Ryu ledge get up options

[PChron]

Hey guys, I thought I'd enumerate Ryu's ledge get up options, as he has a substantial number and I was wondering what the usefulness of each is.

Basics:
For each of these, I highly recommend turning tap jump off and setting your left or right bumper to a second jump. It makes a lot of the timing easier.

Ryu shares a number of get up options with the majority of the cast. These options including jumping from the ledge (onto the ledge, not dropping of and using the second jump), simple get up, and rolling get up. I will not talk about these here, as they are practically fundamental.

Another option Ryu has and shares with a lot of the cast is to use his second jump to get on to the ledge. This can be combined with any attack to add additionally safety/pressure. Just be sure to use a move with low landing lag.

Performing this is somewhat tricky but is one of the most fundamental advanced techniques present in Smash 4. It is done by pressing the directional stick away from the ledge, then immediately swinging it towards the ledge and THEN pressing jump. Jump needs to be pressed when the directional stick is facing the ledge, or else you will jump away from the ledge and have to retry. Setting left/right bumper to jump lets you perform an attack after your second jump more easily.

It's not incredibly pertinent here but it is important to note that if you hold down while near a ledge, you will not grab it. Use this with dragon punch to hit people through the ledge.

Beginner/intermediate options:
Ryu can not only perform regular aerials while using his second jump, but his special moves as well. This is because most of his specials can be performed rising (or falling). The easiest to perform are:

• Tatsu: Simply input b after the jump and while you are holding the directional stick towards the ledge and you will perform a rising tatsu that will put you above your opponent (assuming they are next to the ledge). True is also possible (I think) but much harder. Be careful not to hit b before your directional stick is facing the ledge or you will have a super hard time recovering.
• (Shakunetsu) hadoken: If, instead of sweeping the directional stick from away to towards the ledge you do a rolling motion consistent with the command input, you will perform a shakunetsu hadoken that covers half the stage you are on. If performed with precise timing, you will jump onto the ledge while doing this move. However, if your timing is a little late you will instead drop back onto the ledge. The hadoken will still travel across the stage, but a little more close to the ground. It is much easier to perform the shakunetsu version of this move than the regular one due to the inputs involved.

Both of these moves have a chance to be flubbed into each other due to the similarity of the inputs.

Advanced option:
The hardest get up option is definitely the rising FADC. As far as I can tell it is not possible to focus attack on stage, but it may be possible to perform with precise timings. Regardless, performing the regular FADC version of this move is hard enough.
The inputs are different from the regular order seen in all the other options, making it quite tricky to pull off. The steps are as follows:

1. Swing the directional stick away from the ledge, then towards the ledge and jump as usual
2. Immediately input down-b. If you input down-b before your jump, you will fall and die. You cannot jump while in focus attack
3. At this point you will be above the stage and you can cancel your focus attack to get back on the stage. Of course all of your regular options are available so you can use this as you see fit. Note that this will cancel all ending lag associated with the move and give you regular landing lag.

Applications?
I am unsure of the usefulness regarding each of these moves. Except for hadoken get up, which is clearly useful as a means to make your opponent back off the ledge. I'm creating this thread to explore the different scenarios each one could be used in, as they are looking like they can only be used in specific situations.

I happen to think that both tatsu get up and FADC get up are far too punishable to be of any use, but I could be wrong.

 

[SaucyButter-]

I think Focus Attack could be the most versatile if truly mastered. You can take a hit before the dash while Ryu is charging the attack. After you execute the dash, you can reposition yourself or punish if your opponent takes a risky option, albeit without previous super armor. Like you said, it of course is challenging to execute, but it is also trumped by multi hits like Shulk's D-Smash or easily chainable moves like Mario's D-Tilt. I would recommend it to catch your opponent off guard as spamming it is easily punished.

Hadoken seems a bit punishable in my experience because it has little knockback and I often get punished before the cooldown ends. A Shakenetsu (dunno if I spelled it right) might be a better option, since it at least requires that your opponent shields through all of it to avoid damage.

Tatsumaki seems to be generally accepted, but bad to spam since it has a bit of ending lag, although shortening and elongating the duration can make it more unpredictable.

A method I sometimes use is to drop down and towards the stage and shoryuken at the distance where the recovery sweetspots onto the ledge. Similar to Marth's Dolphin Slash, the hitbox hits opponents standing before the ledge whilst snapping onto the ledge and thus knocks them away for a bit, ensuring a safe getup. Note that it only works with stages shaped like Battlefield. Stages like Omega Boxing Ring and Smashville aren't nearly as effective. Also fear
a forecast of deadly bowling balls. They usually mess it up.

I know this was quite a ramble I went on, but as a Ryu player, I hope this can help!

 

[SaucyButter-]

I think Focus Attack could be the most versitile if truly mastered. You can take a hit before the dash and after the dash, you can reposition yourself or punish if your opponent takes a risky option. Like you said, it of course is challenging to execute, but it is also trumped by multi hits like Shulk's D-Smash or easily chainable moves like Mario's D-Tilt. I would recommend it to catch your opponent off guard as spamming it is easily punished.

