SideB -> Dtilt

[lain]

Possibly common knowledge butttt...

This works sometimes, but that's the problem. It only works sometimes.

Is this character dependent? I know for certain it's not percentage dependent.

Or maybe it's timing? Or what? WHAT IS IT?!

I'll run tests later if no one knows lol.

 

[:034:]

Do a standing downtilt. Just lightly hold the control stick down (so that your character doesn't crouch) and press A. If you do it correctly, you'll do a faster down tilt, one that I believe always hits after a Flame Choke.

 

[Nelo Vergil]

I find that it really depends on your opponent, the faster they react the easier it is to get out, though they really only escape it when they use a roll

If your looking for another option, you can try a Down-B cancel from time to time, if you can do it right after the choke, I`ve yet to see someone escape

 

[lain]

hmm Flying Dutchman that is REALLY interesting. so right after flame choke, lightly hold down and press A. Can you mash A really fast? Cause that seems to work for me a lot. ?_?

if it always hits, that TOTALLY makes ganon like... at LEAST mid-tier. honestly, ganon is a good character. AND fun too. i was placing really well here in Mi with G&W, but then i got bored cause i don't like brawl and started playing Ganondorf under the impression that he was really bad, but had LOADS of fun with him. toooo gooodd.

but as DevilWillCry says, isn't that true? I've seen people get out of flamechoke -> dtilt by just rolling (although i haven't tried doing the faster dtilt yet). and i heard from someone that if the opponent just mashes A, they always beat you.

 

[:034:]

hmm Flying Dutchman that is REALLY interesting. so right after flame choke, lightly hold down and press A. Can you mash A really fast? Cause that seems to work for me a lot. ?_?

if it always hits, that TOTALLY makes ganon like... at LEAST mid-tier. honestly, ganon is a good character. AND fun too. i was placing really well here in Mi with G&W, but then i got bored cause i don't like brawl and started playing Ganondorf under the impression that he was really bad, but had LOADS of fun with him. toooo gooodd.

It takes some practice to do, but yes, it mostly always works. Don't use it as much as I should, though.

but as DevilWillCry says, isn't that true? I've seen people get out of flamechoke -> dtilt by just rolling (although i haven't tried doing the faster dtilt yet). and i heard from someone that if the opponent just mashes A, they always beat you.

If they do, shield, then drop it and Choke them again, I reckon.

 

[lain]

mmm.... interesting.

flamechoke -> guaranteed dtilt, along with autocanceling of most of his moves (the best being dair), as well as being able to ganoncide (which works SO well), along with SO much more HAS to make ganon at least mid-tier, maybe even high tier.... XD

as long as you're not stupid with recovering and keep in mind that if they **** up, you can ganoncide them or uair them away since it's super fast, you'll be fine.

 

[Adapt]

if you can guess which way they are going to go after your flame choke use a SH d-air, it racks up the damage twice as fast. but flame choke followed by either a d-tilt or neutral A almost always hits

 

[Sliq]

Someone made a huge post containing everything you could do to each character individually before they could react. Look it up.

 

[Sans Glutin]

Ganon isn't high-tier. Lool

 

[Metal_Dave]

It's almost a guaranteed hit if you do it right, but I think there is small exception of characters that it doesn't work on. There is a thread about this somewhere on the forum.

 

[Sliq]

If you look in my thread, I quoted the portion stating what moves will hit who.

 

[lain]

These are the attacks that will land if they attempt to DI and Roll, left or right.(If they stay for a get up attack, D-tilt will always land)

The JAB
DK, Link, Samus, Kirby, G&W, Diddy, Pit, Meta Knight, Charizard, Ivysaur, Ike, Snake, Dedede, Bowser, ROB, Olimar, Jigglypuff, Ice Climbers

The D-TILT
Mario, Kirby, Fox, Pikachu, G&W, Luigi, Diddy, Zelda, Sheik, Pit, Meta Knight, Charizard, Ivysaur, Ike, Peach, Yoshi, Dedede, Ness, Sonic, T.Link, ROB, Olimar, Captain Falcon, Jigglypuff, Lucas, ZSS, Ice Climbers

