Roy and Mewtwo should removed from the game. If they are, then Nintendo can't C&D.

[cheesylard]

The common understanding of Project M's legal stance is this: Nintendo is able to C&D Project M at any moment because it is an unauthorized modification to their game, and that is grounds for a lawsuit.

This is 100% false.

Let me point out another modification ecosystem that has survived for almost 8 years now with absolutely no legal trouble: the iPhone jailbreak scene. Not only has it survived for the past 8 years, but there is an entire $5 million per year business built on top of it, Cydia Store. People actually are able to make unauthorized modifications to one of the most closed and legally tight operating systems on the planet built by none other than Apple; completely 100% legitimately. And not only that, they can actually sell these modifications!

And Apple can't do anything about it.

So what makes Project M illegal, and what makes Cydia Store legal? Copyright violation. Mewtwo and Roy.

 

[InfinityCollision]

Oh hey, we've never had this discussion before kappa

Mewtwo and Roy were already present in the game's files. Not as playable characters, but as other assets.

 

[MechWarriorNY]

A C&D is just a stack of fancy paper riddled with meaningless jargon and silly weasel words.
It would change nothing, in practice.

 

[Ningildo]

Or it would take too much effort to make sure the system is foolproof after weeding out the issues. That and PM's situation aren't even the same anyway (PM is a non profit kinda thing, whereas Cydiastore...isn't).

Ignoring that, Roy and Mewtwo have become fairly iconic characters for PM and have quite the following, so unless you have a good plan for containing angry fans....nope.

I can't see this happening at all.

 

[Xermo]

You didn't even research, did you

 

[Leafeon]

The common understanding of Project M's legal stance is this: Nintendo is able to C&D Project M at any moment because it is an unauthorized modification to their game, and that is grounds for a lawsuit.

This is 100% false.

Let me point out another modification ecosystem that has survived for almost 8 years now with absolutely no legal trouble: the iPhone jailbreak scene. Not only has it survived for the past 8 years, but there is an entire $5 million per year business built on top of it, Cydia Store. People actually are able to make unauthorized modifications to one of the most closed and legally tight operating systems on the planet built by none other than Apple; completely 100% legitimately. And not only that, they can actually sell these modifications!

I know all of this because I myself make some income off of selling unauthorized modifications to iOS. I made a tweak called EqualizerEverywhere which sells for $3 through Cydia. Although there is a lot of piracy, there are many, many people who pay for my tweak. And it is all through a legitimate business. I pay taxes and everything.

And Apple can't do ANYTHING about it.

Now, back to the predicament we have currently. Project M is exactly to Brawl as a jailbreak is to iOS. They both use an exploit to hack the game, and both of them put unauthorized modifications on top of it. So what makes Project M illegal, and what makes Cydia Store legal? Copyright violation.

Mewtwo and Roy.

 

[DrinkingFood]

How is adding something to the game different from modifying it as a whole? Even if the characters weren't already represented somewhere in brawl (they were), the companies/studios involved with or owning the added characters already had characters in the game.

 

[cheesylard]

Oh hey, we've never had this discussion before kappa

Mewtwo and Roy were already present in the game's files. Not as playable characters, but as other assets.

I really doubt that would hold up in court

 

[cheesylard]

Or it would take too much effort to make sure the system is foolproof after weeding out the issues. That and PM's situation aren't even the same anyway (PM is a non profit kinda thing, whereas Cydiastore...isn't).

Ignoring that, Roy and Mewtwo have become fairly iconic characters for PM and have quite the following, so unless you have a good plan for containing angry fans....nope.

I can't see this happening at all.

Yeah... I wish there was a way to fork the game, make one that didn't violate copyright. Then maybe this game could survive

How is adding something to the game different from modifying it as a whole? Even if the characters weren't already represented somewhere in brawl (they were), the companies/studios involved with or owning the added characters already had characters in the game.

They technically weren't in the game. Unless if all of the moveset animations were already part of the game then I really don't think it would hold up.

A C&D is just a stack of fancy paper riddled with meaningless jargon and silly weasel words.
It would change nothing, in practice.

Tournament sponsorship tho....

 

[HalcyonDays]

Yeah... I wish there was a way to fork the game, make one that didn't violate copyright. Then maybe this game could survive



They technically weren't in the game. Unless if all of the moveset animations were already part of the game then I really don't think it would hold up.




Tournament sponsorship tho....

I think the general idea is that any character that appears in some sort of media within the game, whether as a sticker, trophy, etc, has technically already represented their IP within game.

