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So Many Punches! - Rate Our Moveset!

Zapp Branniglenn

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
1,707
Location
Santa Ana, CA
I see this kind of thread in a lot of other character boards, and it's a ton of fun to talk about. In this thread, we're going to rate all of Little Mac's moves on a scale of 1 to 5 :4littlemac:s. A 1 will be reserved for moves that have no practical use. Moves that are not only outshined by other moves, but are not used by any competent little mac except by accident, or in friendly matches for comedic effect. A 5 is an exemplary move with few to no drawbacks to note. These moves reward repeated use and fit a necessary niche in Mac's moveset.

Quick FAQ

Q: How do I rate Jab? Are we looking at the 1, 2, 3 hit combo, the multihit combo, or the standalone jab?
A: All of them! Consider every type of jab and every use for jab in your answer.
Q: We're rating custom moves too? Isn't there a thread for talking about that?
A: Yes, there is. However, I feel like only the good customs are ever discussed. Now we can give credit to the customs that are good, just not good enough.
Q: How can I make a .5 on my rating? I'm torn between a 3 and 4 for this one move...
A: Try combining :4littlemac:heads with these::4wiremac:. A :4wiremac:can mean ".5"
Q: Can I just give ratings? I don't want to write paragraphs about every move.
A: Of course, I've only written short summaries to remind people of applications.


Jab - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac:

In my opinion, it's up there as one of the best jabs in the game. This jab comes out on frame 1. The only jab I've heard of in this game that comes out that fast is ZSS. Not only that, you can hold A to throw constant jabs and catch hundreds of potential, grounded approaches in this game. The standing, rapid jab is a force to be reckoned with in matchups with any character that relies on their running speed, like Sonic, shiek, Fox, Bowser (yes indeed), etc. When it isn't hitting approaches, it will clank with dash attacks, leaving the opponent in range for a dtilt or ftilt. It's also great for stringing two jabs into a dtilt, and catching people as they are trying to land. Your opponent doesn't want to land with an airdodge, or aerial unless they have something quick to use while falling. This option is not reliable on lightweights however, who can jump out. The 1, 2, 3, combo and multihit combo are okay, but I rarely opt for them. You can't combo off of these finishers but the damage they deal is certainly average if not better.

The only reason that Jab isn't an obvious 5 is because it doesn't quite outshine the rest of Mac's moveset, it can't poke as well as dtilt, and it's only three frames faster than the first hit of ftilt.

F tilt - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

With a full damage potential of 12% and the first hit coming out on frame 4, this is a strong poke and "footsies" move. It's also great for pivoting as you run past a shielding opponent. They often drop their shield to face you before getting hit by this. And if they do keep shield up, it's safe against a vast majority of OoS options. I particularly love how connecting the second punch is very consistent even at high percents. The only times I ever see the second punch whiff after the first is when I try to cover an opponent's landing. You'll want jab or utilt for that.

D tilt - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac:

An exemplary move. D tilt can poke as long as you walk rather than run, It's very fast to come out and to act out of, and it combos into more jabs, upward fsmash, aerials, the famous KO punch, almost anything you like unless your opponent is lightweight.

Utilt - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

Could be better. Mac gets low to the ground, but his arm is still an exposed hurtbox as he swings. It's one of those wonky up tilts to use when the opponent is directly above, or behind you. Never in front. This is actually a good niche coverage since Usmash really only hits opponents in front and above Mac. It's low knockback can cause a string into more utilts, or usmash.

F Smash - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

Almost unparralleled combination of speed and power. This move can be angled into two other, interesting alternatives. I consider the vanilla (straight) fsmash the "haymaker", the downard angle to be a "body blow", and the upward angle to be an "uppercut". Haymaker has the killing power you want out of an Fsmash, and is actually functional for footsies as Mac reels back before releasing the punch. The one problem with haymaker is that the hitbox includes only mac's fist for one, maybe two frames. You must be spaced from your opponent, since using this at the closest range possible will likely result in you punching past your opponent. Uppercut has very reduced knockback, and will launch opponents airborne. Still kills at reasonable percents, but I usually use this to combo out of dtilts more than anything. Body blow has extremely reduced knockback and will grant about 3% additional damage to the move, uncharged. The knockback keeps the opponent close, allowing you to feasible combo into a haymaker, but it's unlikely your opponent will not jump or shield as soon as they realize they're still in striking range. One achilles heel to all these options is that all these punches will stale the entire move. Mac players not only need to choose which punch to launch carefully, but also decide if they want to use Fsmash liberally for its resourcefulness and try to land less safe kill options later, or keep it as fresh as they can so they can get early kills with haymaker. Did I mention the super armor? Opting for a haymaker trade when your opponent will land with an aerial or poke with a tilt is one of the best ways to score those early kills.

