New Law For The Obese & Little People

[memphischains]

Now I'm not exactly sure if this applies to the entire country or jsut Mass, but apperently they are trying to pass a new law that helps eliminate discrimination againsnt the horizontally and vertically challenged.

think of it as afirmitive action for the fat and the small.

so, what do you think?

personally, i'm all for it for little people.
but fat people? no.

fat people for the most part are fat because they eat to much. its their fault. they can help being being fat. now don't think im hating on the heavys, but when it comes down to it they can change their apperence.

also, this would totally leave average male whites in a hole. btw, im white, currently 18 (just really getting into the real world), average build and size, all that jazz. so people liek we would be it a disadvantage.

if i went for a job and an obese afican amreican ****** applied too, then he would get the job. (that situation would be extremely rare, but you get the idea of wha im saying)

the gays should get rights like this before heavy set people. to remind you, i think ******* should have these rights.

so what do you guys think? i think this is a HUGE issue (no pun intended)

 

[Crimson King]

I'm against affirmative action of any type, but really to be pro-******, yet anti-fat is a bit ridiculous. Obesity is caused by a number of contributing factors that some people have no control over. I have seen MANY instances where a person could work out all day, every day, eat 3 square meals a day, and still be considerably bigger than average. Genetics plays a huge factor in that case. There are some people who lack self-control, but in the end, genetics is a major factor in determining how big you get.

 

[solesoul]

also, this would totally leave average male whites in a hole. btw, im white, currently 18 (just really getting into the real world), average build and size, all that jazz. so people liek we would be it a disadvantage.)

off topic, do you really think you'll be at a disadvantage? really?


On topic, I'm against it, simply because I'm not going to hire anybody simply because of who they are. Period.

And your anti-fat attitude is a little absurd. Yes, that fits many obese people, but there are also those who suffer from the genetic dispositions that CK was just talking about. Mainly food addiction. Which is an extremely hard addiction to fight because you have to eat to survive. So they can't just stop, they have to learn to regulate. Which is hard because it is an addiction. Its not like they want to shovel food down their throat until they have a stroke, its that they can't help themselves. I'm not giving them a job just because of that, but at least I can recognize some of the problem.

 

[memphischains]

off topic, do you really think you'll be at a disadvantage? really?


On topic, I'm against it, simply because I'm not going to hire anybody simply because of who they are. Period.

And your anti-fat attitude is a little absurd. Yes, that fits many obese people, but there are also those who suffer from the genetic dispositions that CK was just talking about. Mainly food addiction. Which is an extremely hard addiction to fight because you have to eat to survive. So they can't just stop, they have to learn to regulate. Which is hard because it is an addiction. Its not like they want to shovel food down their throat until they have a stroke, its that they can't help themselves. I'm not giving them a job just because of that, but at least I can recognize some of the problem.

i was saying that i'm in the only class that can "technically be discriminated agianst", if you understand what i'm saying.

and i have never met anyone who couldn't work off the weight they had. although, i do see the point where it could be a genetic problem.

but an addiction is no excuse, yeah we eat to survive but we dont need to eat that much. im not saying that they shouldnt eat, but there is a defined line where your eating too much.

its also kinda like saying i'm addicted to coke so its ok for me to do. i have cancer but i am addicted to cigerettes so im going to keep smoking. im addicted to child porn so ill keep looking at it. i like to eat other humans, i cant stop, im addicted, so its ok.

also, most of the people in america are fat by choice. and if this law passes those people who gave themselves that lifestyle could have better oppertunities than others. ths whole **** if ****ed and people are feeding the fire about discrimination. my whole point is that our views of people need to change. its a really complicated subject.

EDIT: i just read my own post and i dont make any sence. lol

i guess, im saying im just agianst the whole thing, but if i can see where they are coming form for little people. and im also trying to say that people shouldn't be given better oppertunities because of a chosen life style. i do, however, see your point on the obese genetics. but also understand that being addicted to food is a terrible excuse, those examples i used above where terrible but i think you can get where im coming from.

 

[Crimson King]

Not really, you are just picking and choosing which groups to help.

