Strategies against Sheik?

[Professional_Bird]

I understand that this is (arguably) Greninja's worst match up. But I know it's not impossible to beat her. So what strategies do you guys use against Sheik?

 

[David Galanos]

Well, I don't really have any specifics on sheik, but, kind of some dos and don'ts. I would never charge fully charged shurikens because she can just bouncing fish right over it and get a free hit. Don't bother trying to edge guard sheik in any way, unless you wanna shoot a shuriken or something, lol. You will always get bouncing fished or hit by her up b. Just wait at the ledge to punish a get up. DI-ing up and away, and back are best against sheik, just find what that sheik does because I think they can bouncing fish if you go up and away. needles beat shurikens. That's all I think of off the top of my head. Sheik sucks at killing, and imo, Greninja is pretty good at killing, and not just because of his up smash sweetspot. So yeah, punish sheik for the little mistakes they make, and hope to get out some combos and beat her to killing. When you are in the lead, that is where you can make a bigger one since she can't kill that well

 

[T0MMY]

Funny story, my brother and I went to grand finals in a state tournament and he complained about me using a "broken" character (Greninja) and so did a couple other people who also johned about Mii being "unfair". My brother went so far as to counterpick me with Sheik and proceeded to give me a very difficult time because she is very similar but trumps him in nearly every regard.
I won out in the end but only because I really pushed for baits, hard reads, spacing, and breaking my patterns of play while capitalizing on patterns he did not change when I would adapt.
Ultimately all I can make of this matchup is to outplay your opponent because your Water Shuriken will just get you needled and your approaches will generally give Sheik enough time to get her hits on you if she responds to them correctly (she's a fast character who has plenty of time to respond with a defense or other option and punish accordingly).
Because Greninja seems to have a difficult time both approaching and out-zoning it means Sheik is going to build the damage faster and have a head start in getting a KO.
Greninja's strongest position is to play in a very finite area of safety and work these attacks:

• Standard Attack - as responses out-of-shield (do not go into Standard Combo unless there's a hit confirm at a modest amount of damage in case Sheik gets a Shield up between hits). Go for two hits and into the third "whirlpool" type attack combo finish OR lead into a Strong Down Attack (see below). At high damage maybe look to get a Forward Smash out of the double-jab setup.
• Strong Down Attack - usually used as a "poke" at a safe distance and after a jab setup (see above). This will lead into upward angled attack like an Up Smash, but could also lead into aerial attacks like a Neutral Aerial Attack
• Backward Aerial Attack (Retreating) - Using this to space away from Sheik can be useful and keep her from getting her grabs in to setup further attacks.
• Up Aerial Attack - If Sheik ever ends up above you either through your own setups or her positioning. Best used to follow up after an Upward Throw attack
• Grab - Use this as a mix-up option when she is expecting something like a Jab and has enough time to get her Shield up. It's up to you to get that read on your opponent and keep them guessing what you're up to next. Greninja's grab is comparably slow to other grabs and usually not best to just "throw out there".

My ultimate strategy to use against Sheik is to play a different character than Greninja. Theoretically Lucario should give Sheik some problems because she may have a difficult time KO'ing him which gives him a big advantage with the "Aurage" (a portmanteau I use to describe Aura + Rage that increases Lucario's attacks). However there are plenty of characters that handle the Sheik matchup, I would suggest Pikachu as another possibility although it's going to get down to personal play style and choice at this point until the meta game evolves.

 

[TTYK]

My strategy against my secondary? Play as fast and pressure as hard as I can. If the sheik pulls out a random f-air, I duck for a dtilt - Usmash combo. I like to wavebounce shurikens, as she often doesn't have time to react to those. And remember; Needles are HIGHLY overrated.

 

[David Galanos]

I like playing against sheik sometimes cause it's usually a fun fast paced match

 

[LumpyGravy]

Jab out of shield is your best friend in this matchup, as Sheik will try to apply a lot of pressure based on the generous use of forward air. DO NOT try to shield grab anything Sheik does. I believe Greninja is tied for the third slowest standing grab in the game, and Sheik's moves have very low lag and come out fast, so she can jab you or do something else before your grab comes out.

If Sheik uses bouncing fish and it hits your shield, chase her down when she bounces off and hit her with a free up smash. Also, many Sheiks like to predictably bouncing fish back onto the stage, so if you can read that you can up smash her before bouncing fish hits you.

Shadow sneak has hitstun canceling properties, which means you can use it to escape her forward tilt strings - however, as SS has some serious cooldown on it, you can get punished for it.

Since the patch gave water shuriken more cooldown, fully charged ones can be punished by bouncing fish. Uncharged ones are good, but needles are better, so you can't outcamp her.

 

[ZomBiehn]

Heavy pressure normally offsets sheiks playstyle, at least that's what I noticed for me

 

[Sidhe Sí]

I find it's much better to play on the offensive, since Sheik's knives lock Gren down from a distance and she can Flying Fish over Shurikens. I don't really know how good Sheik's approach options are, but I assume they're better than Gren's, so it's a matter of closing the gap between the fighters, but playing safe up close.