't know why they needed to add the extra salt there.

I use Nosferatu a lot. It is great after taking a stock and the opponent comes in fresh, you can heal for an easy 20%.
Try to Nosferatu at an opponents feet when they are on a platform above you.
It usually catches them off guard.

Nosferatu also has better reach than a standard grab.

Also you can combo into Nosferatu off of arc fire or arc thunder.
I didn't know you could get a Nos off an arc thunder. Would you happen to know about how far away you need to cast arc thunder for that to be possible?
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2019
Messages
51
Location
Canada
Switch FC
SW-2880-1949-8293
#12
With the new Arcthunder, you pretty much need to be at point blank range to combo out of it.
I was hoping that you could be a little further away, like with the arc thunder combos that use a sequential thunder cast to stall the opponent's knock back for a follow up, that's a bit unfortunate lol
 
Last edited:

Avokha

A+B smash tech is my baby <3
Premium
Joined
Mar 23, 2015
Messages
562
Location
Corpus Christi, Texas
3DS FC
4914-3109-5720
NNID
Avokha00
#13
I was hoping that you could be a little further away, like with the arc thunder combos that use a sequential thunder cast to stall the opponent's knock back for a follow up, that's a bit unfortunate lol
I believe that can work, and also for arcthunder directly into nosferatu, you do need to catch them at a specific spacing for it, same as all other arcthunder followups. That space just happens to be closer to robin than other followups. I've seen a twitter clip also showing a b reverse arcthunder into shorthop nosferatu, so that is a possible avenue to take for landing it.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jan 19, 2019
Messages
51
Location
Canada
Switch FC
SW-2880-1949-8293
#14
I think I misinterpreted what you meant by point blank range before lol. I thought that you would need to be right next to your opponent, but there's actually a bit of space to work with :p
For anyone wondering, I've found that it's easiest to combo Arcthunder into Nosferatu at a distance between 600 and 400 units away in the training room. It takes advantage of the low initial velocity that Arcthunder has, meaning that Arcthunder needs to be in the air for a little while for the follow up to be possible.
To give you an idea of how far you need to travel, If you're standing at around exactly 500 units away, then you only need to dash forward a bit further than 250 units (which is thankfully about the same distance as a single foxtrot) then immediately cast Nosferatu.
  • If you are standing closer to 400 units when you cast Arcthunder, then it is not necessary to jump to get the follow up, if you are standing closer to 600 units, then short hopping helps a lot (I don't know if it is possible to execute without jumping at that distance).
    • This isn't completely consistent, it'll probably be better to gauge whether or not to shot-hop rather than doing it in a flowchart way
  • It is possible that SDI could make this combo more difficult to pull off, because it also takes advantage of the fact that Arcthunder pulls the opponent into it slightly when it goes off, but I don't have the means to test that
  • This combo should work at any %
I thought that this would be one of those things that wouldn't be practical, but it's actually pretty easy to pull off, and it deals around 50% (without mashing), which is nice. For reference, I was doing this against Lucina, but after checking again on Ridley (it's extreamely easy to do on him, and I've gotten it up to around 700 units away), it seems like it can become more or less difficult depending on how big your opponent is.

I believe that can work, and also for arcthunder directly into nosferatu, you do need to catch them at a specific spacing for it, same as all other arcthunder followups. That space just happens to be closer to robin than other followups. I've seen a twitter clip also showing a b reverse arcthunder into shorthop nosferatu, so that is a possible avenue to take for landing it.
Unfortunately I can't get Arcthunder>Thunder>Nosferatu to work fast enough to get a true combo, it seems close though—I might just be slow. The b reverse thing works pretty well though :)
 
Last edited:
Top