The F-TILT
Yoshi, Meta Knight, Olimar, Charizard, Ivysaur, Ice Climbers


wait, so it this saying that these moves will guaranteed hit no matter how fast they try to di and roll? but if say, characters under the ftilt or jab category try and get up attack, dtilt will ALWAYS hit?

also, does this mean characters under the D-TILT grouping are basically ****ed no matter what they do?

also, if this is correct, you'd only have to guess what certain characters do. namely:
jab against DK, link, samus, snake, bowser, or dtilt if they try and attack
use ftilt against metaknight or ice climbers, or dtilt if they try and attack

and i guess marth, falco, ganon, lucario, squirtle, wario, and wolf don't have anything that can auto-hit them if they try to di, so i guess their safe? according to this list at least.

 

[Sliq]

wait, so it this saying that these moves will guaranteed hit no matter how fast they try to di and roll? but if say, characters under the ftilt or jab category try and get up attack, dtilt will ALWAYS hit?

According to whoever posted that. Personally, I prefer to just dair over them if I think they plan on standing up or doing a getup attack. Some characters can hit you out of the dair with their get up attack, though. A list for that should be made...

also, does this mean characters under the D-TILT grouping are basically ****ed no matter what they do?

It means they will get hit by a d-tilt. T_T

also, if this is correct, you'd only have to guess what certain characters do. namely:
jab against DK, link, samus, snake, bowser, or dtilt if they try and attack

You're better off just jabbing everytime. The only time it would be profitable to guess what they are going to do and react would be when you wanted a KO, then you just guess what they'll do, then do a power move.

use ftilt against metaknight or ice climbers, or dtilt if they try and attack

Once again, yu're better off just f-tilting, and only guessing with a power move for a KO.

and i guess marth, falco, ganon, lucario, squirtle, wario, and wolf don't have anything that can auto-hit them if they try to di, so i guess their safe? according to this list at least.

Well, they are technically "safe" from immediate follow up, but you can still read their roll and chaingrab, or even read their roll and do a power move.

 

[lain]

yayyyyy sliq

this is a lot of BS to remember lol. i'll try and look into making that dair list.

question:

which tilt is better for killing? i assume dtilt is better for lighter characters, whereas ftilt is better for heavier characters.

also, is dsmash ever good for using?

 

[Sliq]

yayyyyy sliq

this is a lot of BS to remember lol. i'll try and look into making that dair list.

question:

which tilt is better for killing? i assume dtilt is better for lighter characters, whereas ftilt is better for heavier characters.

also, is dsmash ever good for using?

I generally never kill with tilts. I usually kill with aerials. But I would assume down tilt would be better for lower cielings and lighter characters, while f-tilt is better for high ceilings and when fighting characters with ****ty recoveries (or people who can't DI).

Ganon's down smash isn't very good. You're better off doing something else, but I suppose it can occassionally be useful for tech chasing after the over b. Other than that, you're better off doing better moves.

 

[Nelo Vergil]

just like Sliq says for tilts, though even light characters with easy to read or bad recoveries can be put in killing position from a F-tilt, and D-tilt can set heavier people up for some of Ganon's aerial attacks which can indirectly lead to a ko. I suppose it depends on the situation, but it's safe to say this, never use U-tilt.

and ya Ganon's Down Smash is pretty bad, stick with up and stutter-stepped forward on occasion, you'll be better off than the D-smash, though I suppose you can use it like Sliq says, or the ever popular roll punish if your unsure where there going

 

[lain]

i actually find it difficult (nigh, impossible) to ftilt a metaknight out of a flame choke. can it actually be done?

 

[Sliq]

i actually find it difficult (nigh, impossible) to ftilt a metaknight out of a flame choke. can it actually be done?

I haven't tested myself. I'm basing it off of someone else's testing.

Personally, I just flame choke tech chase.

 

[Devil7]

you can also use a tilted fsmash against everyone and its pretty good since his fsmash is devastating.

 

[Jekyll]

i actually find it difficult (nigh, impossible) to ftilt a metaknight out of a flame choke. can it actually be done?

yep...

The Murder Choke Breakdown