I think Affirmative Action is a bad thing all around because it essentially says your skin color is more important than your actual work ethic. If I was a minority, I'd be pretty offended to know that I only got a job over another person because I was a different race than they were, and they needed to meet quota.

 

[memphischains]

Not really, you are just picking and choosing which groups to help.

I think Affirmative Action is a bad thing all around because it essentially says your skin color is more important than your actual work ethic. If I was a minority, I'd be pretty offended to know that I only got a job over another person because I was a different race than they were, and they needed to meet quota.

if i had a choice not to choose then i wouldnt, i would love to have a world where everyone is looked at as the same person. but that is clearly not the case. no matter what you do, people are always going to be judged on those sort of things.

its also true that you would be offened that you didn't get the job because of your skin color, there is no win to the fight. but im trying to spark the point that now we are treating people this way for their own life choices.

its not a black persons fault he / she is black. but GENERALLY its a fat persons fault that he she is fat. thats why i am "anti - fat".

 

[Crimson King]

if i had a choice not to choose then i wouldnt, i would love to have a world where everyone is looked at as the same person. but that is clearly not the case. no matter what you do, people are always going to be judged on those sort of things.

its also true that you would be offened that you didn't get the job because of your skin color, there is no win to the fight. but im trying to spark the point that now we are treating people this way for their own life choices.

its not a black persons fault he / she is black. but GENERALLY its a fat persons fault that he she is fat. thats why i am "anti - fat".

That would be an awful world - communism. People are NOT equal. We are unique with individual talents and abilities.

You are going off the Media perception that every fat person is that way because they eat all the time, when that is simply not true. Do you honestly think someone would WANT to be 600 pounds, fused with a sofa, and have a crane take them out of the house? Do you honestly think people WANT to wait in line for 2 hours only to find they are too big for the airline's aisles? No. No one wants any of that stuff, but for whatever reason, they are unable to control themselves. Plus, by your rationale, we should have no rights for most people with a venereal disease such as AIDS because they chose to have sex, either protected or unprotected, and brought it upon themselves.

 

[memphischains]

I DIDNT MEAN IT LIKE THAT. you should be a lawyer. you twist words pretty well.

you own me everytime i post

 

[solesoul]

i was saying that i'm in the only class that can "technically be discriminated agianst", if you understand what i'm saying.

I'd disagree. You're not being discriminated against, you're just not being discriminated towards.

but an addiction is no excuse, yeah we eat to survive but we dont need to eat that much. im not saying that they shouldnt eat, but there is a defined line where your eating too much.

its also kinda like saying i'm addicted to coke so its ok for me to do. i have cancer but i am addicted to cigerettes so im going to keep smoking. im addicted to child porn so ill keep looking at it. i like to eat other humans, i cant stop, im addicted, so its ok.

Which is the entire point. Its not an excuse, its the cause. They're not saying "I'm addicted to food, so I eat as much as I want". Their saying "I need food to eat, so I eat. My addiction to food causes me to eat more than I need, even when I don't want to." Its an addiction because they lose the choice to stop eating. Thats why its called addiction. Its also hard to fight when people carry the attitude you do, which is "just stop eating so much." Its not that simple. You wouldn't tell a crack addict to just stop doing crack, you would attempt to rehabilitate them, and the same is true in this case.

 

[Surri-Sama]

I DIDNT MEAN IT LIKE THAT. you should be a lawyer. you twist words pretty well.

you own me everytime i post

it is not so much about him twisting your words, as it is about you saying somethign without realizing it, or without you wanting to admit it :\

 

[starcock]

Now I'm not exactly sure if this applies to the entire country or jsut Mass, but apperently they are trying to pass a new law that helps eliminate discrimination againsnt the horizontally and vertically challenged.

think of it as afirmitive action for the fat and the small.

so, what do you think?

personally, i'm all for it for little people.
but fat people? no.

fat people for the most part are fat because they eat to much. its their fault. they can help being being fat. now don't think im hating on the heavys, but when it comes down to it they can change their apperence.

also, this would totally leave average male whites in a hole. btw, im white, currently 18 (just really getting into the real world), average build and size, all that jazz. so people liek we would be it a disadvantage.

if i went for a job and an obese afican amreican ****** applied too, then he would get the job. (that situation would be extremely rare, but you get the idea of wha im saying)

the gays should get rights like this before heavy set people. to remind you, i think ******* should have these rights.

so what do you guys think? i think this is a HUGE issue (no pun intended)

Not good, since they proven that genetics, have alot to do with the fat of fat people being fat. undertsand? Could be alot to do with their metabolism, bad L.D.L levels, trouble breaking down sugars properly and elimating it. All kinds of problems with traits that are passed down to children.

