Mix up help part 2

[Boost4u]

Hi guys it's Boost4u again. I think this merits another thread because the conditions are different.

So thanks to you wonderful pros I've gotten better with wario. In fact, I'm the highest ranked 3ds wario on Anther's! Peaked at gold I I 4
However there is always room for improvement and I still don't feel like the best wario out there. Here is a list of how I frequently use wario's moveset on average in two 3 stock matches.
Note that the moves recorded were intended to land. They either hit, almost hit, or got punished.

Jab(s) - .5
Ftilt - .5
Dtilt - 7.5
Utilt - 1
Fsmash - 3.5
Dsmash - 1.5
Usmash - 0
Fair - 7
Nair - 4
Bair - 4.5
Dair - 2
Uair - 3
Fthrow - 2
Bthrow - .5
Dthrow - 2.5
Uthrow - 2.5
Dash attack - 4.5
B - 8
Side B - 12.5
Up B - 0
Down B - 1.5

I'm starting to apply Nair, bair, and Uthrow more effectively, but I am still having a hard time to use Usmash and most importantly, Dair.

These 2 matches were against a Pikachu and a Shulk. Two unfavorable match ups. This brings me to the point of what should I NOT do when I fight shulk. Anyway I won both matches.

Any feedback is greatly appreciated!

 

[C4-]

You need to be dairing and biting more , those are two of his strongest moves IMO ( bite being his strongest)full hop dair out of shield is an amazing mix up if your like me and love to short hop Nair OoS a lot. there is no landing lag on full hop dair so if you cross up a shield or retreat after applying pressure on their shield with the dair , it is fairly safe.

Also if your playing on stages with platforms your bite and up air count should most likely double. Use up air to stay safe under platforms and apply pressure/ possibly force out a bad landing option, up air can combo into itself even when opponenets are on a platform til about medium percents (50 to 60 i believe). if the opponent is standing on the platform already bite is the best option although a clap can be more rewarding.

also your ftilt count should always be higher than your forward smash count. Ftilt is probably one of warios best kill options outside of waft and forward throw( although f tilt will kill earlier than f throw). use retreating pivot tilts to catch rolls and to just stay at a safe distance from your opponent.

up smash OoS is good for punishing unsafe/unspaced aerials on your shield. Up smash OoS is really good for punishing opponents sharking from below you if they do not space it correctly as well. utilizing the bike by the ledge to force a roll is also a good opportunity to use up smash since it yields higher killing power than down smash and is easier to connect than F smash

-C4 , highest ranked WIii U Wario on anthers (LOL)

 

[Ssbm_Jag]

I'm not going to completely disagree with the highest ranked Wario on Anther's Ladder lol, but I feel if you land 8 command grabs in one match (I read that you said they didn't all connect, but you intended them to) which should do at minimum 80-100 damage just off a single move, your opponent is very bad at fighting Wario. I wouldn't suggest abusing chomp against good players as they won't fall for it too many times. That doesn't mean you can't abuse it on bad players or even try to against Sonic or other match-ups you find fit. 8 times isn't ridiculously high, but I wouldn't ever suggest doubling the amount of times you use chomp.

If you used the Wario Bike 12.5 times in neutral and F-air only 7 times, I might also be a little concerned if you're doing that for every match-up, but if it works against your opponent, don't stop, just don't assume it'll work on every character. I say this all the time, but Wario is not a character who has a defined neutral game and must approach every character and player match-up differently. I would never suggest using a move more or less, but rather see what works for the match-up and use the mix-ups that you know work within the match-up.

Dash attack and u-smash should be used sparingly as they are extremely laggy and punishable move. I exclusively use Dash attack for edge-guarding and a punish on very few moves. I am trying to work on jab locks with it though. Glad you're thinking introspectively. Recording your matches might do better for you though if you're trying to see what works in a match-up or want to see your habits. Your move average count might quantify your play, but may not measure the quality of it.

This all being said, my credibility isn't anything special.

 

[C4-]

I'm not going to completely disagree with the highest ranked Wario on Anther's Ladder lol, but I feel if you land 8 command grabs in one match (I read that you said they didn't all connect, but you intended them to) which should do at minimum 80-100 damage just off a single move, your opponent is very bad at fighting Wario. I wouldn't suggest abusing chomp against good players as they won't fall for it too many times. That doesn't mean you can't abuse it on bad players or even try to against Sonic or other match-ups you find fit. 8 times isn't ridiculously high, but I wouldn't ever suggest doubling the amount of times you use chomp.

If you used the Wario Bike 12.5 times in neutral and F-air only 7 times, I might also be a little concerned if you're doing that for every match-up, but if it works against your opponent, don't stop, just don't assume it'll work on every character. I say this all the time, but Wario is not a character who has a defined neutral game and must approach every character and player match-up differently. I would never suggest using a move more or less, but rather see what works for the match-up and use the mix-ups that you know work within the match-up.

Dash attack and u-smash should be used sparingly as they are extremely laggy and punishable move. I exclusively use Dash attack for edge-guarding and a punish on very few moves. I am trying to work on jab locks with it though. Glad you're thinking introspectively. Recording your matches might do better for you though if you're trying to see what works in a match-up or want to see your habits. Your move average count might quantify your play, but may not measure the quality of it.

This all being said, my credibility isn't anything special.

Your right, in a sense ! My play style isn't the most optimal ( if you want to see optimal wario play watch reflex), I focus on limiting opponents options with bike and bite which accounts for me thinking his bite rate should be higher. I probably average 15 to 20 bites per 2 stock match. I also wouldn't say a player is bad at fighting wario if they are bitten multiple times, if you have a really strong mixup game and are on point with B reverses even good opponents struggle to deal with bite. In my opinion , It's definitely his second best move, first being waft of course. It's worth noting that bite isn't always a great choice against certain characters but for a majority of the cast , it is (IMO).

 

[Ssbm_Jag]

Fair enough, chomp is very good. I've already told everyone in my community though that if I miss a command grab, to charge an f-smash and wait for me to close my mouth and release. Regardless, they are so many ways to play Wario, some are very conservative with waft and let it mindgame their opponent, some go for half-waft. If chomp is your style go for it.