Puffs worst MU?

[blue_flavored]

Hey guys, I'm sure it's already been talked about but I haven't seen it or I'm just blind, but what is puffs worst MU? I got in a debate about it and someone said Ganon. I completely disagree. Ganon can be gimped with ease. I believe his jab, ftilt, fsmash (not angled down), down b, warlock punch, and side b (I think?) can all be ducked under and would be easy to use rest for a punish. Plus a few other things puff can do. So what do you guys think?

 

[Stickmanlolz]

Our worst MUs imo have to be: ,,,,,,,,,. They either have to have many disjointed attacks or extremely fast kill moves that make it hard for us to get in.
If I had to choose the worst one it would probably be or as they can pressure us from afar and out gimp us with fast, powerful disjointed attacks that even crouching doesn't help with much.

As for Ganon any decent player will mix up using his deadly(for us) down tilt along side normal moves. the MU was probably 50:50, but after the patch it is probably more like 55:45 in his favor because of the buff to his fantastic n-air which now links much more easily.

 

[Rebel13]

I've played some good puffs and I gotta say puff's worst matchup is Ryu, mostly just because of how early Puff dies to TSRK (like, 50%). Plus, Ryu has long lasting aerials and armor on his recovery moves, which makes him hard to fight in the air and off stage, which is usually where puff shines. I know I always go Fox vs Puff though, for similar reasons, albeit a lot worse recovery.

 

[MisterDom]

Ryu, and Yoshi are generally hated by all levels of puff mains. A bit lower to non-high level, Marth/Lucina is also considered a threat because of their sheild breakers. Sheik of course is bad. Little Mac is underrated and is considered a good MU by some... Lucas and Roy are also kinda bad. Luigi and fox are also difficult, and a very good Rosa can be impossible to approach, and hope they start doing things that are punishable.

 

[Infinite901]

: Quick disjoints all outrange us, we can't get punishes in, and we eleviate the whole "trouble killing" thing for them.
: Insane power, combos still work, will kill us at 45. Our SINGULAR move that breaks FA also happens to be our laggiest aerial.
: Speed. He can run away for 6 minutes and we can do nearly nothing about it.
: Insanely defensive. Being able to crouch Thunder is nice but it doesn't make up for anything else. Usually people beat Robin just by out speeding him, but we can't do that. His aerials are fast, strong, and out range us easily.
: Our range of attack is so short that we HAVE to go next to Roy, aka right were he wants us. Will kill us sub 50.
Defensive tanks. Just try to approach them.
Go ahead, punish that move. Oh wait, you can't.
Sheik.
They have just the right amount of range to outspace us without ever having to over commit.

 

[FoxwolfJackson]

It seems I haven't had as much problem with the most of the previously mentioned characters outside of Sonic and his speed. Maybe it's just me, but I find that I have the most trouble with Villager (constantly spacing while using side-b on ground approaches and slingshot on aerial approaches) and Greninja. Granted, this is personal experience, but these two characters always seem to consistently give me more trouble online than most other characters.

(Example of a Greninja just giving absolute trouble)

Perhaps it's because I don't play puff right (is there a right way to play a character) or I still have a lot to learn, but that's just my personal experience/opinion. Honestly, whenever I see a Villager, I will just switch out to my secondary main, Palutena.

 

[HeavyLobster]

Ganon probably beats Puff 60-40. It's like Ganon-Cloud, except in our favor this time, in that it's completely lame for Puff until Ganon's offstage, in which case he's fairly free, which is what keeps the MU playable. Nair, Uair, and Bair handle Puff pretty well in the air and Dtilt outspaces her on the ground. Flame Choke punishes her for running up and shielding too much. Puff can win if she plays patiently and baits Ganon out, but her margin for error is very low, since she straight up dies to Bair at like 60-70%, which is not a hard move to land and is pretty safe to throw out. Her worst MU is probably someone else since there are many better characters out there who can abuse her weaknesses pretty effectively as well, though I don't know enough about Puff to know which characters they would be.

 

[OmegaStriker]

For us, I'd have to say, in no particular order:



Reasons:

- Very good aerials, shutting down her most comfortable area. Banana (nightmare for lots of characters) because even if you shield it, he can use the stun to grab or usmash if we choose to jump away. Grounded attacks are very powerful with several of them being safe from certain ranges. He is rarely in a spot where we can take advantage of him.

- High air speed along with powerful disjointed aerials and ground attacks. Kills very early, though improperly spaced aerials from him can lead to us punishing with Rest, good Roy players make sure he usually does not have that problem. Smash attacks kill super early.

- Several true combos that lead into his strongest KO moves is the main concern. Dair is very good in this matchup against him IMO, but if we space it even slightly incorrectly, it's not safe on landing like Kirby's leading to being punished pretty easily. True DP does a number on us.

- Zoning game is quite strong against us if we don't catch the Gyro or shield it. Nair covers his whole body and has minimal landing lag. Scoring hits against him is very hard due to the coverage that his attacks have.

