Theory: Is SUPER MARIO MAKER a rip-off? SMM Origins.

[BioZelink]

So here's the video. (it's my buddy's)

I think Nintendo definitely got a little inspiration from games like LBP and MNR :D

 

[EarthCrash]

I almost thought this was from Game Theory.

Also, I couldn't understand anything he said, and the rest of the presentation was pretty laughable.

The phrase "rip-off" is thrown around too much.

 

[finalark]

Little Big Planet wasn't the first game to have a level editor and it won't be the last. Same goes for Mod Nation Racers. Before that games like TimeSplitters and Warcraft III had level editors and before that there were games like Doom and Starcraft.

Calling Mario Maker a "rip-off" because it's a game based around user created content is like calling all platformers Mario rip-offs.

Besides, "rip-off" is a poor term that implies low quality and an attempt to cash in on a popular trend. Something Mario Maker most certainly is not. If anything, it's a spiritual successor to Mario Paint.

 

[Cthulhu_MD]

I almost thought this was from Game Theory.

Also, I couldn't understand anything he said, and the rest of the presentation was pretty laughable.

The phrase "rip-off" is thrown around too much.

Good ol', Brig. O7

But yeah, while it may seem SMM isn't too much of an original idea, it's still a great game that was given the love and attention it deserved to be a great game. It's obvious Nintendo saw the prospect of making money off of people making their own stages. They saw the value of them, especially because of how popular SMW rom-hacks were. They cashed in on it, but they put a lot of work into making it a great tool making game.

 

[Minato]

I didn't watch the video, but I hope it wasn't using Little Big Planet as the first level editor game.

Nintendo's already done level editors before on the NES, and it was the Mario game, Wrecking Crew.

 

[oZzIIgk]

honestly mario maker is such a kaizo mario world rip off

 

[Plague von Karma]

Urgh...
Miyamoto wanted to do this since like 2007. He kept the idea for a special time, and now we got this.

Rip-off = Poor attempt to cash in on a craze. Fake Pokemon Cards, Fakemon, Fiya Embull, Pokemon Diamond GBC, etc are all rip offs of common video games. Average stuff.

 

[BioZelink]

Little Big Planet wasn't the first game to have a level editor and it won't be the last. Same goes for Mod Nation Racers. Before that games like TimeSplitters and Warcraft III had level editors and before that there were games like Doom and Starcraft.

Calling Mario Maker a "rip-off" because it's a game based around user created content is like calling all platformers Mario rip-offs.

Besides, "rip-off" is a poor term that implies low quality and an attempt to cash in on a popular trend. Something Mario Maker most certainly is not. If anything, it's a spiritual successor to Mario Paint.

Well he didn't call it a rip-off. It was just a question asked in the beginning of the video. The thing is that Mario Maker is Inspired by LBP and there are quite a few arguments to support that. It's all explained in the video.

I almost thought this was from Game Theory.

Also, I couldn't understand anything he said, and the rest of the presentation was pretty laughable.

The phrase "rip-off" is thrown around too much.

Well not everyone speaks English as first language dude, plus you are the only person that ever had troubles understanding...the only...

 

[finalark]

Well he didn't call it a rip-off. It was just a question asked in the beginning of the video. The thing is that Mario Maker is Inspired by LBP and there are quite a few arguments to support that. It's all explained in the video.

As Plague von Karma said, Mario Maker has been in the cards for a while (or so I've heard). While both Mario Maker and LBP are platformers centered around player created levels the concept is very old. Tons of games, especially PC games, had this down years and years before LBP was a thing.

Honestly, if Mario Maker has been floating around Nintendo since '07 it could have been inspired by anything. But does it really matter? All games are inspired by others. Resident Evil 4 inspired Dead Space, Dragon Quest inspired Final Fantasy and Everquest inspired World of Warcraft. But that isn't necessarily a bad thing, as all of these games took elements from the games that inspired them and improved upon them or provided an interesting new take.

 

[Plague von Karma]

As Plague von Karma said, Mario Maker has been in the cards for a while (or so I've heard). While both Mario Maker and LBP are platformers centered around player created levels the concept is very old. Tons of games, especially PC games, had this down years and years before LBP was a thing.

