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New Bowser Main

Zakdos

Smash Rookie
Joined
Nov 29, 2015
Messages
4
First time poster, long time lurker of the Bowser smashboards.

So Bowser has always been my favourite video character, ever since the first time I played Super Mario RPG. I always use him in Mario Kart, but when it comes to Smash Bros., my faith for the Koopa King wavers. I pick easier characters to play, such as Sheik and Marth, because I suck with Bowser. But after many years of being like this and only caring about winning, my love for Melee is not as strong as it used to be, and I think that is because I left the character I had been so faithful to on the character select screen.

But not anymore. I plan on becoming a full-time Bowser main, with the aim of beating my Falco, Marth and Luigi maining friends by the end of the year.

So now the reason for this thread, where do I start?
What tech should I priorities when labbing with Bowser? I've already started practicing Fortresshogging, but is there more important stuff I should master first? Also, any matchup tips for Marth and Luigi in particular?

Any advice for a new Bowser main would be appreciated. I know it will be a long and hard road with Bowser, but my love for the game and the character will be stronger for it.
 

Synnett

Alligator Lord
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
Messages
1,577
Location
Montreal, QC
\o/

For Fortresshog it's easy, you just hold this angle:

Just in case you were misguided by those ****ty tutorials lmao.

As for the other stuff (we should really make a bread and butter thread omg), learn how to L cancel all of your moves, practice the wavedash too. Once you get that 8 frame ''feel'' you can pretty much play Bowser optimally. Grab your controller and just wavedash/waveland across the stage when you have nothing to do. Your control of the character is the most important here. If you feel comfortable with your character Bowser becomes viable for you, as you can use his options. Check the frame data thread for the Koopa Klaw hitbox, and just get comfortable with the range.

Also learn to upB OoS. Playing Bowser is pretty much a spacing game, and you have to outplay like crazy lmao; hence why you have to be able to control Bowser around the space optimally.

For Luigi, simply space Fairs all over the place until he's at high percent, then get a good hit or edgeguard. Don't try to combo he'll mess you up. You can also punish the side B with a good Dsmash. For Marth it's harder, but what you want to do is to Fair him in between his sword slashes, send him off stage and abuse of his bad recovery.

I'll explain further later but I have class :o Have fun! :083:
 

Dralro

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 3, 2016
Messages
77
Location
Avon, CT
NNID
Deadeye42
A thread based on essentials is needed, definitely, but a good start is just look through the bowser questions and advice thread and the "Advancing Bowser" guide, we have tons of posts based on tech, also, if you need help, absolutely join our Discord for bowser mains, we have lots of good tech: https://discord.gg/hkFN6
 

Zakdos

Smash Rookie
Joined
Nov 29, 2015
Messages
4
Awesome, thanks heaps for the replies :)
Yeah I'm basically reading through all the guides, and just wanted to make sure I was prioritising the right stuff.
 

gmBottles

Fun Haver
Joined
Jul 20, 2014
Messages
6,002
Location
Fairhope, AL
NNID
komfyking
Well first of all, welcome to the Bowser Boards. I always love seeing new faces around here, especially those who love Bowser the way we do. I am going to try and write a short, comprehensive guide for you and explain his movement and moves.

Moving With Bowser
This is one of the primary aspects of Bowser we have been analyzing together lately. Having consistent, fluid movement with Bowser is possibly more important than with any other character. Without it, you are a sitting rock, and you're gonna get bodied hard. Learning to wavedash and waveland consistently is going to be one of the first things you'll want to make sure you can do. After that, Fortress Hogging is important for grabbing ledge in many situations, but I will go over more things later. Wavelanding on platforms gives Bowser a hell of a lot of mobility, so make sure that you can do that, as it is useful for both escaping, approaching, and generally applying unpredictable, slippery movement.
There are a few tactics that we have been experimenting with that will take a lot longer to learn. One of these is Bowser's moonwalk. Bowser can only moonwalk out of a wavedash or waveland, and the timing can be very difficult to learn. Once you do, however, you'll be able to move around much faster from platform to platform, and you can use it to grab the ledge from farther away than usual while already facing the ledge so you don't have to Fortress Hog.

Bowser Basics
So, now you can move. Cool, what's next?

I am going to go over the moves that you will be likely using the most, and then briefly talking about the others, and why they suck big nuts.

F-Air
This will likely be the most you use the most. The range on it is very good, and the knockback is good as well. This is going to be one of your primary spacing tools, as well as one of your better combo moves. This is one of his best edgeguarding moves as well, having a fantastic knockback angle and hitbox that can reach slightly below the ledge if you time if correctly with a short hop.

Up-B
You probably already know about this. Bowser's upB OoS is one of the best out of shield options in the game, coming out instantly and being incredibly strong. At high percents it can even be used as a kill move, especially on floatier characters. In my opinion, you do not want to overuse this move, as people will begin to just avoid it, and it can be highly punishable on miss or if the weak hitbox connects.

Side-B (Koopa Klaw)
This is the move that separates Bowser from the rest of the cast, his command grab. It is actually very difficult to use against players that are used to it, so you have to create setups for it. I will go over a few of those later. KKfthrow is one of his best combo starters on fast fallers (though it isn't nearly as useful against floaties), and KKbthrow is a fantastic kill move and is great for edgeguarding characters like Marth when they recover above the ledge.

U-Air
This is my favorite move in the game, and I think it is one of Bowser's best tools. You can apply a sort of mental pressure with this, since it is such a scary move. You can use it to tech chase underneath platforms, which can combo into move uairs, a fair, bair, or even a KK if you can pull it off, though it is difficult to do so. Uair is incredibly powerful, killing most characters early, and killed floaties very early. Using this as an anti-air against enemies who are coming down is a great way to net kills early.

