Is my Mario good?

[lvl 9]

I was looking at a game I had with my brother the other day, and could not figure out if my mario is good or he was just playing bad.

Take a look and tell me please.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifQ7EYZK-kw

 

[splat]

Hi lvl 9!

I don't think this is the place to ask this (general discussion is for, well, general discussion), I think you'll find more luck in the Mario subforums (Project M > Character Discussions > Mario). This thread seems to be made for questions like yours especially, though I'm not sure how active it is.

EDIT: Welp, you already posted there - 20 minutes before posting here. Why this topic as well, if I may ask?

 

[lvl 9]

Hi lvl 9!

I don't think this is the place to ask this (general discussion is for, well, general discussion), I think you'll find more luck in the Mario subforums (Project M > Character Discussions > Mario). This thread seems to be made for questions like yours especially, though I'm not sure how active it is.

EDIT: Welp, you already posted there - 20 minutes before posting here. Why this topic as well, if I may ask?

Sorry I am new to this whole thing. I don't know where to post things so i kinda just posted everywhere. Do I need to take it off?

 

[Saito]

He probably wants some criticism sooner than later.

Should wait till the morning though when all the Mario mains are awake.

--------------------------------

I'm no pro, nor do I consider myself that good but I can do a quick run down of what I think about the match.

You need to work on the timing on those Up B's so that you grab the edge instead of landing on the platform. That leads to punishes as shown in 0:37

Dash attacks are slow and usually punishable. You used a LOT of them in these matches. Try mixing up your approach game with wavedashes. (Try running at your opponent then wavedashing backwards to throw them off!)

4:45 you need to use down B to help you recover or wall jump out of Up-B as well.

You don't make use of short hopping or SHFFLing and those are techniques that are crucial to improving. I would suggest just starting with Short hopping aerial attacks.

Decent amount of L-Cancelling, always work on it a bit more though

You're running into obvious attacks and not reading your opponent well. He is a bit predictable but the attacks still connected.

Use that shield! I noticed you focus a lot on dodging the attacks but trust me, sometimes blocking them is even better since you can follow up with good punishes sometimes.

If I were to rate you, I'd give you an 8/10 on a casual level and a 4/10 on a competitive-casual level.
Don't take all my words for fact though, I hardly know what I'm talking about I think.

----------------------------------------------
Your opponent is at a level where most of your dash attacks will get through. Don't make a habit out of it though. If you fight someone who can punish it, you will get smashed.

Your opponent is also at a level where fireball spam would of worked wonders. Trust me though, you don't want to do that. I mean you will beat him, but he might quit.

Oh, and regarding wavedashing, I found a lovely video that shows you a few tricks. It's in japanese but actions speak louder than words.

 

[Rawkuz]

Next time post in character discussion. Ok onto your Mario.
Pros- you take advantage of marios speed. Thats it.(or maybe that bowser was just terrible)

Cons- Those UpBs are asking to get punished.
Need more fireballs.
No tech skills.

You need better competition to get better. If hes all youre gonna be playing with, youre gonna be stuck at that level. Hit up the Locator board and see if people around your area would like to get in on some of that smash action with you.

 

[OrangeSodaGuy]

He probably wants some criticism sooner than later.

Should wait till the morning though when all the Mario mains are awake.

--------------------------------

I'm no pro, nor do I consider myself that good but I can do a quick run down of what I think about the match.

You need to work on the timing on those Up B's so that you grab the edge instead of landing on the platform. That leads to punishes as shown in 0:37

Dash attacks are slow and usually punishable. You used a LOT of them in these matches. Try mixing up your approach game with wavedashes. (Try running at your opponent then wavedashing backwards to throw them off!)

4:45 you need to use down B to help you recover or wall jump out of Up-B as well.

You don't make use of short hopping or SHFFLing and those are techniques that are crucial to improving. I would suggest just starting with Short hopping aerial attacks.