There shouldn't be any discrimination but since no matter what, it always exist, doesn't mean a law is a good idea since it sorta in reverse, discriminates other peope with better qualifications for the same job but didn't get it because of a fat ****** with benifits, that doesn't know anything. Now, if the fat ****** has better qualifications then of course, shouldn't be discriminated in that sense.

 

[memphischains]

I'd disagree. You're not being discriminated against, you're just not being discriminated towards.



Which is the entire point. Its not an excuse, its the cause. They're not saying "I'm addicted to food, so I eat as much as I want". Their saying "I need food to eat, so I eat. My addiction to food causes me to eat more than I need, even when I don't want to." Its an addiction because they lose the choice to stop eating. Thats why its called addiction. Its also hard to fight when people carry the attitude you do, which is "just stop eating so much." Its not that simple. You wouldn't tell a crack addict to just stop doing crack, you would attempt to rehabilitate them, and the same is true in this case.

Any person going up for a job as a white, average build male would absolutely be turned down, because of the fear of being charge with a discrimination charge. If they pass this law where will it stop? Eye color? Hair? I'm supporting communism, but when someone goes into a job interview they should be view as a blank person and hired based on their working criteria, which is what I was trying to say before.

Also, it is a complete choice to stop eating. Aside from these new genetic discovers which i was ignorant about, it is definantly a choice to stop eating. Addiction or not, for people who just have gluttony, have shouldn't have any special treatment. I acually went through a stage in my life where I was an alcoholic. I couldn't go to sleep unless I was intoxicated. I could't function right unless I pouned like 3 beers in the mourning. I made the choice to stop. How is this any different? Its will power. There are plenty of life choices that these people made to create the image that they have. All I am saying is that they shouldn't be "rewarded" or "supported" for them, because that is exactly is begninng to happen.

Not good, since they proven that genetics, have alot to do with the fat of fat people being fat. undertsand? Could be alot to do with their metabolism, bad L.D.L levels, trouble breaking down sugars properly and elimating it. All kinds of problems with traits that are passed down to children.

There shouldn't be any discrimination but since no matter what, it always exist, doesn't mean a law is a good idea since it sorta in reverse, discriminates other peope with better qualifications for the same job but didn't get it because of a fat ****** with benifits, that doesn't know anything. Now, if the fat ****** has better qualifications then of course, shouldn't be discriminated in that sense.

Yeah, I get whats going on now. I was looking some stuff up and genetics definantly does have a part in this. BUT, people also need to realize that not all people are like that. I couldn't find the weight to hieght ratio (i beleive I remember the law being based on a judgement of a certain ratio), but some slightly overweight people (by choice) could gain benefits from these.

With a law like this, you know there are going to be a lot of fasle acusations, acually pull it off.

 

[solesoul]

Any person going up for a job as a white, average build male would absolutely be turned down, because of the fear of being charge with a discrimination charge.

That isn't even the case with affirmative action as it is now. why would it change if fat people and ******* were added to it. Again, I'm not for affirmative action, but you seem to have a fear of it that isn't based on any of the actual results of affirmative action. Do you know how few times someone has been sued because they didn't hire a person black/asian/hispanic/whatever descent over someone of white descent? The few times it has happened, it was because there was a clear attempt at racism, not just because some black guy was mad he didn't get the job.