Dsmash - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

Doesn't have the launching power of Fsmash, but the low launch angle can prove invaluable against opponents with poor recovery, like Mii fighters, Ganondorf, Yoshi, Doc, or another Little Mac. Furthermore, this move can be insane for hitting people on the ledge if they have no invulnerability frames. Besides ballsy footstools, I find this to be the only competitively viable edgeguard move that Mac has. Let the opponent ledge snap, you run and take the ledge using the quick ledge grab technique, climb up and take a step forward before launching your dsmash at the opponent as they regrab. The amount of frames they are vulnerable on a regrab is approximately 20, so time the smash accordingly based on whether you are facing them or not. The super armor for this attack is spread between moments before each of the two hitboxes, and its low damage makes it fairly poor for trades.

Usmash - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac:

A solid move. The sweetspot is on the ground for the first active frame, and will slightly boost the damage and knockback of the attack. Be sure to perform this while in a run. Super armor aids this move nicely when you opt for a trade. This move does not reward liberal use because of how punishable it is. I also use this a lot on battlefield, because the highest frame of the hitbox will strike opponents directly above you on a platform. As long as you don't completely whiff, it is difficult to punish when used this way.

Dash attack - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

Yes, people will regard this as the scrubby little Mac move, but you can punish opponents for unsafe moves with this from across the stage. It also covers landings and serves as a followup out of ftilt. It won't kill but it's fast and racks on the percent.
Nair - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

Little Mac's best aerial. A puny hitbox, but also extremely short IASA frame. You can indeed string multiple nairs in a single air time. It's also good for interrupting an opponent trying to cover Mac's landing. You don't have many options in the air, so make do with what you have, here.

Fair - :4littlemac::4littlemac:

Mac's other, borderline useful aerial. The IASA frame is fairly short and consistently knocks people off of platforms and onto the ground where they must tech to avoid d tilt followups. This is your best bet for interrupting aerial approaches in neutral, unless you're a fan of aerial jolt haymaker for the same thing.

Bair - :4littlemac::4wiremac:

The reason this isn't a 1 is because it has more knockback than fair. The IASA frame is much less generous and will only secure a kill on another little mac, which fair can also do.

Dair - :4littlemac:

Haha, this move is so bad I considered making these ratings 0.5 out of 5. The hitbox is unreliable, and an extremely weak meteor. So weak that I've seen players footstool their target after connecting this offstage. And if the hitbox were better, that wouldn't be a bad edgeguarding tactic. It's only niche use is that its the only move of Mac's that can jab lock, and it's very bad at doing that unless you've practiced it.

Uair - :4littlemac::4wiremac:

Meh, the IASA frame is pretty good. So much that I've successfully followed up in the air with this, straight into aerial UpB. That mixup is definitely escapable, but also unexpected. I try not to use this too much outside of friendlies. Mac wants to stay grounded so that he isn't thrown into a disadvantage immediately. And this move isn't worth getting into the air for.

Neutral B 1, Straight Lunge - :4littlemac::4wiremac:

Lol, this move is just too funny. The KO power on a full or almost full charge doesn't compare to his faster options, but you can charge this while falling, and release once you've touched ground. Little Mac amazingly has light super armor when charging the move, not just when it's active. This allows for some janky uses. For instance, Ike will sometimes UpB in a way where his sword floats above the ledge to protect him as he comes up. I once charged this in the middle of those hits, and released as ike himself came up. That successful stock is just one of my precious memories with this dumb attack.

Neutral B 2, Flaming Lunge - :4littlemac::4littlemac:

This will charge up faster than Straight Lunge. This variant is a flaming multihit that has low knockback and a low knockback angle. The damage potential is also lower than straight lunge. Besides being another great move for Mac dittoes, I don't see this as particularly useful. When recovering, the move definitely shines. Mac will launch forward horizontally. Though Flaming lunge shares this technique with Stunning Lunge, it charges up far faster for this application to work whenever Mac is launched at a mid to high angle. And because the move is multihit, that leaves it difficult to challenge unless your opponent knows its exact distance. Be mindful of the full charge from the air. Mac will fall very far down if you don't land onstage with this.

Neutral B 3, Stunning Lunge - :4littlemac::4wiremac:

An oddball variant. This move launches the opponent behind Mac. It is also noteworthy for taking Mac further than the other two versions when on the ground and I believe it charges a bit faster than Straight. It also shares the aerial recovery that flaming lunge provides, but needs more time to charge. At a full charge, this attack will leave opponents stunned in the air before being launched. Unfortunately, Mac simply cannot follow up from this because of the added end lag after a full charge, but in doubles, it could make for a good (albeit dangerous) setup.

