Gibbs
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Jun 5, 2015
- Messages
- 186
So after watching False's video on fox trot cancelling, I wasn't convinced that for pika the -> <- input was necessary due to how tight pika's normal fox trot dance can get. So in order to investigate, I looked everywhere online for dash frame data and timings for Pika only to turn up empty handed. So even though I lack recording equipment, I decided to try and approximate some frame data using a digital metronome, training mode at 1/4 speed and my entire afternoon.
Now the frame data I present here is somewhat dubious, but I'm am pretty confidant that my methodology is sound up to about +- 3 frames.
So there are three relevant frame windows in Pika's (and I believe the entire cast by extension) dash. During each one of these windows it is possible to cancel pika's dash with another type of dash animation.
Pivot window: Frames 2-5 (6maybe)
During the pivot window you can cancel your dash animation with a backwards dash. Cancelling a dash with a turnaround in this window is a perfect pivot.
Forwards Dash Cancel: Frames 13 - end of dash
After frame 13 you can cancel your current dash animation into a new forward dash. This new forward dash can be immediately canceled by a reverse dash as the initial pivot window has reopened due to the previous dash being canceled. Cancelling the new forward dash with a full backwards dash (not a PP) is what False dubs foxtrot canceling.
A visual cue for this cancel window is that you can input the forward dash right as (or a tiny bit before) Pika's front paws touch the ground.
Backwards Dash Cancel: Frames 23 - end of dash EDIT: This is actually just Pika's IASA frames for dash. I found out today that you can also cancel with shield and jab on this frame, big oversight lol.
After frame 23 inputting a backwards dash will cancel the forward dash in to a backwards dash without needing to foxtrot cancel. This cancel window determines the minimum length of a fox trot dash dance.
If you input a backwards dash before this window you will enter a turnaround skid animation that last for what seems like a lifetime.
A visual cue for the first frame you can backwards dash cancel is after pika's hind legs touch the ground his tail will reach an angle of about 100 degrees relative to a flat plane (pika's tail relative to body centerline are at an obtuse angle).
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With this data we can say that if the fox trot cancel is entered before frame 20, it will be faster than a backwards dash cancel. But if we enter it after, Fox trot cancelling has the potential to be 2-4 frames slower than a normal fox trot dash dance.
At worst case fox trot canceling is only marginally worse than an optimal dash dance. This is the scenario when you want to dash away after more than 20 frames.
At best it can give you almost 10 extra frames to net a punish.
In order to practice optimal fox trotting and fox trot cancelling with pika I suggest you use a metronome and spend some time in training mode. If you input your forward dashes at 228bpm, then you should get close to optimal spacing and timing on your fox trots and cancels. Since I've been practicing this it feels like pika is incredibly fast on the ground.
And now for a quick request
If someone with a legit recording setup would double check my frame data on this stuff it would be amazing. I'm new to the whole frame labbing thing and while my numbers aren't fictional they aren't exact.
Now the frame data I present here is somewhat dubious, but I'm am pretty confidant that my methodology is sound up to about +- 3 frames.
So there are three relevant frame windows in Pika's (and I believe the entire cast by extension) dash. During each one of these windows it is possible to cancel pika's dash with another type of dash animation.
Pivot window: Frames 2-5 (6maybe)
During the pivot window you can cancel your dash animation with a backwards dash. Cancelling a dash with a turnaround in this window is a perfect pivot.
Forwards Dash Cancel: Frames 13 - end of dash
After frame 13 you can cancel your current dash animation into a new forward dash. This new forward dash can be immediately canceled by a reverse dash as the initial pivot window has reopened due to the previous dash being canceled. Cancelling the new forward dash with a full backwards dash (not a PP) is what False dubs foxtrot canceling.
A visual cue for this cancel window is that you can input the forward dash right as (or a tiny bit before) Pika's front paws touch the ground.
Backwards Dash Cancel: Frames 23 - end of dash EDIT: This is actually just Pika's IASA frames for dash. I found out today that you can also cancel with shield and jab on this frame, big oversight lol.
After frame 23 inputting a backwards dash will cancel the forward dash in to a backwards dash without needing to foxtrot cancel. This cancel window determines the minimum length of a fox trot dash dance.
If you input a backwards dash before this window you will enter a turnaround skid animation that last for what seems like a lifetime.
A visual cue for the first frame you can backwards dash cancel is after pika's hind legs touch the ground his tail will reach an angle of about 100 degrees relative to a flat plane (pika's tail relative to body centerline are at an obtuse angle).
_______________________________________________________________
With this data we can say that if the fox trot cancel is entered before frame 20, it will be faster than a backwards dash cancel. But if we enter it after, Fox trot cancelling has the potential to be 2-4 frames slower than a normal fox trot dash dance.
At worst case fox trot canceling is only marginally worse than an optimal dash dance. This is the scenario when you want to dash away after more than 20 frames.
At best it can give you almost 10 extra frames to net a punish.
In order to practice optimal fox trotting and fox trot cancelling with pika I suggest you use a metronome and spend some time in training mode. If you input your forward dashes at 228bpm, then you should get close to optimal spacing and timing on your fox trots and cancels. Since I've been practicing this it feels like pika is incredibly fast on the ground.
And now for a quick request
If someone with a legit recording setup would double check my frame data on this stuff it would be amazing. I'm new to the whole frame labbing thing and while my numbers aren't fictional they aren't exact.
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