Also, it is a complete choice to stop eating. Aside from these new genetic discovers which i was ignorant about, it is definantly a choice to stop eating. Addiction or not, for people who just have gluttony, have shouldn't have any special treatment. I acually went through a stage in my life where I was an alcoholic. I couldn't go to sleep unless I was intoxicated. I could't function right unless I pouned like 3 beers in the mourning. I made the choice to stop. How is this any different? Its will power. There are plenty of life choices that these people made to create the image that they have. All I am saying is that they shouldn't be "rewarded" or "supported" for them, because that is exactly is begninng to happen.

And I keep telling you, not every fat person is a glutton. There are people who are gluttons, pure and simple, but there are also those that are addicted to food. You brought up your own alcholism as an example, but the way you used it seemed to say that you think everybody's level of addiction is the same, which is not true. I used to smoke, but I decided I wanted to stop, and quit cold turkey, no problem. But the people who have a much harder time quitting, and suffer relapse after relapse, what about them? Are they just simply not trying hard enough? Do they just not have enough will-power? Or is their level of addiction different? I'd say yes.

And its also not the same, your alcoholism vs their eating, because you never have to drink again. They have to eat everyday. They will be tempted everyday, at all times, because food is all around us. Its a huge part of human culture. It isn't as simple as just "stopping" because if it was, they would.

 

[SU_Remo]

I've been thinking about this for a bit, and I don't think that the law is really affirmative action at all. It seems to me to be just like any other discrimination law put in place so employers aren't able to judge people based on their appearance alone. I imagine laws like these are active throughout the country and have been for years. I'm trying to find details on this proposal, but I can't seem to find anything anywhere on the 'net. If the OP could point me in the right direction, that'd be cool.

Back to the topic, I'm black and overweight, so all this affirmative action, anti-fat talk means something to me. Keep in mind, I'm not some crazy obese 400 lb. guy; probably not the kind of size this law would be pertaining to. But, anyways, I don't support affirmative action. I believe that applicants at colleges or jobs should be judged on their abilities rather than their race. And is being fat preventable? In most cases, yeah. I know I grew up eating the wrong things and I didn't exercise enough. And I've joined a gym recently and have made significant and successful achievements with getting back to a more healthy size. Though, I'm losing weight, I'll never be that super skinny guy that I might want to be.

But, pretty much, I agree with most everything that has been said here. OP, you've just gotta realize that you're a bit under-informed when it comes to this. Everybody's different.

 

[memphischains]

I've been thinking about this for a bit, and I don't think that the law is really affirmative action at all. It seems to me to be just like any other discrimination law put in place so employers aren't able to judge people based on their appearance alone. I imagine laws like these are active throughout the country and have been for years. I'm trying to find details on this proposal, but I can't seem to find anything anywhere on the 'net. If the OP could point me in the right direction, that'd be cool.

Back to the topic, I'm black and overweight, so all this affirmative action, anti-fat talk means something to me. Keep in mind, I'm not some crazy obese 400 lb. guy; probably not the kind of size this law would be pertaining to. But, anyways, I don't support affirmative action. I believe that applicants at colleges or jobs should be judged on their abilities rather than their race. And is being fat preventable? In most cases, yeah. I know I grew up eating the wrong things and I didn't exercise enough. And I've joined a gym recently and have made significant and successful achievements with getting back to a more healthy size. Though, I'm losing weight, I'll never be that super skinny guy that I might want to be.

But, pretty much, I agree with most everything that has been said here. OP, you've just gotta realize that you're a bit under-informed when it comes to this. Everybody's different.

I heard this information on the radio. It was a morning talk show, it was the topic of the morning. I haven't been able to find anything of the topic via the internet myslef, to be honest. That is why I stated that I was not sure if was going to be a country wide or Massachuesttes law.

Just to make it clear, I'm not anti-fat. Although, I guess I didn't realize we have to eat to live (........), and learned about the genetics of the matter. I'm also not "pro" dwarf. It just made more sence to me at the time.

But I just have this odd feeling that things like this wont stop.

 

[Crimson King]

thats why i am "anti - fat".

Just to make it clear, I'm not anti-fat.

Glad you made it clear.

 

[solesoul]

^hahaha. Crimson King: pwner of noobs. Remind me to always be on your side of a debate.

memphis is right about one thing: you should be a lawyer.

