How to improve? Matchmaking seems useless...

[CharZane]

I've been playing smash since 64, with hundreds of hours into each, but I've never had the multiplayer audience available to actually get real practice like smash 4 offers. Problem is, the matchmaking is absolutely worthless... I've fought exactly one person, ever, who wasn't leagues beyond or literally suiciding out of stupidity that didn't leave immediately after a close game. Getting 2-stocked five games in a row teaches nothing, as does 2-stocking someone else without throwing a single freaking punch, yet I can't learn and develop a damn counter-strategy or feel out the timing when I only get a single game before someone switches characters to mock me or outright leaves. 2 lives pretty much guarantees any catching on I might do against some superior method will always be too late to matter relative to the match, and then there's always things that, by their nature, seem impossible to counterplay, like counters or projectile walls. I'm nowhere near good enough to be hitting some strict character limitation, so what the actual hell is wrong? I'll play fifty little macs in the span of a day and /still/ be unable to best the matchup through any progress-- it's still just a 50-50 from the sheer fact of them suiciding. I was downright decent at melee, but now, even when experience against someone has their moves feeling obvious an hour in advance, I can't for the life of me translate that into actually doing any better against them.

Why? Conceptually, I can follow their methods, and it's not that I'm reacting too slowly or that I'm unfamiliar with the mechanics-- yet, no matter my efforts, my opponents only ever seem bested by monumental stupidity nine times out of ten, rather than any improvement on my part.

What can I do about matchmaking, if anything, to get useful practice rather than alternating obliterations, and how can I apply the fact that I know my foe's next twelve moves into actually punishing them? Is For Glory just a crapshoot? Is my social isolation really going to even keep me from dedicated improvement at gaming, now? I'll put as much time and effort into anything I need to for the sake of improving, but I'm banging my head into a metaphorical wall enough as-is to be compelled into literally doing so, at this point. ._.

tl; dr: How can I practice?

 

[SwoodGrommet]

If you feel as though 2 stocks isn't enough time to learn your mistakes, why don't you try saving a replay of a match by pressing Y at the results screen, and then review it later on. Study the match and take a mental note of your mistakes, why you lost, what you should have done and how to improve in the future.

 

[SevenYearItch]

Either play with people on here in the 3DS Code sharing thread, or get 2 stocked and learn. There's no way you're learning and reacting right and still getting 2 stocked over and over and over again to the point where its the same match and you're not learning. Its something you're doing. Save the replays and watch where they picked at you and shore that up. Create a mind game out of it.

Ideally, sparring with people from the forum is worth while because they can straight up tell you after the match what needs to be done if they smash you that bad. I personally learn from getting beat on so thats where I go.

 

[CosmicFuzz]

Get to know the community in your area and regularly chat and play with them. There's nothing like learning your mistakes than someone showing you exactly what you're doing wrong.

If that's not an option, do what Itch suggested and get some friend codes on here.

 

[Vade]

I've had some more positive learning experiences playing with players I meet here with 3 stock 8 minute (or endless), for glory is nice when you don't have this alternative. I suggest playing with other players in the 3ds code share and even then they could critique your play and tell you how to improve.

 

[iNoobtacular]

If you feel as though 2 stocks isn't enough time to learn your mistakes, why don't you try saving a replay of a match by pressing Y at the results screen, and then review it later on. Study the match and take a mental note of your mistakes, why you lost, what you should have done and how to improve in the future.

This.

Also, if you're really restricted to online play. search around for Online tournmaets for the game. I know Captain Norris and Speedy are hosting one on this Forum. There are usually facebook groups dedicated to specific things like this. You could also start a group with members that revolve around helping one another get outa their bad habits. I'd say go back and forth between playing With friends and playing For glory. For glory helpswith your critical thinking skills and adjusting. You'll start to be able to pick up on patters and make mental notes very quickly as time progresses and you emphasize on fundamental play. The from there, go back to your For Friends peeps and get some good matches in with them. Also head over to the social thread and request matches with people who play specific characters. That's pretty much what I do since I'm restricted solely to online play thanks to where i live.

 

[Terotrous]

Do player matches against other people. Besides allowing you to find people of comparable skill and play against them enough times to learn some things about the matchup, you can also talk to them after the matchup and you may be able to get some good advice.

 

[mangamusicfan]

Personaly i think the 2 stocks are enough.
And I really love the matchmaking here ist so gast!

 

[CharZane]

I'd have to agree with 2 stocks feeling like so little time to adapt to someone-- particularly given that the first stock of mine in any given first-game is often a guaranteed death on my part. So used to the 4 stock games, but 3 makes more sense for the longer lives in smash 4.

