Move priority changes?

[meleebrawler]

According to SmashWiki, move priority is determined solely by the damage of the moves.

If two moves damage outputs are close enough to each other, they will clank for the case of ground moves
or just be canceled out for projectiles.

Now I've seen some weird things like Luigi's Green Missile being stopped by Pikachu's Thunder Jolt.

Could anyone determine if priority still works the same as in previous games, and if it does, the difference
in damage needed to overpower other moves?

 

[Lozjam]

According to SmashWiki, move priority is determined solely by the damage of the moves.

If two moves damage outputs are close enough to each other, they will clank for the case of ground moves
or just be canceled out for projectiles.

Now I've seen some weird things like Luigi's Green Missile being stopped by Pikachu's Thunder Jolt.

Could anyone determine if priority still works the same as in previous games, and if it does, the difference
in damage needed to overpower other moves?

Priority is different. Priority has always been a separate integer in Brawl and Melee that determines what if you two moves collide, and the size and type of hitbox is also taken into account.. You misread the wiki. Furthermore, it is different because Smash 4 is entirely rebalanced, moves have better/worse priority because the balancing deemed it so. Also with projectiles, many factors and integers are brought into account this game. Type of projectile, speed, power, and distance are all now taken into account with projectile priority.

 

[Minty_]

Priority is different. Priority has always been a separate integer in Brawl and Melee that determines what if you two moves collide, and the size and type of hitbox is also taken into account.. You misread the wiki. Furthermore, it is different because Smash 4 is entirely rebalanced, moves have better/worse priority because the balancing deemed it so. Also with projectiles, many factors and integers are brought into account this game. Type of projectile, speed, power, and distance are all now taken into account with projectile priority.

This is incorrect and based on false and misleading information. Most moves follow normal priority rules - i.e. the damage of the hitbox(es) is the only determining factor. Transcendent priority moves ignore the priority system all together. (They were much more common in Brawl vs. Melee, but still only a small subset of attacks). Then there are a few weird attacks that have their own hitboxes and can be 'damaged' like an object, such as Diddy's peanuts - this is a really small group - mostly B moves. Otherwise, damage is the one determining factor - it has always been this way in Smash games. To quote the wiki article:

It is a common misconception that attacks are given priority independent of the damage they deal - for example, many people consider attacks such as Captain Falcon's Raptor Boost, to have "low priority". However, such attacks simply seem to have "high" or "low" priority relative to the favorability of their hitboxes - attacks with small or late hitboxes often appear to get "out-prioritised" by other attacks, when, in reality, the wielders of these hitboxes are often hit by their opponents' before they are able to connect with them.

Characters' whole movesets are also often described as having "good" or "bad" priority, such as Captain Falcon's and Sonic's movesets having "low" priority, and sword attacks having "high" priority. Again, this is technically incorrect, because, with the exception of transcendent priority, priority itself is not a character-specific independent value. However, if a character's most frequently used moves deal low damage, and are hence often out prioritised by other characters' common moves, his or her moveset will appear to have "worse priority" than other characters' movesets. A similar problem occurs with characters with small hitbox attacks (Captain Falcon has such a problem with some of his attacks) which means opposing attacks with better range will strike hurtboxes before their attacks finish, resulting in having "lower" priority because the attacks don't actually connect. Most characters, including Sonic and Captain Falcon, as well as sword attacks, deal similar damage compared to each other, and therefore all have similar levels of priority.

Now in response to the OP: I don't know for sure if the priority system works exactly the same as previous games, but I believe it is very similar - if not exactly the same - based on all the streams and videos and feedback I've read. I don't have the means to test this right now so I'll let others find the full answers.

 

[HMWii22]

Priority has always been a separate integer in Brawl and Melee that determines what if you two moves collide, and the size and type of hitbox is also taken into account.

Completely 100% wrong; stop spreading misinformation

 

[Lozjam]

This is incorrect and based on false and misleading information. Most moves follow normal priority rules - i.e. the damage of the hitbox(es) is the only determining factor. Transcendent priority moves ignore the priority system all together. (They were much more common in Brawl vs. Melee, but still only a small subset of attacks). Then there are a few weird attacks that have their own hitboxes and can be 'damaged' like an object, such as Diddy's peanuts - this is a really small group - mostly B moves. Otherwise, damage is the one determining factor - it has always been this way in Smash games. To quote the wiki article:


Now in response to the OP: I don't know for sure if the priority system works exactly the same as previous games, but I believe it is very similar - if not exactly the same - based on all the streams and videos and feedback I've read. I don't have the means to test this right now so I'll let others find the full answers.

You state most moves. Yet you fail to mention the priority difference between aerials and moves used on the ground. The statement I said is correct as a general statement. For example, a fresh sex kick(nair) from Mario will have higher priority from the start than at the end. And I also didn't see you mention disjointed hitboxes or moves that give super armor. All of which determine "priority". All of these I have mentioned ie size, type, and the spot in which it collides as general rule. All of these produce integers that is calculated to see if a move cancels, goes through, or whiffs. So I believe you are the one based on false and misleading information

Completely 100% wrong; stop spreading misinformation

Would you like me to show you the equation? I think you misunderstand. I am not saying Sakurai gave Mario's nair an integer of 1 regarded from priority. It is calculated from different factors depending on the move depending on hit box , type, and duration.

 

[Minty_]

Aerials just don't "see" the hitboxes of other normal aerial and ground attacks, and vice versa. In this sense they are similar to transcendent priority. However, they can however clash with projectiles and certain other moves and the law of damage applies. An Aerial that deals 10% damage will be beaten out by a projectile that does >= 19% damage, will clash with a projectile that deals >=2% and <=18%, and will out-prioritize a projectile that deals 1% (or less).

Disjointed hit boxes and super armor are not a direct factor in move priority. They are very important aspects of a move, just like a move's knockback, duration, multihit properties, speed (startup frames) and end lag (end frames and IASA). There are many important properties that determine how useful a move is, how easy it is to hit with the move, and what effect it has on hit, but damage is the only factor when determining when two overlapping moves will "clank" or "cancel." We define priority in Smash as how two moves interact when their hotboxes overlap. So when talking about priority, it only deals with already overlapping hitboxes, and as such things like disjointed boxes or super-armor are not applicable.