F-Tilt
Bowser's ftilt is fantastic for edgeguarding. The hitbox is much larger than most people expect, and the knockback is insane at high percents. It isn't a bad move for spacing either, but don't rely on it because it is still punishable. It's a great move for covering rolls, or making reads. When you combine ftilt with a perfect wavedash, it's scary for the enemy because you can cover so much ground with it.

U-tilt
This is one of Bowser's best kill moves, primarily on floaties. It is actually better than upsmash, both in frame data and knockback. It comes out extremely fast, and has a lot of knockback. It isn't quite as useful at low percents on fast fallers, though, so keep in mind that it is possible to be punished off of it early on. Something important to remember is that jab > utilt is a true combo on floaties, and this is one of your best kill confirms.

N-Air
Bowser's nair is good, though I don't have particularly much to say about it, myself. The hitbox is good as it covers your body, and it comes out relatively quickly. This move is good for edgeguarding from ledge (invincible nair) and is also useful when you are coming down as a "get off me" move.

B-Air
This move is almost exclusively going to be used for edgeguarding, as it is incredibly laggy and punishable. It can be crouch cancelled on stage, or simply shielded. However, when it comes to edgeguards, this move is very useful. Invincible bair from ledge is a great way to send them back off with no chance of recovery. You can also use a double jump bair to catch people off guard who are trying to recover high.

F-Smash
This move is somewhat of an anomaly. Regarding frame data, this move is terrible. However, the knockback is so strong that it is in your best interest to pull it out occasionally for a read or an edgeguard. It is actually a very useful edgeguarding tool on some characters, such as spacies and Falcon. Keep this move in your pocket, and save it for a special occasion, as it is extremely easy to punish when it whiffs.

D-Smash
This is a very strong multihit that is useful in multiple situations. You can crouch cancel into it (occasionally, do not rely on this working every time), read a roll in, or use it to edgeguard. This can be used as a kill move as well.


Now for the moves that aren't so useful. I'll keep these short.

D-Air
This is a poor multihit move that doesn't do much. Somewhat useful for coming down if you can ledge cancel reliably, but other than that, not much use.

D-Tilt
Very slow, not very strong. Down angled ftilt is better in every way, use that instead.

Down-B
Bowser Bomb is decent for grabbing ledge sometimes, but that is pretty much it. The hit itself isn't bad, but it is easy to avoid and the ending lag is abysmal.

U-Smash

It's decent sometimes to cover yourself when someone is coming down on you, but in most situations you will be better off using uptilt.


Well, I think that just about covers it for the basics on his moves. You're more than welcome to join the Bowser Discord server I have set up, which Dralro posted a link to above, where several Bowsers discuss various things we find, as well as just hang out. There's Synnett, Dralro, Stockholm Syndrome, A Stuffy Muffin, myself, and a few others. Any other questions you have, just let me know and I'll answer them the best I can.
 
Last edited:

CnB | Chandy

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
221
Location
Austin, Texas
You should also check out @Pangwell's Bowser guide, it goes a little more in depth on Bowser's tools and also details some of the more advanced Fortress Tech I discovered last year, like Aerial Fortress Interrupt (AFI) and Fortress Landing. I'm not sure if Pang kept up with updating the guide since he dropped off the face of the earth, but you should also look into Edge Cancel Aerial Fortress (ECAF) and Teeter Cancel Aerial Fortress, which I detail in this post. These three tricks may seem hard to nail down when you're just starting, but Fortress movement is integral to having a tricky Bowser so the sooner you start practicing, the better. You should always be working on your Fortress Tech, but I'd say Fortress Hogging and certain applications of AFI are the most important to learn when just starting out, whereas ECAF/TCAF and Fortress Landing are more situational and can be picked up later in your career.

This post I made on dthrow tech chasing spacies is apparently popular. Let me know if you have any more questions.
 

Dralro

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 3, 2016
Messages
77
Location
Avon, CT
NNID
Deadeye42
You should also check out @Pangwell's Bowser guide, it goes a little more in depth on Bowser's tools and also details some of the more advanced Fortress Tech I discovered last year, like Aerial Fortress Interrupt (AFI) and Fortress Landing. I'm not sure if Pang kept up with updating the guide since he dropped off the face of the earth, but you should also look into Edge Cancel Aerial Fortress (ECAF) and Teeter Cancel Aerial Fortress, which I detail in this post. These three tricks may seem hard to nail down when you're just starting, but Fortress movement is integral to having a tricky Bowser so the sooner you start practicing, the better. You should always be working on your Fortress Tech, but I'd say Fortress Hogging and certain applications of AFI are the most important to learn when just starting out, whereas ECAF/TCAF and Fortress Landing are more situational and can be picked up later in your career.

This post I made on dthrow tech chasing spacies is apparently popular. Let me know if you have any more questions.
As it seems you also dropped off the face of the earth yourself, but yeah, we have been working with that tech, you should actually work with us on how to apply that to the new bowser meta.
 

CnB | Chandy

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
221
Location
Austin, Texas
As it seems you also dropped off the face of the earth yourself, but yeah, we have been working with that tech, you should actually work with us on how to apply that to the new bowser meta.
I check Smashboards pretty often and I'm glad to help, but I'm all the low tier subforums these days so you gotta @ me so I know I'm needed. I'm happy to look into specific stuff you guys might wanna know but I hardly play Bowser so I don't think about him all that much. Give me direction and I'll do my best, but I don't just look into stuff for characters I don't play without prompting.

Also Zakdos Zakdos , if you need a visual reference for basic bowser tech, I made this video guide about him a while back that's certainly worth a watch for someone in your position.

https://youtu.be/MTbdXRcOAX4
 
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