Decent amount of L-Cancelling, always work on it a bit more though

You're running into obvious attacks and not reading your opponent well. He is a bit predictable but the attacks still connected.

Use that shield! I noticed you focus a lot on dodging the attacks but trust me, sometimes blocking them is even better since you can follow up with good punishes sometimes.

If I were to rate you, I'd give you an 8/10 on a casual level and a 4/10 on a competitive-casual level.
Don't take all my words for fact though, I hardly know what I'm talking about I think.

----------------------------------------------
Your opponent is at a level where most of your dash attacks will get through. Don't make a habit out of it though. If you fight someone who can punish it, you will get smashed.

Your opponent is also at a level where fireball spam would of worked wonders. Trust me though, you don't want to do that. I mean you will beat him, but he might quit.

Oh, and regarding wavedashing, I found a lovely video that shows you a few tricks. It's in japanese but actions speak louder than words.

^Good stuff!

As for me, I've been a Mario main since the Melee days.
I'm not a top-level player by any means, but there are some tips and tricks that could really help improve your game:

* As mentioned earlier, learning how to wavedash and shffl (short hop > fast-fall > l-cancelled aerial attacks) are crucial to staying in the game against high-level opponents.

Saito mentioned a great tactic- dash in and wavedash backwards to throw enemies off!
Dash-dancing is also a great way to move unpredictably as well.

* Make use of the cape! I noticed in your first match that there were a few opportunities to edgeguard Bowser with the cape. It also turns foes around completely, so you could use that against a charging opponent to seriously throw them off! (In P:M it actually reverses the foe's controls for a short moment.)

* Grab moar. Up throw can chainthrow fast falling characters like Fox and Falco, and you can also follow it up with up-tilts and shffl'd Up-airs! Down throws can be followed up with D-smash for easy and free damage against most characters as well.

* You can use Mario's down+B tornado to recover (you have to mash the button like crazy). I like to use this before using any of my jumps, especially if I'm pretty far from the edge.

* Mario can also wall-jump out of up-B.
Try to sweetspot (grab the edge with) your Up-B. Landing on the platform can be very laggy and gives enemies the perfect chance to get that killing blow.

* The dash attack leaves you wide open. I wouldn't use that too often if I were you.

* spam hella fireballs (unless you're fighting Game and Watch/Ness/Lucas/Spacies)

* space hella B-airs. This move is way more useful than it looks and has deceptive reach (something Mario really needs because his arms are short )

* Sometimes it pays to be patient. Don't be afraid to wait sometimes, especially against faster opponents. Watch your enemies and go in for the attacks while they're open!

* Watch pro players! You'll pick up plenty of other cool stuff that's not listed here!

Hope this helps!

OrangeSoda

 

[iLink]

Neither of you ever used your shield. Both of you would have had your dash attacks punished repeatedly if the other one would just do a shield grab.

 

[Smo]

Right, the things you should always be trying to improve are your technical ability, your ability to read your opponent and make smart choices, and your spacing. These things take practice and work.

However, just from watching this, there are a few things you can start applying right away that will improve your game tremendously without needing an awful lot of work:

• Learn to short hop. If you press jump quickly, you do a smaller hop, which allows you to attack close to the ground. Much faster and safer than a full jump
• Up B to the edge, not the stage. If you grab the edge, you are briefly invincible and much harder to hit.If you land on the stage, you are defenceless
• Shield. Shielding well is really important in Smash, and there's one technique you can apply easily to make your shielding even more effective — shield grab. If you hold shield and press attack, you will do a grab. This is your basic counter-attack — you shield to block the hit, then grab to punish your enemy.
• Don't rely on dash attack. Mario's dash attack is okay, but only in specific situations. For instance, if you can predict where your opponent is going to roll, dash attacking where he is about to end up can be okay.
• You are hardly ever using the Neutral Aerial (Nair) attack, but are instead relying on Fair (forward aerial) too much. You're quite good at connecting with it (on Bowser at least), but the Nair comes out a lot faster and is a lot safer for some of these situations. Upair and Bair are still better than your Nair, but I did spot a lot of times where a Nair would have been more appropriate than the Fair. I mean, Bowser got to 240% in the last game — you should have finished him off long before that, and a Nair out of shield would have done it.
• Jump when you use fireballs. Jumping while fireballing allows you to move around the stage as you fire, as well as varying the height and bounce to make the fireballs harder to dodge. Also, if you press left or right just before you fireball, you can turn around in midair with them — you can run away from your enemy, jump, press toward you enemy then fireball to throw fireballs while you escape.

