i am not sure if this is the right place to ask, but i have two questions.

[guedes the brawler]

I tried looking over the forums, nd it did not seem to have a right place for those... but if i'm worng, it'd be nice if i was kindly sent to the right forum.

well, my first question: Will there be a way to port Roy and Mewtwo (and possibly other new P:M additions) to vBrawl? I like what project m does, it's loads of fun! ... but i want to use those two in vBrawl too, even though they were built for P:M.


The next one i think, only those invloved with making the mod would be able to answer but... well.

Second question: Are you guys going to adapt single player modes for those characters to work? Like, an icon to choose them for SSE, Their mugshots in the All-Star/Classic screens, and both normal and FS trophies for them (i think that the game would hang if one beats one of the above modes and there is no trophy.

I know that none of those are priorities, but are they going to be left alone?

Lastly... i had another question, but i forgot what it was... oh well.

 

[Mithost]

Porting Roy and Mewtwo from P:M to Brawl will take the same amount of effort as porting the brawl roster to P:M. As you can see by the unfinished P:M Roster, this process is not easy. The clone engine might not be able to make the transition well either.

For classic, all-star, event, and stadium modes, clone engine characters should be able to be used. The clone engine clones battle portraits and other metadata found in different files, so I think it's safe to assume the stock icons and that stuff is there as well. As for trophies... I'm not sure. You might just unlock the existing Roy and Mewtwo trophies when you beat their single player modes.

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

Porting Roy and Mewtwo from P:M to Brawl will take the same amount of effort as porting the brawl roster to P:M.

wrong, it will take more effort. they would have to recreate the cloning engine and (if they didn`t want them to be op) completely remake them so that they would be more like the rest of the brawl cast.

 

[Diddy Kong]

You can still replace a current character for Mewtwo or Roy, or possibly both if you want.

 

[Mithost]

wrong, it will take more effort. they would have to recreate the cloning engine and (if they didn`t want them to be op) completely remake them so that they would be more like the rest of the brawl cast.

All the characters have to be remade when they are ported from brawl to P:M. It would be the same in that regard. I stated that the Clone Engine probably won't be friendly, but they WON'T have to make it from scratch.

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

All the characters have to be remade when they are ported from brawl to P:M. It would be the same in that regard. I stated that the Clone Engine probably won't be friendly, but they WON'T have to make it from scratch.

they don`t HAVE to be remade (aside from samus because of her z-air bug) they could just let use play the unfinished characters, but they would be identical to there brawl selves and absolutely suck. I remember a PMBR member saying in a youtube comment that "It will probably take years to make a clone engine that works with vbrawl, because we would have to make it from scratch"

 

[a vehicle]

This thread is pretty sad.
I wanted brawl to be a good game too y'know? I wanted to have the same thrill melee and SM64 gave me with single player modes.
That being said, I don't think there'll ever be a way to port new characters into vBrawl without replacing the old ones (correct me if I'm wrong) but I recall reading somewhere that the clone engine code wont be open source and therefore no other modders would have access to it? Anyhow you can always download mods to replace current characters with other ones and have different movesents, but those are fan made and are pretty buggy/imbalanced.
P:M is more focused on player vs player content right now, but don't lose hope

@Mithost
Are you sure of what you're talking about? You seem to know a lot for someone who didn't have anything to do with any of those things

 

[Mithost]

I am currently in the game development and design course at my college, and I've done some PSA work before. I do not work for the PMBR, but I understand that in any game, porting files from one physics setting to another will rarely cause playable results. I know that every bit of knockback, hitstun, jump height, and special trajectory (fox's side B, most UpBs, etc.) values are completely different between P:M and Brawl, and they do not mesh well at all.

You can't expect Brawl characters to function under P:M's Physics, and you can't expect a P:M character to function under Brawl's Physics. If you load up an event match that uses an unfinished character, you can see that those characters (using the brawl data) cannot jump, and most of their moves either kill extremely early (10-20%) and/or send themselves flying due to the move making the character move around. If you take a P:M tweaked character's FitMotion.pac and FitFighter.pac files and load them into vBrawl, you will see that jumps go much higher than usual, attacks deal little/no knockback, grabs and throws don't line up correctly, and command grabs will usually fail.

When the PMBR makes characters, there is more work than just making new moves and balancing. Look at King Dedede. in 2.1, his moveset was almost identical to vBrawl's moveset. However, if you loaded his files into vBrawl, you wouldn't be playing a functional character. The same thing will occur when you put Roy or Mewtwo in brawl.