There's exactly zero people within a half-hour-drive that're within five years of me age-wise, and the only one within ten is an ex. Online's pretty much my only method, though I don't have any more online sparring partners than offline-- which seems like a major part of the problem... I have some friend codes, but nothing strikes me as convenient for coordinating games or communicating, given the 3ds's lack of message system or invite ping and that so much as speaking to someone via, say, skype tends to just have people insulting me. >//<

But yeah, my friend-code thing should on my cardamajig, and anyone's free to contact-request on Skype or such to text-message if looking to play-- if that's a practical method. Will add anyone who's up for playing, in any case, though I'm obviously not that good to be making such a thread. ^^"

I don't mind voice chat in skype, so long as I'm not bullied over it-- being post-op trans has understandably been a living hell as far as even remotely attempting voice goes in games. Aaand apparently, this is oversharing hour for me...

 

[AshBoomstick]

I have found some great ways to reduce lag in online play from extensive research online and trial and error. I have gone from unplayable lag for days to near perfect matches now with these steps.
1. Plug your system into power while playing online so the 3ds does not have to focus on power consumption and can focus on the wi fi connection.
2. Turn off all wi fi devices even if they are not in use. That i pad, vita, phone, or anything with a wi fi connection is taking down your signal by just being in stand by. Turn them all off completely for the best connection.
3. Make sure your router is in a nice elevated open area of your living area to ensure a clean broadcast of your signal.
4. Sit close to your router that is broadcasting your wi fi. I found that sitting in my chair that was just slightly behind a corner wall area of the same room just 15 feet away was still not close enough. The couch litteraly 1 foot from the router providedal a world of difference since the signal did not have to bounce all around the room to reach me.
5. Do not use the microwave.
6. Try to find friends online to play matches with since the connection to those matches are better then playing randoms.

My friend code: 2809 7728 1923
Let me know with a message if you add me and I hope this provides you with a better training environment online!

 

[CharZane]

Oh, I'd been playing only a few feet from my router, but I hadn't even noticed that when I'd gotten lag had only been when the system wasn't charging-- oft forget that not everything's going to be like my laptop and set to maximize net-speed... Though, thinking of it, my lag's not been that frequent even with my laptop on right next to me most times I play.

But right, added-- and thanks for the lag-kill ideas. Hopefully I can nab a wired adapter for the Wii U as to take advantage of my whole dedicated fiber optic line nonsense (certainly a bit silly if I were to connect everything wirelessly...). My friend code's 5000-2687-3781; though, its posted on the left there, so now I feel redundant. ^^"

 

[Hina]

I'd totally play with you if you want. I'm not super good so I won't be hurting your self-esteem but I'm good enough to not be worthless, I think

I have like all the time every day so there's no need to rush or anything.

 

[CharZane]

Added! I tend to be on fairly often, but I'm not sure how coordinating play would work... my skype is 'Zaneshift', if that's of any help in pinging me with a message (tend to be on smashboards pretty often of-late, though, as well).

 

[FireKingX]

Added you!

I'm also trying to improve in this game but I feel quite lost especially since online is my only option.

I'm new to Smash in general even if I played a bit of Brawl years ago.

Hopefully I can provide a bit of a challenge

 

[CharZane]

Added as well-- I'd mostly played melee prior, so most of what I knew rusted away, personally. >//<

I've been making the tiniest, tiniest shreds of improvement, at least... it's just maddening to have so little information on the game-- I think it's more that I don't have a real 'goal' to set for matchups or anything beyond 'at least don't get falcon punched'. Still, progress is progress, no matter how hard it is for me to tell. ^^"

 

[iNoobtacular]

Added as well-- I'd mostly played melee prior, so most of what I knew rusted away, personally. >//<

I've been making the tiniest, tiniest shreds of improvement, at least... it's just maddening to have so little information on the game-- I think it's more that I don't have a real 'goal' to set for matchups or anything beyond 'at least don't get falcon punched'. Still, progress is progress, no matter how hard it is for me to tell. ^^"

My friend code is 1075-2152-6416. I have no problem helping you learn how to fight. DK, Mac and Mario. I'll add you in a few. just messege me when you add back. We'll establish a format then convey.

 

[p4k|wyatt]

I've been playing smash since 64, with hundreds of hours into each, but I've never had the multiplayer audience available to actually get real practice like smash 4 offers. Problem is, the matchmaking is absolutely worthless... I've fought exactly one person, ever, who wasn't leagues beyond or literally suiciding out of stupidity that didn't leave immediately after a close game. Getting 2-stocked five games in a row teaches nothing, as does 2-stocking someone else without throwing a single freaking punch, yet I can't learn and develop a damn counter-strategy or feel out the timing when I only get a single game before someone switches characters to mock me or outright leaves. 2 lives pretty much guarantees any catching on I might do against some superior method will always be too late to matter relative to the match, and then there's always things that, by their nature, seem impossible to counterplay, like counters or projectile walls. I'm nowhere near good enough to be hitting some strict character limitation, so what the actual hell is wrong? I'll play fifty little macs in the span of a day and /still/ be unable to best the matchup through any progress-- it's still just a 50-50 from the sheer fact of them suiciding. I was downright decent at melee, but now, even when experience against someone has their moves feeling obvious an hour in advance, I can't for the life of me translate that into actually doing any better against them.