Keep practising, keep learning, and until you're winning tournaments, don't think of yourself as ‘good’ — you can always improve.
You also need an opponent who is serious about improving. Your brother might be, I don't know, in which case he could use a few tips as well. If he's not serious about getting good, you need to find more people to play with.
The only way to get good at the game is to attend tournaments, in the end. This is the only time you'll be put in a high pressure situation where both you and your opponent are fuly focused on winning and nothing else. It's the true test of skill.

 

[Paradoxium]

You need to
Do footsies, with a mixture of dd and wave dash
Sweet spot the ledge with up b
Fire ball approach more
Tech
Shield and shield grab
Learn to use down-b when recovering
L-cancel
Bait the running A's and punish them (footsies)
Mix up your approaches

Not too shabby though
Keep up the good work

 

[DrinkingFood]

ITT: you're doing everything wrong but we're afraid of being honest at the risk of being offensive so we're gonna compliment you after telling you to completely change everything about how you play

come on guys really

 

[Saito]

ITT: you're doing everything wrong but we're afraid of being honest at the risk of being offensive so we're gonna compliment you after telling you to complete change everything about how you play

come on guys really

I hope I don't fall into that category since "competitive casual" isn't even at competitive level yet and I gave him a 4/10 on that.

 

[Burnsy]

Everything you are doing is wrong.

There is that better DrinkingFood? He should find this helpful. But most importantly, it's brutally honest, the best kind.

 

[DrinkingFood]

Everything you are doing is wrong.

There is that better DrinkingFood? He should find this helpful. But most importantly, is brutally honest, the best kind.

thank you for misconstruing the point of my post

"Everything you are doing is wrong" by itself is better than "Wow that's pretty good!" by itself, yes
in the same way, the former in addition to constructive criticism is better than the latter in addition to constructive criticism

 

[Paradoxium]

thank you for misconstruing the point of my post

"Everything you are doing is wrong" by itself is better than "Wow that's pretty good!" by itself, yes
in the same way, the former in addition to constructive criticism is better than the latter in addition to constructive criticism

Hey lvl 9 you ****ing SUCK! Lol such a noob, GO KILL YOURSELF YOU SUCK AND NO ONE WANTS YOU HERE! I've honestly seen first graders play better than you, just give up, your so bad that no amount of practice will ever make you better. Just delete pm of your ad card, it's just a waste of space at this point, your such garbage, no wonder your name is lvl 9

Is that better DrinkingFood? We should do this to everyone who asks for help, it would definitely make them want to keep practicing

 

[210stuna]

Oh...

Well then.

 

[Pwnz0rz Man]

The best thing you could do at the moment to improve is to watch some decently high level players play him, see how they play, figure out why they do things the way that they do, and try to adapt your play in a similar fashion. Having others point out your shortcomings might seem like a good idea, but it can also be very discouraging if you're not up to accepting what they have to say.

DrinkingFood had a point in what he said, even if others didn't appreciate the way he said it. If it were me asking for advice and I were doing absolutely everything wrong in the eyes of another, I'd want to know my shortcomings so I can work on them. I don't think that we as players should be afraid of flat-out saying "You're doing it all wrong".