- I wasn't sure about putting him as one of our worst MUs, but when I think about it, he has several options that can make him very difficult to fight. True, we can gimp him easily. We have air power, something he sorely lacks. However, when he is played to his fullest, he has a lot of ways to make sure we can't get him out of his comfort zone, namely his fast attacks and armored smash attacks. His smash attacks do excessive shield damage and don't leave him open to enormous punishment unless we power shield or are in the air.

- Hmm...I'm not going into detail. We all know the reasons why. I think this is her worst.

- While he lacks in air speed, his aerials are all disjointed and deadly to us. Moves like PK Fire are ones we can get around, but he is good at racking up damage and THAT BACK THROW. BOY OH BOY THAT BACK THROW. 80% or so on up and a clean back throw means we'll just go and wonder how did we get grabbed. If we can get him offstage and we're careful, we can beat his recovery, but first we have to get him offstage.

- In a running theme, disjoints! They can space us well with those swords and they have a pretty decent projectile (Pit's more than Dark Pit due to the control). Decent grab range, long ranged usmash, and great ways to cover themselves against us.

- They have many options to damage us and quite a few to KO us. Wading through the projectiles is a tough order because they can have so many on the screen at once. Our ground movement is not great, so we have to rely on careful movement in the air and dash attack to get close. Waiting them out is not a great option due to the fact that they have plenty of ways to damage us from afar. And not to mention (again!) they have swords, so while the swords are not as easy to use as Pit/Dark Pit's, they are still disjointed.

- He's the fastest thing alive! In all seriousness, his great hit-and-run style is one that we have a hard time dealing with due to the relative safety of his moves. He runs really fast and packs a punch so one mistake and we'll be eating 30% damage in one string.

Those are my opinions on tough matchups.

 

[Infinite901]

OmegaStriker Hm. In my opinion ROB is one of our few advantageous matchups. He's laggy enough to get punished for a lot of things, he's susceptible to dair combos and jab-rest, his large size makes him susceptible rest, but he doesn't have the power of other big characters to make up for it, we can escape his b&b kill combo, and his gyro stage control doesn't affect us all that much.

 

[OmegaStriker]

OmegaStriker Hm. In my opinion ROB is one of our few advantageous matchups. He's laggy enough to get punished for a lot of things, he's susceptible to dair combos and jab-rest, his large size makes him susceptible rest, but he doesn't have the power of other big characters to make up for it, we can escape his b&b kill combo, and his gyro stage control doesn't affect us all that much.

Very good points you make there. I personally did not know he was vulnerable to dair combos. is coming for ! That being said, I find his nair very annoying to deal with.

 

[C0rvus]

Ganon is one of Puff's better matchups. Just don't overcommit. Sheik is also far from the worst in my experience, but her near inability to get gimped does make it very hard. Ryu is very bad because he can kill you in like 2-3 interactions and god forbid you ever get hit with a forward tilt. Rosalina has huge moves and up air kills you at like 40% raw lol. Greninja can play keepaway forever. Dedede is super hard to kill or edgeguard. Most matchups are a slight loss or more, but doable. Some of them are just terrible.

 

[Hoejja]

Rob, vulnerable to jab rest ? How ?

 

[Deleted member]

is nowhere near Puff's worst MU but I'd wager it's pretty bad. Back air eats Jiggs and he's a pain for Jiggs to kill, especially off the top.

is also hard for her. He has the air mobility to contest Jiggs, and his aerial moveset is very good along with the stock tanker that is Waft makes this matchup pretty lethal. His fthrow is also a kill throw, which is something Jiggs has to watch out for.

is what I'd argue is Jigglypuff's absolute worst matchup. It was the case in Brawl, and I'd argue the same here. He outspeeds her (on the ground mostly, but he can definitely take her on in the air), juggles her, and can kill her insanely early with the Shuttle Loop combo, has fsmash and usmash to finish the job on her (especially since usmash is a very good anti-air), and his recovery is pretty much ungimpable due to having many ways to mix it up.

 

[Abbey Street]

is pretty difficult, but it's not too bad; the key to winning is footsies. Roy has amazing kill power with tilts and smashes; however they will struggle to have meaning if you know the space on aerials and we can end up living past 100. Bring Roy out of his element by playing lame and luring him into approaching; don't ever approach him. Offstage he's more free than nearly any other character.

isn't the worst MU, but getting through his kill power is going to prove to be a very tough challenge. The battle against Ganon in starts in neutral - every decision you make can end up benefitting you or costing you dearly. What makes this MU hard for Puff, however, is the minimal margin for error associated with each aerial you throw out, each jump you take, and each blow you block, as all of those decisions can be punished heavily if it's not the right one. Prioritize stage position first and foremost this MU as both characters can edgeguard the other very effectively. (Note: F-smash can not be ducked under unless it is angled up.)

, especially post-buff, is a terrifying matchup that must be respected. Huge range, potent kill power, and a very difficult recovery to contest while being able to edgeguard Puff fairly easily himself. Fortunately, Puff can do a number on him when we're in advantage. Thus to win this matchup you have to be very wary of Marth's moves, the windows to punish them, and the optimal methods of punishment. And don't be afraid of getting up close and personal - if you let even the slightest bit of fear win, you'll end up playing right at the range at which Marth wants you.