To port Roy or Mewtwo into brawl, you have to redo all of their knockback, jump, and hitstun values. If one of their moves (Mewtwo's Confusion for instance) has a bug that only comes up when you take away P:M's extra code, you have to patch that. If you have ever programmed something complex before, you will know that this is not a simple process, and the bug fix can cause four other bugs to appear somewhere else. It takes a while.

About porting the actual Clone Engine over, I am estimating that it doesn't need to be "redone" because when it comes to lines of code and variables in how the game loads characters before gameplay, a large majority of the code should be the same*. The files in vBrawl are in the same location as the character files in P:M. You are editing the vBrawl, no matter what you did to the physics. I can't confirm this because I am not a member of the PMBR, but as long as P:M can still be loaded via the SD card (and not a custom Brawl ISO), I feel like this is at least somewhat correct.

*This is dependant on if the PMBR has done any revamps to how characters are loaded ASIDE from the clone engine's code

 

[guedes the brawler]

. If you load up an event match that uses an unfinished character, you can see that those characters (using the brawl data) cannot jump, and most of their moves either kill extremely early (10-20%) and/or send themselves flying due to the move making the character move around. If you take a P:M tweaked character's FitMotion.pac and FitFighter.pac files and load them into vBrawl, you will see that jumps go much higher than usual, attacks deal little/no knockback, grabs and throws don't line up correctly, and command grabs will usually fail.

wait, what? I remember trying out Yoshi, Olimar and Samus via event matches and they were fine!

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

wait, what? I remember trying out Yoshi, Olimar and Samus via event matches and they were fine!

work fine for me too.

 

[standardtoaster]

that happened in previous demos

 

[a vehicle]

@Mithost
You're assuming a lot of things. Also non-available characters are playable in some 1P modes and they're somewhat playable, not as broken and you're saying.
If the P:M were to release the clone engine to the public I'm sure it would be a matter of days until 100 new character submissions appear everywhere for vBrawl.

If you have ever programmed something complex before, you will know that this is not a simple process, and the bug fix can cause four other bugs to appear somewhere else. It takes a while.

Only if you mess around with global mechanics, which is rather unusual when creating a single character. Most of the mechanics already exist in the game and the developers only have to find a way for X character to have them. So no, I've never experienced things unrelated to what I'm working on to change randomly unless I know I'm somewhat messing around with them, that would only happen if you're a really lazy programmer or extremely unorganised, and there's a whole science that focuses on how to write good code in order to make your code as modular as possible.
Like for example Ivy's down-B, they didn't have to code some new stun mechanic for this single move, they re-used the stun already incorporated in-game, they just have to make sure it stuns the opponent.

 

[Mithost]

that happened in previous demos

^^^
Sorry, didn't know it was 'fixed'.

I am assuming a lot, but I'm also trying to answer the first question. To be short, you can't take the P:M files for the new characters and plunk them into vBrawl because they were made using P:M's mechanics and physics. About the clone engine, I don't believe they have to "re-code" it if they want to integrate into vBrawl. P:M is a collection of codes (and character files) that are added to the unmodified vBrawl ISO found on the disc, so the clone engine should be able to be added to the unmodified vBrawl ISO without all the intricacies that P:M adds to other parts of the game (character movesets, the stage striking system, turbo).

 

[guedes the brawler]

so, in a nutshell, unless the clone engine is made publi, there's no hope for me to port Roy, Mewtwo and other possibly new characters without sacrificing one of the 39 already in brawl... did i get it right?

but hey, even if the CE is made public, would there be a way to get the exact same Roy and Mewtwo from P:M over to vBrawl?

 

[Mithost]

so, in a nutshell, unless the clone engine is made publi, there's no hope for me to port Roy, Mewtwo and other possibly new characters without sacrificing one of the 39 already in brawl... did i get it right?

but hey, even if the CE is made public, would there be a way to get the exact same Roy and Mewtwo from P:M over to vBrawl?

You are correct there.

It is physically possible to get P:M's Roy and Mewtwo in vBrawl, but someone is going to have to tweak their attacks/jumps/recoveries so they work with brawl physics.

 

[guedes the brawler]

damn... well, i just have to hope that happens then... sigh....

thanks for the help everyone.