Saying something along the lines of "You're doing very well and here's how you can improve further", might have the negative side-effects of making a person think that their basics are on the right track, keeping them playing very similarly while trying to add advanced techniques. It might sound silly, but still, It's completely dependent on the person though and I'm not sure how the OP would take comments like that. Basically you have the possibility of being damned either way, so we may as well be completely honest instead of hemming and hawing like we just ran over someone's cat/dog/duck/other pet that I'd feel bad for running over. Of course, I'm not saying that we should flame and abuse people, just be completely honest with our responses.

 

[DrinkingFood]

thank you for misconstruing the point of my post

Hey lvl 9 you ****ing SUCK! Lol such a noob, GO KILL YOURSELF YOU SUCK AND NO ONE WANTS YOU HERE! I've honestly seen first graders play better than you, just give up, your so bad that no amount of practice will ever make you better. Just delete pm of your ad card, it's just a waste of space at this point, your such garbage, no wonder your name is lvl 9

Is that better DrinkingFood? We should do this to everyone who asks for help, it would definitely make them want to keep practicing

tell me that's an elaborate joke

I don't think that we as players should be afraid of flat-out saying "You're doing it all wrong".


Saying something along the lines of "You're doing very well and here's how you can improve further", might have the negative side-effects of making a person think that their basics are on the right track, keeping them playing very similarly while trying to add advanced techniques.

Thank you for getting it

 

[GeZ]

I agree with DrinkingFood. lvl9's game needs an overhaul, and beginning with "this is good, I like this, good job" isn't helping that.

Gotta be willing to be harsh if you want to help other players improve.

 

[hand]

Your Mario isn't anywhere near the competetive level of play.
I suggest you to watch and learn everything shown in "Super Smash Bros. Melee: Advanced How To Play"
Just look for that on YouTube or Smashboards (which will lead you to YouTube eventually lol)
Trust me, it helps a lot!

 

[Yeerk]

And this is why these are kept to the character pages.

 

[GeZ]

And this is why these are kept to the character pages.

It was already covered better than this in the character pages, it still isn't terrible to get input here til the thread shuts down. Besides, now he knows not to open these threads anywhere but the character pages.

 

[Yeerk]

It was already covered better than this in the character pages

You just made my point. Also, I was referring to the bickering going on in this thread.

 

[GeZ]

You just made my point. Also, I was referring to the bickering going on in this thread.

Nothing like a good bicker. Helps keep everyone's heads attached to their necks. If we can't bicker how do we reason? Like animals? Shouting and cooing and accusing? Or like Men (and women)! Shouting and cooing and accusing!

 

[Yeerk]

Uhhhh. We reason with REASON, not mocking one another. And in case you missed it, there WAS some shouting and accusing going on in this thread.

Also, what does GeZ stand for?

 

[GeZ]

Uhhhh. We reason with REASON, not mocking one another. And in case you missed it, there WAS some shouting and accusing going on in this thread.

Also, what does GeZ stand for?

I know, I know, it's just jokes. Still think there's something to be said for not sugar coating critique. And I think everyone should be open to a good mocking. If it's well thought out enough it deserves some acknowledgement, and I'm a sucker for good word choice.

Also I wish to hell I knew what GeZ stood for. I used the tag "Z" for ever and changed it to "GeZ" one day because I thought it looked better, but it doesn't stand for anything. It's just a stupid, uncomfortable to pronounce, name.

 

[Yeerk]

I see where you're coming from. Haha I thought you were maybe quoting something with that "cooing" bit.

For the record I'm not defending either side on this. Sure, you should be able to laugh at yourself, but there's an easily reached middle ground between sugar coating and pure degradation, and it still manages to be encouraging and constructive at the same time.

Either way, we're running the thread off topic, but is that really a crime in a thread posted to the wrong subforum?

 

[Phaiyte]

Smash isn't Smash without salty bicker

 

[CORY]

Oh, and regarding wavedashing, I found a lovely video that shows you a few tricks. It's in japanese but actions speak louder than words.

this is probably the best teaching video i've ever seen : O for anything. even if you don't understand the language, it just shows everything in a clear step by step method, holy crap, it's so good!