So long as PMDT doesn't try pulling in characters that haven't had a representation, (or are exclusively in smash 4, to avoid seeming like "competition" for sales), and so long as they aren't looking to make a profit off of anything.

Roy was shown in-game as a sticker, so his representation was technically included in Brawl. Mewtwo was a collectible trophy.

If you're worried about character models and moveset animations, those were pretty much created from scratch by PMDT. It's like, if I drew a blob and gave him his own moveset and put him in the game, it isn't technically illegal, since that copy of the model was my own creation, along with the moveset animation.

Then again, I'm no lawyer.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I think Gamefreak approves of each character put in each smash game, large reason why Greninja was put in over others along with Charizard and Mewtwo.

Other companies have a say in how their stuff is represented.

Don't dance around this, they can C&D if they wanted and rightfully can at any time but they don't because they don't want to.

 

[HalcyonDays]

Don't dance around this, they can C&D if they wanted and rightfully can at any time but they don't because they don't want to.

I think this says it best. Regardless of whether or not Roy and Mewtwo are included.

 

[PlateProp]

The common understanding of Project M's legal stance is this: Nintendo is able to C&D Project M at any moment because it is an unauthorized modification to their game, and that is grounds for a lawsuit.

This is 100% false.

Let me point out another modification ecosystem that has survived for almost 8 years now with absolutely no legal trouble: the iPhone jailbreak scene. Not only has it survived for the past 8 years, but there is an entire $5 million per year business built on top of it, Cydia Store. People actually are able to make unauthorized modifications to one of the most closed and legally tight operating systems on the planet built by none other than Apple; completely 100% legitimately. And not only that, they can actually sell these modifications!

And Apple can't do anything about it.

So what makes Project M illegal, and what makes Cydia Store legal? Copyright violation. Mewtwo and Roy.

Jailbreaking was actually illegal for a very long time until the past 2-3 years iirc.

Pretty sure mewtwo and Roy both appear in brawl as trophies, so how exactly are they infringing? What makes Sonic not count in this instance?

 

[Lorenzo The Comic]

This topic made me laugh. Halcyon is spot on about Mewtwo and Roy's appearance in Brawl. I like to some research, like on SSBWiki.

 

[cheesylard]

Other companies have a say in how their stuff is represented.

Don't dance around this, they can C&D if they wanted and rightfully can at any time but they don't because they don't want to.

I am fairly certain it is different since this is a mod. If that was true, then C&Ding SaurikIT and Cydia Store would be possible since it alters how iOS is represented.

If you're worried about character models and moveset animations, those were pretty much created from scratch by PMDT. It's like, if I drew a blob and gave him his own moveset and put him in the game, it isn't technically illegal, since that copy of the model was my own creation, along with the moveset animation.

That could hold up, but I could see It being argued that their movesets and animations were copied from Melee.

Jailbreaking was actually illegal for a very long time until the past 2-3 years iirc.

Pretty sure mewtwo and Roy both appear in brawl as trophies, so how exactly are they infringing? What makes Sonic not count in this instance?

It has been legal for 5 years. cnet DOT com/news/feds-say-mobile-phone-jailbreaking-is-ok/

And Sonic has always been in Brawl.

 

[Leafeon]

And Sonic has always been in Brawl.

Same for Roy and Mewtwo
/topic

 

[PlateProp]

BODIED

@standardtoaster pls lock

 

[Brim]

Yeah... I wish there was a way to fork the game, make one that didn't violate copyright. Then maybe this game could survive



They technically weren't in the game. Unless if all of the moveset animations were already part of the game then I really don't think it would hold up.




Tournament sponsorship tho....

For your last response - no... I don't think Nintendo will ever suggest tournament sponsorship for Project M. I'd love them to, but I don't think it'll ever happen.
--
Unrelated note, hey guys it's been a while.

 

[cheesylard]

Same for Roy and Mewtwo
/topic

Do I really have to spell it out again?

 

[cheesylard]

BODIED

@standardtoaster pls lock

Fine, lock it. Nobody is taking this seriously and I doubt that PMDT even cares. FFS they're adding Knuckles to the game.

 

[Lorenzo The Comic]

I don't see what's wrong with making a character who normally appears in a game as an NPC of any sort into a playable character.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I am fairly certain it is different since this is a mod. If that was true, then C&Ding SaurikIT and Cydia Store would be possible since it alters how iOS is represented.

http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2up9xa/infopost_regarding_pm_us_copyright_law_and_the/

 

[Shadic]

Unless you're actually a lawyer, please don't make a thread about legal matters.

Thanks.