@memphis, the main point I was trying to get across to you was that you were being unfair to the fat people, even though you weren't trying to be. I still agree with your basic argument against affirmative action though.

 

[SU_Remo]

Glad you made it clear.

Haha, I was going to post something in here, but I'm laughing too much to remember what I was thinking about. Good stuff. And I second solesoul's comment, heh.

 

[Peeze]

So from the "little people" aspect.

I'm not a ******, but finding a job is kinda hard since i'm 5'4(and black so there's a double whammy) and nobody takes me seriously. A cop pulled me over cuz he thought i was 12.
However i never favored any affirmative action. I get discriminated against all the time, i live in backwoods florida, the black population is 2. And they're both in the same tree. So if an employer does discriminate against me oh well, i probly wouldnt want to work for him anyways. I can prove my worth at another job.

 

[memphischains]

The first anti-fat was in quotations for a reason.

 

[Crimson King]

Then why aren't the rest of your posts? If you were trying to portray yourself as not "anti-obese," you failed.

 

[Deleted member]

I heard this information on the radio. It was a morning talk show, it was the topic of the morning. I haven't been able to find anything of the topic via the internet myslef, to be honest.

i was reading through this thread and i wasnt too shure if you meant generally large people or huge people.when more information is shed on this topic i can reply with a better response but,from what i have read i see people talking about "oh they can help it" or "its only a few that have a genetic condition" where as that is not the case at all.

i myself an incredibly thin but i eat MASSIVE amounts of food but because of my condintions i cant gain any weight,this can be applied the other way around as well.

i also noticed people were talking about overweight individuals saying they were addicted but couldnt help themselves.the thing with this is that it is a mental addiction where there is a physical infliction within their mind that can only be helped over long periods of time.some tried to relate drug addiction to this.yes its pretty much the same except for the fact that we need food to live and when the disorder starts thats it,its there and its a part of them now.if they were afraid of being addicted they would just have to never eat.

as for people losing jobs.thats ridiculous.if your working say, construction is a 300-400 lb. man gonna have that job?probably not.plus if its the weight range im thinking,how would they even leave the house?

sorry my response couldnt be more thorough,ill give a better one when i/we have more info.

 

[solesoul]

i was reading through this thread and i wasnt too shure if you meant generally large people or huge people.when more information is shed on this topic i can reply with a better response but,from what i have read i see people talking about "oh they can help it" or "its only a few that have a genetic condition" where as that is not the case at all.

i myself an incredibly thin but i eat MASSIVE amounts of food but because of my condintions i cant gain any weight,this can be applied the other way around as well.

i also noticed people were talking about overweight individuals saying they were addicted but couldnt help themselves.the thing with this is that it is a mental addiction where there is a physical infliction within their mind that can only be helped over long periods of time.some tried to relate drug addiction to this.yes its pretty much the same except for the fact that we need food to live and when the disorder starts thats it,its there and its a part of them now.if they were afraid of being addicted they would just have to never eat.

as for people losing jobs.thats ridiculous.if your working say, construction is a 300-400 lb. man gonna have that job?probably not.plus if its the weight range im thinking,how would they even leave the house?

sorry my response couldnt be more thorough,ill give a better one when i/we have more info.

I'm sorry, but I'm not exactly clear on what you're tying to say. Could you be a bit more clear, because the way your post is worded, it sounds like you disagree and agree with everybody.

 

[Deleted member]

more clear?basically im for the law but i want more info on whats going on as well.thats all

 

[starcock]

more clear?basically im for the law but i want more info on whats going on as well.thats all

So you are for something that doesn't disciminate by disciminating others?

To address someone saying that, being obese is an addiction to food mentally, well, this is not the case always, the person has bad genes that doesn't allow them to break down starch so it is stored as fat, no matter what they may eat.


Ps. I don't like debating with Crimson King either, he is like a blind man that touches your private, you got voilated and there is nothing you could do about it.

 

[Crimson King]

You don't like debating me because I actually question why you believe things that you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Deleted member]

So you are for something that doesn't disciminate by disciminating others?

