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Questions about dair utilt/ dair turnaround utilt

Creamworthy

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 18, 2015
Messages
2
In what situation(s) is dair-->utilt better than dair--> shine?

Also, is dair-->turnaround utilt better than just dair-->utilt?
 

20YY SS | Saiblade

Obviously not biased towards Falco
Joined
Jul 1, 2014
Messages
1,169
Location
Florida
3DS FC
3239-4949-5301
On characters that you want to combo using utilt, use dair utilt.
Depends on the situation.
 

OninO

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
289
To expand slightly, the viability of dair->u-tilt is affected the following factors:
1) Weight class
2) Crouch-cancel
3) Location of characters after the dair

Lets assume you can turnaround u-tilt as easily as you can u-tilt, and that the turn-around animation is cancellable or non-existent if done correctly (I think this is the case). With this assumption we ALMOST eliminate the third factor, we must still consider spacings either side of the target at which u-tilt will connect but shine won't. Obviously, at these spacings you would try to u-tilt UNLESS your opponent is crouch-cancelling.

I think crouch cancel is the most/second-most important factor after spacing. It depends mostly on the player, which will be informed by their character (i.e. Peaches will usually try and CC downsmash if they can). It will also depend on the state of the mix up game. I.e. if you're been dair->shining or nair->shining they are unlikely to be CC'ing as they'll be looking to DI the shine (unless they're a particularly stubborn/scrubby Peach).

The last factor is weight class/percent. At 0% it's difficult (or theoretically impossible given frame perfect actionability) to get guaranteed follow ups off a shine on Peach, Puff, Luigi and anyone of similar weight/fall speed parameters. On these characters, ideally you would u-tilt always, UNLESS, once again they're crouch-cancelling.

On fast-fallers at low percents you pretty much always want to shine because while u-tilt can link to itself at low percents, it's heavily DI'able and after the second hit, or even first hit on very good DI, will not connect and puts you in lag.

On fast-fallers at mid-high percents is when u-tilt starts making sense as you can no longer link shine reliably and u-tilt often sets up for a bair or even an f-smash at particularly sweet percents and DIs.
 
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