 

[Paradoxium]

damn... well, i just have to hope that happens then... sigh....

thanks for the help everyone.

hey, you can basically count on the pmbr fixing 1 player and coop modes, they are focusing on the versus mode at the moment but in the future they are planning on having a complete game.

and i know you would rather play brawl but like, pm is loads of fun so playing those 2 in pm isnt all that bad

 

[guedes the brawler]

hey, you can basically count on the pmbr fixing 1 player and coop modes, they are focusing on the versus mode at the moment but in the future they are planning on having a complete game.

and i know you would rather play brawl but like, pm is loads of fun so playing those 2 in pm isnt all that bad

The thing is, i think P:M is awesome... but i'm not a pro. i'm skilled enough to own Lv9s in both games, sure, but when i try to do that in P:M... they use those weird advanced techs from melee that i really dislike, so yeah. i don't have anyone else to play with, and having CPU doing those things would be... not fun for me.

That and the fact that i do something called a "custom all-star mode". With a bit of a smart use of the Handicap feature, i try to emulate Melee's all-star mode in Brawl, and it works and is really fun! But P:M also changed far too many stages for me to do that properly again (Each character has their own stage like in Melee's, so the changes get in my way)

It's cool to boot it up now and then, but what can i do? it's just not for me...

 

[Jade_Rock55]

Would there be a way to replace a vbrawl character with this Roy and Mewtwo?The pm ones not the ones from brawl vault.

I know there would be problems,but I can use psa to change jumps,fall speed etc.

 

[Xinc]

Would there be a way to replace a vbrawl character with this Roy and Mewtwo?The pm ones not the ones from brawl vault.

I know there would be problems,but I can use psa to change jumps,fall speed etc.

Yes, you can.

I also believe that the clone engine, once made public if ever by the PMBR, can work well with Brawl. The main problem is making the character slots on the character select screen. According to my knowledge, characters use the fighter folder and the clone engine "creates" the clones alongside the fighter folder, but I could be wrong. This makes sense to me in theory. Doesn't mean it'll work practically.

 

[Jade_Rock55]

Ok thanks I guess I'll just wait for it to be made public

EDIT:So wait does that mean I can take roy.pacs and rename them to marth.pacs and it will work in vbrawl?

I doubt it is that simple though...

 

[guedes the brawler]

Ok thanks I guess I'll just wait for it to be made public

EDIT:So wait does that mean I can take roy.pacs and rename them to marth.pacs and it will work in vbrawl?

I doubt it is that simple though...

 

[a vehicle]

No.

Everyone stop assuming things or giving wrong advice because you "believe it works that way" or "it would make sense". You're helping no one with your "know it all" comments

 

[Lukingordex]

wait, what? I remember trying out Yoshi, Olimar and Samus via event matches and they were fine!

Yoshi isn't fine,if you air dodge with him,he will do a brawl air dodge,after that,he will be stuck in a "numb animation* where he can't do anything until he touches the ground,and there's no indication that he's helpless.

 

[guedes the brawler]

Yoshi isn't fine,if you air dodge with him,he will do a brawl air dodge,after that,he will be stuck in a "numb animation* where he can't do anything until he touches the ground,and there's no indication that he's helpless.

well, that makes sense, he doesn't have the helpless aniamtion and the game has new airdodge mechanics, so what you can do? i'm sure that R.O.B would have the same issue if he wasn't already in P:M

but in "fine" i mean you can play with him without the game hanging or something.

 

[Nguz95]

Ok thanks I guess I'll just wait for it to be made public

EDIT:So wait does that mean I can take roy.pacs and rename them to marth.pacs and it will work in vbrawl?

I doubt it is that simple though...

That's a whole can of worms you don't want to open. PM has significantly changed the engine in Brawl, which means that there's no going between the two. However, there are several Mewtwo and Roy PSAs available on Brawl Vault. If you are interested I can direct you to the right place.

 

[Xinc]

No.

Everyone stop assuming things or giving wrong advice because you "believe it works that way" or "it would make sense". You're helping no one with your "know it all" comments

No need to be mad. It's all speculation.

 

[Jade_Rock55]

That's a whole can of worms you don't want to open. PM has significantly changed the engine in Brawl, which means that there's no going between the two. However, there are several Mewtwo and Roy PSAs available on Brawl Vault. If you are interested I can direct you to the right place.

I figured it wouldn't work in vbrawl,maybe someone will figure it out one day...

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

No need to be mad. It's all speculation.

I think he isn`t mad about the speculation, but the fact that some people are trying to make it sound like what they say is fact.

 

[guedes the brawler]

I think he isn`t mad about the speculation, but the fact that some people are trying to make it sound like what they say is fact.

 

[Chzrm3]

I think he isn`t mad about the speculation, but the fact that some people are trying to make it sound like what they say is fact.

I don't think anyone's intentionally trying to do that. : P It's just... how people talk.

Ain't nuthin' but a thang.