Honestly, if Mario Maker has been floating around Nintendo since '07 it could have been inspired by anything. But does it really matter? All games are inspired by others. Resident Evil 4 inspired Dead Space, Dragon Quest inspired Final Fantasy and Everquest inspired World of Warcraft. But that isn't necessarily a bad thing, as all of these games took elements from the games that inspired them and improved upon them or provided an interesting new take.

I have to agree here. Mario Maker can't be named a rip-off because it's not a buggy (although it probably has a hilarious one somewhere) game with a terrible name and terrible graphics (although people could consider the NES and SNES ones to be 'bad' in this day and age). It may be inspired, but it isn't a rip off. Even then Mario Maker is very unique - the items, graphics changes and the way it works, are all unique to this game.

 

[BioZelink]

As Plague von Karma said, Mario Maker has been in the cards for a while (or so I've heard). While both Mario Maker and LBP are platformers centered around player created levels the concept is very old. Tons of games, especially PC games, had this down years and years before LBP was a thing.

Honestly, if Mario Maker has been floating around Nintendo since '07 it could have been inspired by anything. But does it really matter? All games are inspired by others. Resident Evil 4 inspired Dead Space, Dragon Quest inspired Final Fantasy and Everquest inspired World of Warcraft. But that isn't necessarily a bad thing, as all of these games took elements from the games that inspired them and improved upon them or provided an interesting new take.

Um.... it's inspired by LBP the video explains it pretty well. There is even direct evidence that the developers looked at LBP (straight from the dev team). You can check it out if you feel like it, it's towards the second half of the vid.

I didn't watch the video, but I hope it wasn't using Little Big Planet as the first level editor game.

Nintendo's already done level editors before on the NES, and it was the Mario game, Wrecking Crew.

Well it didn't. And it provides evidence as to why the game was inspired by LBP straight from the developers and interviews and other such stuff. Since you won't watch i guess you just have to trust me on that one XD

BTW guys, i know the title has the word rip-off in it, but he never calls the game a rip-off. I guess it's because of YouTube search data. I know i wouldn't click on a video titled "is smm similar to other game and did Miyamoto get the idea from someone".

 

[EarthCrash]

I know i wouldn't click on a video titled "is smm similar to other game and did Miyamoto get the idea from someone".

I would, since the title is honest to the actual topic of the video.

 

[DeleteThisAcct]

Honestly, SMM was only a matter of time. Nintendo knew from Day 1 that they were sitting on a gold mine (the Mario franchise) and that an infinite number of people would die to have the chance to conjure up their own Mario stages. It doesn't rip off of anything cause I'm sure that as kids, we all had that thought run across our mind of how much we want to make our own Mario / Zelda / insert favorite title here, levels. Meaning that anyone with even half a brain would know that stage editor = infinite replay value. The only reason why it took Nintendo as long as they did is because they also have to worry about if SMM would cannibalize the franchise - let's face it, why would we buy another side-scrolling Mario game if we can just make our own (unless they purposely water it down and never release all the course elements as DLC)

I've been using games centered around stage editors (and even sharing stages - just in physical media) since Ultimate Wizard for the Commodore 64. Then there's also Stunts for MS-DOS or Super Tux Kart for Linux if we want to talk racing games with course editors. This Sony fanboy click-bait (so legit and totally transparent and non-bias with "Hey, my friend made it" like me ***** his video for views, upvotes, and net drama) propaganda video can bite me. (Begin Sarcasm) Cause we all know that LBP and MNR have an exclusive patent on stage editors... /end sarcasm. sounds legit. :-P

 

[finalark]

I know i wouldn't click on a video titled "is smm similar to other game and did Miyamoto get the idea from someone".

The video could have been called "Super Mario Maker Origins" or "What Inspired Super Mario Maker?" since it would be true to the actual topic of the video and isn't clickbaity.

 

[DeleteThisAcct]

The video could have been called "Super Mario Maker Origins" or "What Inspired Super Mario Maker?" since it would be true to the actual topic of the video and isn't clickbaity.