Hadoken seems a bit punishable in my experience because it has little knockback and I often get punished before the cooldown ends. A Shakenetsu (dunno if I spelled it right) might be a better option, since it at least requires that your opponent shields through all of it to avoid damage.

Tatsumaki seems to be generally accepted, but bad to spam since it has a bit of ending lag, although shortening and elongating the duration can make it more unpredictable.

A method I sometimes use is to drop down and immediately shoryuken. Similar to Marth's Dolphin Slash, the hitbox hits opponents standing before the ledge whilst snapping onto the ledge and thus knocks them away for a bit, ensuring a safe getup. Note that it only works with stages shaped like Battlefield. Stages like Omega Boxing Ring and Smashville aren't nearly as effective. Also fear
a forecast of deadly bowling balls. They usually mess it up.

I know this was quite a ramble I went on, but as a Ryu player, I hope this can help!

To add on to what I said, jumping up and charging a Focus Punch or dashing out of it works wonders as well, as there isn't much downtime from the jump to the charge that is easily punishable.

 

[PChron]

I think Focus Attack could be the most versitile if truly mastered. You can take a hit before the dash and after the dash ...

This isn't true though... there might be a small period of time during the dash that you can be hit, but it's definitely not the entire dash... you are, after all, cancelling the move.

 

[SaucyButter-]

Oh, I didn't mean it like that. What I meant was that the initial super armor helps whilst charging and can grant you a free pass through attacks. I am aware that while dashing you are vulnerable. I'll need to reword that. Sorry for the confusion.

 

[Jaxas]

Don't forget the ever-so-basic yet highly effective for Ryu ledgestand -> TSRK. Like with ledgestand -> shield, there are only 2 frames of vulnerability but if your opponent isn't shielding (or mistimes their attack) you get to just get up and punch them.
Also, since Forward is the input to ledgestand I'd assume you can start the TSRK motion with that just to make it even easier

 

[PChron]

Don't forget the ever-so-basic yet highly effective for Ryu ledgestand -> TSRK. Like with ledgestand -> shield, there are only 2 frames of vulnerability but if your opponent isn't shielding (or mistimes their attack) you get to just get up and punch them.
Also, since Forward is the input to ledgestand I'd assume you can start the TSRK motion with that just to make it even easier

Very interesting. While you cannot use the ledgestand input as the start of the TSRK motion, this is still quite useful in that you can buffer the TSRK during your ledgestand, so that it is a true 6-frame move.

 

[Jaxas]

Very interesting. While you cannot use the ledgestand input as the start of the TSRK motion, this is still quite useful in that you can buffer the TSRK during your ledgestand, so that it is a true 6-frame move.

TSRK has invincibility starting F1 as well, correct?

 

[DisidisiD]

TSRK has invincibility starting F1 as well, correct?

yup

 

[PChron]

yup

So assuming the other player is doing anything at the ledge that can be punished, Ryu gets a free TSRK?
Addendum: how long is ledge climb invincible for? The whole time?

 

[Jaxas]

So assuming the other player is doing anything at the ledge that can be punished, Ryu gets a free TSRK?
Addendum: how long is ledge climb invincible for? The whole time?

I'm not sure this is correct, but it's something crazy like 2F of vulnerability before you can shield (or TSRK, in this case)

 

[DisidisiD]

I'm not sure this is correct, but it's something crazy like 2F of vulnerability before you can shield (or TSRK, in this case)

Also, if it's battlefield, you can land on the side platform, making it hard for the opponent to punish. Landing on the platform with minimum fall time is the main reason to learn the timing for medium TSRK.

 

[PChron]

I'm not sure this is correct, but it's something crazy like 2F of vulnerability before you can shield (or TSRK, in this case)

I actually tried this against a friend recently and it got me a kill.
Ryu the new project m kirby confirmed?

 

[HoodedAltair]

Rising FA from the ledge is very good and I use it often as a mixup. You can throw out the FA lvl1 or lvl2 and remain above stage if you dash forward. These are also both DD1 and DD2 so very safe on sheild. Or you can dash cancel forward and hold utilt or sheild.
People will beat both attempts if they hold jab at ledge.

 

[PChron]

Rising FA from the ledge is very good and I use it often as a mixup. You can throw out the FA lvl1 or lvl2 and remain above stage if you dash forward. These are also both DD1 and DD2 so very safe on sheild. Or you can dash cancel forward and hold utilt or sheild.
People will beat both attempts if they hold jab at ledge.

Interesting, these seem like good options against less experience players. Is the tek required to pull it off worth it?

 

[HoodedAltair]

Interesting, these seem like good options against less experience players. Is the tek required to pull it off worth it?

