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[Yakt-NJ]

Howdy all! I'm here today to discuss getting Olimar out of the air after being hit upwards and getting him safely back on the ground where he can start his most effective series of attacks again. If any of you have played Olimar yet, you're aware that he seems to be most vulnerable when he is short on Pikmin and being juggled. His dair is solid, but sometimes it isn't enough against a character with a high priority upsmash, uptilt, or even a fair or uair.

Have you had bad experiences being juggled by quick and able players?

What tactics do you suggest for returning safely to the ground to re-stabalize?

While juggling is good against any character, how do you feel this will impact Olimar specifically?

Being juggled by MK in particular is a pretty big pain. Z-Samus also has quite the uair. The new mid-air dodge is extremely good for getting underneath a juggler and responding with an uair of your own. In general I guess it's best to just not get sent up in the first place, but sometimes you'll have a fast one pulled on you. Timing the down air properly is also very important, and not having a white pikmin next to you when you're in the air and vulnerable is of paramount importance. Use that whistle!

Olimar's weight and size make him pretty vulnerable to juggling for characters who can take advantage of how he moves in the air. On the flip side however, smaller characters tend to be harder to juggle. When I play Oli at least, I definitely have a much easier time uair chaining against a character like rob then a character like toon link or pikachu.

What are your thoughts on Olimar's defensive air game? That is, getting safely back to the ground when the opponent is the one blow you and in control.

 

[dmauro]

I've just been using the air dodge (probably too much), but when it counts use the super armor on your whistle. I find I have a hard time trying to do much when I'm up in the air unless I'm chasing. I'm not so good with his defensive air game.

 

[Oceanborn]

Two words: Whistle Armor.

Whenever I'm coming down and I KNOW I'm about to get hit with an UpSmash or something I always use the Whistle Armor. It saved me in alot of matches where I would have been KO'd on the spot. Dodging works too but I think the Whistle Armor works faster as I can spam it.

 

[Kabuto Mushi]

I've been havign a ton of trouble with this lately too. Here's the help I got when Iasked about this topic in another thread:

Rhyme:

DI = Directional Influence

It's proven to be in Brawl but I haven't heard if it's similar or exactly the same as it was in Melee. Basically, when you get hit, flick and hold the control stick in the direction that you want to go (perpendicular, or 90 degree angle, to the default trajectory) and hold the c-stick in the direction you want to go (parallel to default trajectory).

So let's say, for example, you're at 130% and just got Usmashed by MK. As the last of the three swings hits you, press and hold the control stick either left or right (which is perpendicular). After the hitlag from the last swing ends (which is right when you're gonna get knocked upwards), press and hold the c-stick down (parallel) while continuing to hold the control stick in that left/right direction. The result should be that your character arcs away from MK rather than shooting straight upwards, and you should live longer. Also note that certain attacks have a preferred direction to DI in. Melee Fox's Usmash, for example, required that you DI towards the way he was facing, while Melee Marth's Fsmash required that most characters DI upwards and towards Marth's back. Take note of which direction seems to work better against MK as I have no idea myself.

Directional Influence can also be used to avoid combos. At low percents, DIing away from your opponent can make it harder or even prevent them from landing consecutive hits, making you more difficult to combo.

Your airdodge might have limited usefulness here. You could try anticipating where your friend will be and just DI to land next to him instead. Olimar's whistle has a few frames of super armor at the beginning, but I'm not so sure that'd work against a multi-hit smash attack (works against a few different multi-hit aerials so I'm not entirely sure). If you're anywhere near an edge then you could try falling out over the edge of the stage and either grabbing or upBing the ledge. As always, it's possible that the Dair has more range than you thought or you just need a bit of practice timing it. A last resort option (which I don't recommend, I mearly suggest) is to upB right before reaching MK's Usmash range--that little hop might be just enough to avoid the charged Usmash. Doing this will definitely provoke a follow-up attack, but it's something.

TrueRedeption:

His range is nothing special, even on his dash attack. Learn the timing of your attacks (you should be getting fairly comfortable if you've been playing a fair amount since... yesterday =P) as well as the timing of his dash attack, its quick, but it doesn't mean you can't react to it =) Once you have the timing, just use your awesome range advantage, not with Latch necessarily, but grab or Fsmash/Dsmash. You wont be able to get a ton of damage from latch because of MK's ease removing them, but he has very little range on his attacks and poor KO moves, so exploit that.
You should be living easily to 180% + on FD if your DIing well, so just put in the effort to really watch his attacks, and react/anticipate correctly to make use of the range advantage. Its just like baseball, sure a fastball isn't easy to hit at first cause its moving fast. But after 20 fastballs, if you think about and learn from the first 19, you know how fast to expect it, and can then anticipate the speed and swing at the correct time. Theres a lot of characters, but to be good at SSBB we're going to have to learn the timing on just about all of their moves =) fortunately playing more will help you do this naturally, give it time, but if a single move is beating you, especially a small range quick move like MK's dash, just really put effort into learning the timing.

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I was having trouble even touching my friend's Metaknight, but I've practiced and got alot better in the past 2 days...

 

[domiNate]

Actually I'm having this problem with all characters, not just Olimar.

 

[Hammydude]

Whistle armor or air dodging... I also suggest perhaps using your down smash, for it gets really good reach. That would be an offensive and defensive way to get out of a juggle.

 

[Yakt-NJ]

Whistle armor or air dodging... I also suggest perhaps using your down smash, for it gets really good reach. That would be an offensive and defensive way to get out of a juggle.

Do you mean down air? Because if you've discovered a way to do Olimar's down smash in midair... please tell me!

 

[Ultimatum479]

Olimar's moves don't have great priority, but if you attack early, the range is not that easily punishable. Even if they outprioritize your attack, you just lose a Pikmin instead of being hit yourself. So, yes, the Dair is often a good solution to get out of a juggle if you start it early. However, the issue is the landing lag. A good opponent will just dodge the Dair and start juggling you again as you recover from the lag.

Air dodging, Dair-ing, and WAC-ing are all valid ways to get out, but they're all counterable. Essentially, you just have to mix up your uses of the three so as not to be predictable. Also, you can try to DI off a ledge against an opponent who's juggling with ground attacks instead of air attacks. Then, the only way (s)he can juggle you would be to use air attacks, which are more easily air dodged. As you fall past the opponent, you tether onto the ledge and either edgehog your opponent or attack as you're getting up and (s)he's trying to return to the ledge.

But, yes, Olimar's primary weakness aside from his relatively crappy recovery is the ease with which he can be juggled if you're not careful. He _is_ a balanced character, after all. ^_^ (Until a major new metagame discovery says otherwise...)