Even that's still click-baity. Nothing inspired SMM because like I said, anyone with half a brain at Nintendo knows that giving players the ability to make their own Mario stages would print money. Miyamoto didn't need any past title to spell out something so painfully obvious. It only looks that way cause they took their sweet time doing it - and for good reason, cause it could very well cannibalize all future side-scrolling Mario sales; meaning that Nintendo has to be financially ready to accept that consequence and if the immediate payout for SMM would warrant the loss of future long-term sales on any NSMB titles going forward.

 

[BioZelink]

I would, since the title is honest to the actual topic of the video.

The title is honest now as well. It asks is it a rip-off and then it explains why it's not, and that it did take inspiration but isn't a rip-off. Like it or not there are many people that think Nintendo ripped of Media molecule with Mario Maker, yeah most of them are Sony fans, but people think it. We may not, but people do. The video discusses that question does it not?

Even that's still click-baity. Nothing inspired SMM because like I said, anyone with half a brain at Nintendo knows that giving players the ability to make their own Mario stages would print money. Miyamoto didn't need any past title to spell out something so painfully obvious. It only looks that way cause they took their sweet time doing it - and for good reason, cause it could very well cannibalize all future side-scrolling Mario sales; meaning that Nintendo has to be financially ready to accept that consequence and if the immediate payout for SMM would warrant the loss of future long-term sales on any NSMB titles going forward.

Well if you watched the video you would know that Miyamoto himself said that once he saw the potential of a game with level creator, and that it's possible to be done he decided to try it out in the future. Takashi Tezuka and the director of the game admitted to have looked at LBP while developing the game. Yeah, we all would have wanted to make our own levels, but we also want a new F-Zero and i don't see one on the way. Miyamoto in general is obsessed with accessibility since the DS and Wii. He's turned down so many great ideas because he tough people won't get them. Did you know that he almost turned down the cart customization in Mario Kart 7 because he thought it will detract from the game and make it too complex?

 

[Cheezey Bites]

Maker is a rip-off in that it barely meets minimum product as a Mario level editor and lack basic social features like quality control communities, score-boards and a search function. But a rip-off is not a copy. Level editors existed almost as long as video-games, they were just used by the developers rather than the public, plenty of games tried putting them out to the public long before LBP, TES Construction Kit or whatever modern and popular example you might pull. I've seen home computer examples pre-dating the NES for pitty-sakes. The only thing copied is the interface, from Mario Paint, and perhaps one could argue that it was copied from certain early home computer desktops, but it's a stretch at best...

 

[DeleteThisAcct]

The title is honest now as well. It asks is it a rip-off and then it explains why it's not, and that it did take inspiration but isn't a rip-off. Like it or not there are many people that think Nintendo ripped of Media molecule with Mario Maker, yeah most of them are Sony fans, but people think it. We may not, but people do. The video discusses that question does it not?

If we're going to play the "zomg Nintendo stole from us" (which they didn't, but I'll humor you) card, I'll just say that I find it amusing how Sony fanboys have their panties in a twist about SMM when they blatantly ripped off Smash with the disaster that is Playstation All-Stars Battle Royale. Or the Wiimote with Playstation Move. Sony's always lately been a bottomfeeder instead of an innovator. Sorry, not sorry. So this is really Sony fans being the pot calling the kettle black, especially considering they drew first blood.

Well if you watched the video you would know that Miyamoto himself said that once he saw the potential of a game with level creator, and that it's possible to be done he decided to try it out in the future. Takashi Tezuka and the director of the game admitted to have looked at LBP while developing the game. Yeah, we all would have wanted to make our own levels, but we also want a new F-Zero and i don't see one on the way. Miyamoto in general is obsessed with accessibility since the DS and Wii. He's turned down so many great ideas because he thought people won't get them. Did you know that he almost turned down the cart customization in Mario Kart 7 because he thought it will detract from the game and make it too complex?

