Untapped Potential

[Starfall11]

First of all, I am no expert on Ganondorf in Melee. I want to put that out there first, so everyone is aware that I'm relatively unfamiliar with the character. I've been playing Ganondorf for about 2-3 weeks and conducting a lot of research on his viability as a character.

Obviously, as a slow character, I understand some of the limitations which hold him back from being placed in a higher tier. But I was watching a stream a few weeks back and Mang0 mentioned that Ganondorf's potential hasn't really been tapped into since he has a very small playerbase.

For instance, why don't we see chaingrabs performed more often/consistently at high levels of play? Looking at the chaingrab thread, it seems like after one grab, Ganondorf should be able to secure a stock on a majority of the characters. As long as chaingrabs are incorporated effectively?

Is it particularly difficult to do or extremely DI dependent? I just want to know since I'm learning the character for a tournament late Summer. Any beginner tips or something to improve Ganon's tier placement would be much appreciated.

Sorry for the long winded post, I'm really fascinated in learning this character. The darkness is too appealing.

 

[-ACE-]

Hardest chaingrabs are Fox, then Falco, then Bowser, DK, Ganon, Link.... basically with the exception of fox and falco the heaviest characters are the hardest.

Chaingrabbing fox or falco requires very quick reactions and precise inputs. The key is being able to input your dash AS SOON AS THE DTHROW ANIMATION ENDS whenever a jc grab is required (and usually it is). At low%, it's almost impossible vs fox, as he has the fastest fall acceleration of the melee roster and is even less floaty than falco. You just have very little time to react, and you must dash > X > Z (how I jc grab) immediately. Once falco is above 70% it stays getting more doable. Practice makes perfect.

The heavier characters are difficult because you have a very small window to input the jc grab before they hit the ground (and tech), although the timing is delayed compared to the cg on spacies. Ganons dthrow is lagged by character weight, so the timing for chaingrabbing link is much different than say pikachu.

Missing a regrab is awful, so if you haven't mastered it, don't use it all that much on the harder to cg characters. You definitely need to know the one vs sheik though. Pikachu and the links are good to practice as well. Once you can cg link you're getting good vs the heavier characters.

Read every bit of Magus's guide its got everything you need to do to practice, finish the cg, and it gets even more in depth on exactly what grabs to use on fox/falco at every%.

Seen this?
http://youtu.be/bsNbCkzRF-s

 

[Starfall11]

Thanks for clarifying. I'll certainly read it over.

Where is this guide? Is it stickied?

 

[-ACE-]

Yeah it's finally stickied as of a few months ago

 

[Nicco]

Ganon can actually move pretty fast. His moves have a lot of lag, but if used correctly, you won't get punished.

Short hop bair, uair and nair can auto-cancel, each with different fast fall timings. You can even jump out of bair and uair. I almost never L-cancel bairs with Ganon. You gotta find the timing, but you can short hop, wait a few frames, then bair and fast fall with only 5 frames of lag. You can also waveland off all platforms, except FoD plats when they're low, into immediate bair and it will auto cancel.

Immediate uair out of short hop will auto-cancel, even with fast fall, and is a great spacing/anti air tool, especially fading back. People tend to run at ganon after throwing out an uair or bair, thinking he will have lots of lag. That's when you you jab or tilt them in the face.

Ganons ground game is hella good, and also hella under used. His dash attack can be used for reaction tech chasing in ways similar to peach and sheik, although you propably won't cover 4/4 options in all cases with it.

As for chain grabs, it's not that useful on spacies tbh outside FD. At 50ish percent you should go for uthrow instead. DI'ing in gets u a regrab and DI'ing out puts them on a platform, where a simple uair will lead to an edgeguard.

 

[-ACE-]

CG spacies on DL64 ALL DAY. By the time the platforms interrupt the free techchase will put them offstage.

 

[Starfall11]

Thanks for the advice. I'm an Ike main from PM. So I feel some of the stuff transfers over. Like chaingrabs, spaced aerials, etc. But Ganon's CGs are much more difficult. Seems like a lot of his game is tech chasing.