Side B 1, Jolt haymaker - :4littlemac::4littlemac:

I'm still salty about the nerf to this move with the Wii U release. Of all the characters to get a recovery nerf...anyway. Jolt haymaker is still in the realm of usability. Mac launches himself into the air for the grounded version, letting you go clean over projectiles and pokes. The air version is also possible to use as a followup after launching an opponent airborne. The grounded version is a great alternative to the dash attack for tech chasing, as you have good control over where and when Mac punches. If the custom alternatives weren't so much better, I'd give this a better rating.

Side B 2, Grounding Blow - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac:

My personal favorite of the three. This move has combo potential, can bury the opponent, and takes Mac the highest when recovering, at no cost to distance. A ton of fun all around.

Side B 3, Guard Breaker - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

The slow, somewhat powerful variant. This move is most notable for giving Mac super armor just after the long windup. It seems people prefer this for recovering, which makes a lot of sense. The air version has slightly more height than Jolt, but about the same distance. The ability to punch through shields for good damage is also a neat perk. This move takes away your ability to tech chase or combo reliably, however.

Up B 1, Rising Uppercut - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac:

Fantastic. Well, maybe not for recovering. This move gives Mac invulnerability on frame 1, making for an excellent OoS option. Be sure to practice B reversing this move for this application, since it will allow you to scoop up an opponent behind you. The air version significantly cuts the height this move grants, and Mac will not ledge snap until after the final punch. This move also has pretty decent KO power if you want to use it high in the air. The landing lag for this is highly punishable, and Mac's air speed isn't good enough for him to bait airdodges well, so be as unpredictable as possible when opting for this.

Up B 2, Tornado Uppercut - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

The designated "I just want to recover" up special. I haven't played with this move much at all. It's very difficult to edgeguard against, but has absolutely no kill potential.

Up B 3, Rising Smash - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

This one may be a bit underrated, and even misunderstood. Mac winds up before launching a very near opponent into a punch that will kill almost as early as a KO punch. The difficulty of recovering with this is the long windup animation before launching. If you don't have a double jump to use before this, you'll go almost nowhere. If you do have a double jump, the windup will occur as you reach the apex of the height from it. You'll get height that's pretty much the same as the aerial Rising Uppercut. I can see that final punch hitting a lot of opponents. They already stupidly walk or fall into Uppercut, as I recover. You just can't really use this to follow people into the air, you need to be creative. Mac doesn't have invulnerability on frame 1 like Uppercut, so try shorthop airdodge buffering this move into people throwing out pokes. You'd be surprised how many swordsmen characters can be caught with this out of their shield. You might also be able to land this after a jab if your opponent really has no landing aerials or a double jump to spend. It's not for the feint of heart, but neither is Little Mac.

Down B 1 Slip Counter - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac:

Among counters, this one is notable for pushing Mac forward, allowing the opponent to actually help you get back to the stage, and increasing your chances of the counter attack actually hitting your attacker unless they're directly above you. My favorite mixup use for this is dash, shorthop to counter. Mac's vertical momentum (rising or falling) is cut upon activation of this move. Showing up in front of your opponent with a counter in this way is good in case it fails. Since Mac will land at around the same point his counter frames wear off, moves with a sakurai angle will not send him as far when he's punished.

Down B 2 Compact counter - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4littlemac:

Haven't played with this, but a counter that actually lets you follow up sounds like fun. This one will not send Mac as far, limiting its recovery viability. It will still let you combo break and land safely.

Down B 3 Dash counter - :4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

This is the recovery-focused counter. The only problem I see with it is that you'll often overshoot the lips of several stages like Smash ville. This counter will also allow you to counter attack people spamming projectiles from across the stage, which can really catch them offguard. Overall, this counter ensures that neither you nor the opponent will follow up off it. Be mindful of how this can place you very far offstage if you counter something near a ledge from the air.

Others

Grabs :4littlemac::4wiremac:

Mac has one of, if not the shortest grab range in the game. It only makes sense when you're trying to grab something with boxing gloves. He makes up for it with an above average pummel, but not being able to shield grab mis-spaced aerials is a huge hindrance.

Throws :4littlemac::4littlemac::4wiremac:

Mac's throws are nothing to write home about. None can really kill, but they deal decent damage, and dthrow can combo a bit. Just don't spend too long in the air.

KO Punch - < < < < < < < < < <

When this is ready, the pace of the match changes. Landing this with the right amount of percentage will improve your odds of winning incredibly, especially with the 2 stock meta.
 
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