This doesn't negate my point that the ideas behind the concept of SMM were most likely being batted around since Day 1 cause it prints money. Hell, as someone else pointed out, Wrecking Crew and ExciteBike had course editors. The real reason, as I've said before, is that it'd cannibalize sales since Mario was meant to be a franchise and not a one-off title - but of course if they openly admitted that they'd just look greedy, and Nintendo is very self-conscious about their image.

You're just grabbing for straws at this point. All this proves is that Miyamoto just believes we're too incompetent to appreciate his lofty ideals (as was the case with the Lost Levels and why we got SMB2 USA - cause he thought LL was "too hard for American gamers"). F-Zero is totally irrelevant to this discussion - New F-Zero or the lack thereof does not equal "didn't have the idea for it". I have lots of ideas, just because I don't execute them doesn't mean I didn't think of them, it just means I'm either: too lazy to be bothered, too arrogant and think the world isn't ready for it (like Miyamoto), or just have other priorities.

As for looking at LBP, so they looked at it, what unique feature did they copy? (I'll give you a hint, nothing about LBP is unique - every last feature came from something else) Even level sharing dated back to the days of the Commodore 64 with people swapping floppy disks of level sets for Ultimate Wizard. Communities? Being in my 30's I can tell you of the days of the BBS (Bulletin Board Service) that players could dial into (we've come a long way since dial-up thankfully) and post / download / comment on levels for old DOS games. Nothing wrong with researching what worked and what didn't. Your argument is invalid.

 

[EarthCrash]

I'll just say that I find it amusing how Sony fanboys have their panties in a twist about SMM when they blatantly ripped off Smash with the disaster that is Playstation All-Stars Battle Royale.

Granted, they did admit that they only wanted an equivalent on their console.

 

[BioZelink]

If we're going to play the "zomg Nintendo stole from us" (which they didn't, but I'll humor you) card, I'll just say that I find it amusing how Sony fanboys have their panties in a twist about SMM when they blatantly ripped off Smash with the disaster that is Playstation All-Stars Battle Royale. Or the Wiimote with Playstation Move. Sony's always lately been a bottomfeeder instead of an innovator. Sorry, not sorry. So this is really Sony fans being the pot calling the kettle black, especially considering they drew first blood.



This doesn't negate my point that the ideas behind the concept of SMM were most likely being batted around since Day 1 cause it prints money. Hell, as someone else pointed out, Wrecking Crew and ExciteBike had course editors. The real reason, as I've said before, is that it'd cannibalize sales since Mario was meant to be a franchise and not a one-off title - but of course if they openly admitted that they'd just look greedy, and Nintendo is very self-conscious about their image.

You're just grabbing for straws at this point. All this proves is that Miyamoto just believes we're too incompetent to appreciate his lofty ideals (as was the case with the Lost Levels and why we got SMB2 USA - cause he thought LL was "too hard for American gamers"). F-Zero is totally irrelevant to this discussion - New F-Zero or the lack thereof does not equal "didn't have the idea for it". I have lots of ideas, just because I don't execute them doesn't mean I didn't think of them, it just means I'm either: too lazy to be bothered, too arrogant and think the world isn't ready for it (like Miyamoto), or just have other priorities.

As for looking at LBP, so they looked at it, what unique feature did they copy? (I'll give you a hint, nothing about LBP is unique - every last feature came from something else) Even level sharing dated back to the days of the Commodore 64 with people swapping floppy disks of level sets for Ultimate Wizard. Communities? Being in my 30's I can tell you of the days of the BBS (Bulletin Board Service) that players could dial into (we've come a long way since dial-up thankfully) and post / download / comment on levels for old DOS games. Nothing wrong with researching what worked and what didn't. Your argument is invalid.

I completely agree with you on your first point. About everything. About your second one though... You say i am grasping at straws, and yet YOU say they "probably" had the idea from day one, there were other games with level editors. The fact is, Miyamoto admitted he saw the potential in LBP for a SM game. The developers admitted having used LBP as a blueprint (BTW i'm still not saying it's a rip-off, i'm saying it's inspired). So the difference between your point and my point is...i have actual proof beyond me just wanting to think so because it makes sense. But, let's just agree to disagree, what do you say pal? Everyone can have their opinion, that's what the poll is for And i respect yours!