What tech are you referring too? Rising FA requires moving the jump button to somewhere where you can press jump and down b at the same time....besides that, press back from ledge and rising FA and it works perfectly. I use it pretty often since very few people, even high level, can deal with it...and if they do then it's still a viable mixup

 

[HoodedAltair]

I'd also like to offer "reverse ledge guarding" which is a silly thing that can work on a lot of people from time to time. Basically, from ledge, hold back and jump back and use a shakunetsu forwards and shoryuken back to ledge. Can be a nice VERY RARE mixup to keep opponents off the ledge, but if you get that one guy that remembers the shoryuken will go through the stage, you could be looking at a hefty dsmash punish

 

[WD40]

What tech are you referring too? Rising FA requires moving the jump button to somewhere where you can press jump and down b at the same time....besides that, press back from ledge and rising FA and it works perfectly. I use it pretty often since very few people, even high level, can deal with it...and if they do then it's still a viable mixup

What button do you use for jump? I still use Y the vast majority of the time, but also have jump mapped to Z. Don't use it much though and I've heard that it will loosen your Z button to the point where you would want consider tightening it fairly often. I've also tried using L but I can't short hop very well using L and I like using it set to attack so that I can easily get the heavy version of tilts using c-stick.

 

[HoodedAltair]

What button do you use for jump? I still use Y the vast majority of the time, but also have jump mapped to Z. Don't use it much though and I've heard that it will loosen your Z button to the point where you would want consider tightening it fairly often. I've also tried using L but I can't short hop very well using L and I like using it set to attack so that I can easily get the heavy version of tilts using c-stick.

Good question! I can not say anything about mapping jump to trigger or Z because I have not tried it and I've heard the same problems you mentioned. My honest recommendation is to switch Y and A so that your A is "jump" and Y is "attack". This way you can jump and press down b with your thumb at the same time. It really doesn't take longer than 2 days to get used to it. I don't think it has messed up any part of my play.

 

[WD40]

Good question! I can not say anything about mapping jump to trigger or Z because I have not tried it and I've heard the same problems you mentioned. My honest recommendation is to switch Y and A so that your A is "jump" and Y is "attack". This way you can jump and press down b with your thumb at the same time. It really doesn't take longer than 2 days to get used to it. I don't think it has messed up any part of my play.

Interesting. I hadn't even really thought of that option. I'll give it a try against some CPUs. Using A for jump sounds pretty natural, using Y for attack is what I'm concerned about

 

[HoodedAltair]

Interesting. I hadn't even really thought of that option. I'll give it a try against some CPUs. Using A for jump sounds pretty natural, using Y for attack is what I'm concerned about

It's not as bad as you think. You're not awkwardly bending or stretching your hand for buttons. Though the Y button is smaller so it takes a little bit of getting used to but really feels pretty natural after a few days. Let me know if you like it.I really feel rising FA is a such a useful technique that it should be natural to do it

 

[WD40]

It's not as bad as you think. You're not awkwardly bending or stretching your hand for buttons. Though the Y button is smaller so it takes a little bit of getting used to but really feels pretty natural after a few days. Let me know if you like it.I really feel rising FA is a such a useful technique that it should be natural to do it

Been messing around for a couple hours now, and I'm loving it. I feel like in addition to making rising FA much easier, I can just kinda move and attack at a faster pace, especially aerial attacks. Hell, you can even do a diagonal tastu into the air which seems potentially useful. This definitely feels like a serious game changer and I'll probably be using this control setup for all characters. Thanks for the tip dude!

 

[HoodedAltair]

Been messing around for a couple hours now, and I'm loving it. I feel like in addition to making rising FA much easier, I can just kinda move and attack at a faster pace, especially aerial attacks. Hell, you can even do a diagonal tastu into the air which seems potentially useful. This definitely feels like a serious game changer and I'll probably be using this control setup for all characters. Thanks for the tip dude!

No problem, glad you like it! Yeah I never even thought of it making rising tatsu more optimal until you said that. And aerials with c-stick should be easier to reach as well. Just be prepared to get weird looks in tournaments.....I always do lmao

 

[an1bal]

What button do you use for jump? I still use Y the vast majority of the time, but also have jump mapped to Z. Don't use it much though and I've heard that it will loosen your Z button to the point where you would want consider tightening it fairly often. I've also tried using L but I can't short hop very well using L and I like using it set to attack so that I can easily get the heavy version of tilts using c-stick.

I have never been so confused holding a cotnroller in my life after I tried this setup lol. All those melee years wont let me do this, but ive been getting better at rising FA off the ledge with the normal scheme. On the ground though, im just short hoppinginstead of full jumping, thats the hardest part with me.

Quick question, does anyone else have problems with trumping? it seems with ryu its so much harder to input the motions to go from a standing position to the ledge hog....

 

[WD40]

I have never been so confused holding a cotnroller in my life after I tried this setup lol. All those melee years wont let me do this, but ive been getting better at rising FA off the ledge with the normal scheme. On the ground though, im just short hoppinginstead of full jumping, thats the hardest part with me.

Quick question, does anyone else have problems with trumping? it seems with ryu its so much harder to input the motions to go from a standing position to the ledge hog....

You mean going from standing on the edge of the stage to hanging from the ledge? I don't see why it would be any different with Ryu vs other characters. Run off tatsu towards the ledge as the other person is going for the ledge works pretty well.