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Pikachu Dash/Foxtrot Mechanics

Gibbs

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 5, 2015
Messages
186
So after watching False's video on fox trot cancelling, I wasn't convinced that for pika the -> <- input was necessary due to how tight pika's normal fox trot dance can get. So in order to investigate, I looked everywhere online for dash frame data and timings for Pika only to turn up empty handed. So even though I lack recording equipment, I decided to try and approximate some frame data using a digital metronome, training mode at 1/4 speed and my entire afternoon.

Now the frame data I present here is somewhat dubious, but I'm am pretty confidant that my methodology is sound up to about +- 3 frames.

So there are three relevant frame windows in Pika's (and I believe the entire cast by extension) dash. During each one of these windows it is possible to cancel pika's dash with another type of dash animation.

Pivot window: Frames 2-5 (6maybe)
During the pivot window you can cancel your dash animation with a backwards dash. Cancelling a dash with a turnaround in this window is a perfect pivot.

Forwards Dash Cancel: Frames 13 - end of dash
After frame 13 you can cancel your current dash animation into a new forward dash. This new forward dash can be immediately canceled by a reverse dash as the initial pivot window has reopened due to the previous dash being canceled. Cancelling the new forward dash with a full backwards dash (not a PP) is what False dubs foxtrot canceling.

A visual cue for this cancel window is that you can input the forward dash right as (or a tiny bit before) Pika's front paws touch the ground.

Backwards Dash Cancel: Frames 23 - end of dash EDIT: This is actually just Pika's IASA frames for dash. I found out today that you can also cancel with shield and jab on this frame, big oversight lol.
After frame 23 inputting a backwards dash will cancel the forward dash in to a backwards dash without needing to foxtrot cancel. This cancel window determines the minimum length of a fox trot dash dance.

If you input a backwards dash before this window you will enter a turnaround skid animation that last for what seems like a lifetime.

A visual cue for the first frame you can backwards dash cancel is after pika's hind legs touch the ground his tail will reach an angle of about 100 degrees relative to a flat plane (pika's tail relative to body centerline are at an obtuse angle).

_______________________________________________________________

With this data we can say that if the fox trot cancel is entered before frame 20, it will be faster than a backwards dash cancel. But if we enter it after, Fox trot cancelling has the potential to be 2-4 frames slower than a normal fox trot dash dance.

At worst case fox trot canceling is only marginally worse than an optimal dash dance. This is the scenario when you want to dash away after more than 20 frames.

At best it can give you almost 10 extra frames to net a punish.

In order to practice optimal fox trotting and fox trot cancelling with pika I suggest you use a metronome and spend some time in training mode. If you input your forward dashes at 228bpm, then you should get close to optimal spacing and timing on your fox trots and cancels. Since I've been practicing this it feels like pika is incredibly fast on the ground.

And now for a quick request
If someone with a legit recording setup would double check my frame data on this stuff it would be amazing. I'm new to the whole frame labbing thing and while my numbers aren't fictional they aren't exact.
 
Last edited:

ToasterOvenJoe

Smash Rookie
Joined
Nov 3, 2014
Messages
1
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Hellam PA
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JoeyToaster
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Thanks for the guide! I'm trying to further my Pika game and start getting better results in tournaments. I been practicing fox trot canceling all day and just can't get the rhythm at all, same goes for perfect pivoting. Even though I'm not good with frame data just yet, I really appreciate all your research and sharing it with the public to see! I do have recording stuff but i'm really new to recording, so if I do record my practicing sessions i'll be sure to test your research the best I can:4pikachu:
 

Emuchu

Smash Apprentice
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Dec 14, 2014
Messages
126
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Sunnyvale, CA
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Emuchu
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Thanks for the guide! I'm trying to further my Pika game and start getting better results in tournaments. I been practicing fox trot canceling all day and just can't get the rhythm at all, same goes for perfect pivoting. Even though I'm not good with frame data just yet, I really appreciate all your research and sharing it with the public to see! I do have recording stuff but i'm really new to recording, so if I do record my practicing sessions i'll be sure to test your research the best I can:4pikachu:
To help practice the foxtrot cancel, it was helpful for me to isolate the motions as much as possible.

Foxtrot cancelling is composed of two parts:
  1. Understanding the length of the dash and inputting the motion at the right time.
  2. Inputting the motion accurately and quickly enough.
You can practice the first part by simply fox-trotting in one direction across Final Destination. Vary your timing, here, to figure out what the minimum and maximum dash timing is for punching in another dash, so you really understand how large of a window you have. You can practice the actual cancel motion by practicing your pivots. I find that the motion for a pivot Fsmash is good practice for this. See how consistently you can get out, and then put it all together into the Foxtrot Cancel.

As for Perfect Pivoting, it's hard as heck. I believe even ESAM has stated that he can't Perfect Pivot consistently, but I'm not 100% certain I can trust that memory, haha. It's generally unused, thanks to how demanding the technique is to perform reliably.
 

Gibbs

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 5, 2015
Messages
186
I've since gotten a capture card, and though I can't say this definitively, I think for Pika fox trot cancel might be a useless tech that is really just a safe guard to avoid buffering dash back during the dash forward animation.

I'll look into this more, but if you have your minimum foxtrot dash dace down, you probably won't get any real extra frame advantage by fox trot cancelling.
 

Zanku

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 10, 2014
Messages
60
Location
San Francisco, CA
YAY I'm so glad there is actual research done behind this, because now more people will see how useful these movement techniques can be to pika users!!

For example I've been implementing these movement options and mixing them up in my game play, and I can sike people out more than half the time during the neutrals. One thats pretty effective is dash shield and drop, IASA back PP, 2x foxtrot forward and wait until pika's back legs touch and back PP forward smash.

Oh another useful one is a front PP and then tap forward again and Nair, so you gain distance for your Nair while still facing towards your opponent.
 
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