To address someone saying that, being obese is an addiction to food mentally, well, this is not the case always, the person has bad genes that doesn't allow them to break down starch so it is stored as fat, no matter what they may eat.

yes,i said this as well and even used myself as an example of that,in the same post you were talking about. please read more thoroughly next time.im not being sarcastic or anything,people just keep doing this and nothing gets done when it keeps happening.I highlited my post below to help out.

i was reading through this thread and i wasnt too shure if you meant generally large people or huge people.when more information is shed on this topic i can reply with a better response but,from what i have read i see people talking about "oh they can help it" or "its only a few that have a genetic condition" where as that is not the case at all.

i myself an incredibly thin but i eat MASSIVE amounts of food but because of my condintions i cant gain any weight,this can be applied the other way around as well.

i also noticed people were talking about overweight individuals saying they were addicted but couldnt help themselves.the thing with this is that it is a mental addiction where there is a physical infliction within their mind that can only be helped over long periods of time.some tried to relate drug addiction to this.yes its pretty much the same except for the fact that we need food to live and when the disorder starts thats it,its there and its a part of them now.if they were afraid of being addicted they would just have to never eat.

also,when did i ever discriminate?if you simply misread or skipped something else as well just let me know so were on the same page.

 

[starcock]

You don't like debating me because I actually question why you believe things that you have no idea what you are talking about.

I beg to differ, almost all debaters question each other in what they believe , just a part of debating. You on the other hand might in fact find "loops holes", or ask the right questions in a sequence. You can be compared to a barbaric killer with a phd. I wonder if you ever a debating awards that the people here can nominate, would be cool. You would be one of them oh and that EOR guy is pretty good from what I have seen.




Oh sorry Tru, was at school so you know. Hold up on the dicrimination part, I am home now but I didn't mean you discriminating, I was talking about the law if passed, it just does the opposite.

 

[Deleted member]

I was talking about the law if passed, it just does the opposite.

does the opposite of what? discrimination? if so is then is this what you mean below?

There shouldn't be any discrimination but since no matter what, it always exist, doesn't mean a law is a good idea since it sorta in reverse, discriminates other peope with better qualifications for the same job but didn't get it because of a fat ****** with benifits, that doesn't know anything. Now, if the fat ****** has better qualifications then of course, shouldn't be discriminated in that sense.

you say this as if thats how its going to work wich it has not been clarified originally whatsoever .but even if it did,lets review another part of my post below.

as for people losing jobs.thats ridiculous.if your working say, construction is a 300-400 lb. man gonna have that job?probably not.plus if its the weight range im thinking,how would they even leave the house?

since we still do not have all the information on this it still depends on how obese a person has to be not to mention exactly how the law will work.

 

[starcock]

does the opposite of what? discrimination? if so is then is this what you mean below?



you say this as if thats how its going to work wich it has not been clarified originally whatsoever .but even if it did,lets review another part of my post below.




since we still do not have all the information on this it still depends on how obese a person has to be not to mention exactly how the law will work.

Agreed, lack of information.

 

[Grandeza]

Well I'm 4 ft 10 and 12 years old. I weigh 70 pounds. I'm constantly asked, Did you skip a grade? Are you a 6th grader? Shouldn't you be in elementary school? While someday I may not always be taken seriously at a job interview, I'd much rather get a job because I earned it than because of some law that gave me some priority over others due to my height.

 

[cF=)]

There are some people who lack self-control, but in the end, genetics is a major factor in determining how big you get.

I'd have to disagree with this. In United-States alone, almost a third of all adults are considered overweight. Genetics account for less than 10% of these problems (10% of 30%, if it's not clear enough) and normally, these persons will be defined morbidly obese.

About 30 percent of adults and 16 percent of children in the United States are overweight, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Only a fraction of these people have genetic conditions or mutations that are linked to obesity, but researchers say studying genetic obesity can also help uncover clues to treating the nation’s growing weight problem.

How can you explain there's been a rapid growth of unhealthy people in the last 30 years then?

-- http://www.healthgoods.com/Educatio...n/Weight_Control/overweight_obesity_facts.htm
-- http://news.ufl.edu/2006/07/31/genobese/

EDIT: Added a quote to make it more obvious.