Why? Conceptually, I can follow their methods, and it's not that I'm reacting too slowly or that I'm unfamiliar with the mechanics-- yet, no matter my efforts, my opponents only ever seem bested by monumental stupidity nine times out of ten, rather than any improvement on my part.

What can I do about matchmaking, if anything, to get useful practice rather than alternating obliterations, and how can I apply the fact that I know my foe's next twelve moves into actually punishing them? Is For Glory just a crapshoot? Is my social isolation really going to even keep me from dedicated improvement at gaming, now? I'll put as much time and effort into anything I need to for the sake of improving, but I'm banging my head into a metaphorical wall enough as-is to be compelled into literally doing so, at this point. ._.

tl; dr: How can I practice?

Rather than trying to improve everything at once, you need to break your improvement into bite sized pieces. Save a replay or ten of you losing, and watch them the next day. Watch for your mistakes, and look for patterns. Find a consistent mistake, and go play 10 games of matchmaking, and focus on NOT MAKING THAT MISTAKE. Do NOT focus on winning or losing, but focus on that simple aspect of your play. Practicing is not about winning. Improving is not about winning. Winning is the end result, something you should hope to achieve after much much practice and LOSING. Nobody is ever "too good" to teach you anything.

As for feeling like you don't actually beat any of your opponents and they just lose to themselves, you need to shake that feeling. The amount of practice and learning you have done is paying off, and thats why they lose and you win - Theoretically, any win should feel like this; it should feel like you won simply because you have practiced and learned more than your opponent.

 

[CharZane]

My friend code is 1075-2152-6416. I have no problem helping you learn how to fight. DK, Mac and Mario. I'll add you in a few. just messege me when you add back. We'll establish a format then convey.

Added-- I'd intended to solo-main Robin, but trying Lucina after so many hours of Ganon-speed feels so cathartic that I'm picking her up as at least a duo-main sort of deal. Might drop one or the other or adopt more 'secondary' characters at some point, but I think this'll help for now.

Rather than trying to improve everything at once, you need to break your improvement into bite sized pieces. Save a replay or ten of you losing, and watch them the next day. Watch for your mistakes, and look for patterns. Find a consistent mistake, and go play 10 games of matchmaking, and focus on NOT MAKING THAT MISTAKE. Do NOT focus on winning or losing, but focus on that simple aspect of your play. Practicing is not about winning. Improving is not about winning. Winning is the end result, something you should hope to achieve after much much practice and LOSING. Nobody is ever "too good" to teach you anything.

As for feeling like you don't actually beat any of your opponents and they just lose to themselves, you need to shake that feeling. The amount of practice and learning you have done is paying off, and thats why they lose and you win - Theoretically, any win should feel like this; it should feel like you won simply because you have practiced and learned more than your opponent.

That's been how I've always addressed games like Pokemon and Starcraft, but the problem's always been that, even though I see the problems, I don't see the usual 'better alternatives'. That said, I recently tried Lucina, and all the practice at Robin makes Lucina feel so easy to pick up by comparison (even though I'm technically better with Robin at this point, according to my benchmarks). Knowing exactly how to remedy my mistakes (given my old experiences with melee Marth) is such a relief...

But I'd gotten some advice that makes quite a bit of sense in that I'm psyching myself out FAR too much-- I need to focus on playing rather than let it be some cause for stress by worrying about it. ^^

 

[p4k|wyatt]

Added-- I'd intended to solo-main Robin, but trying Lucina after so many hours of Ganon-speed feels so cathartic that I'm picking her up as at least a duo-main sort of deal. Might drop one or the other or adopt more 'secondary' characters at some point, but I think this'll help for now.


That's been how I've always addressed games like Pokemon and Starcraft, but the problem's always been that, even though I see the problems, I don't see the usual 'better alternatives'. That said, I recently tried Lucina, and all the practice at Robin makes Lucina feel so easy to pick up by comparison (even though I'm technically better with Robin at this point, according to my benchmarks). Knowing exactly how to remedy my mistakes (given my old experiences with melee Marth) is such a relief...

But I'd gotten some advice that makes quite a bit of sense in that I'm psyching myself out FAR too much-- I need to focus on playing rather than let it be some cause for stress by worrying about it. ^^

If you are coming from a starcraft background, you should know the best way to learn how you should be doing something is to analyze pro players! I played a lot of starcraft for a long time and got alright at it, and the key thing you need to do when you have questions is go see how pro players do it.

 

[iNoobtacular]

Yea man, you gotta calmly approach every match you get into so you can assess the situation and act accordingly. You overthink it you can't focus on the match and you just get flustered.

 

[CharZane]

The problem I've had seems to be just that I was using a character I might not be suited for, much as it pains me to say it. My frustrations seemed to stem from perceived limitations, when it's really just that my particular playstyle isn't meshing well enough. Perhaps I'm just a bit burnt ut on Robin, but I'm going to try Lucina for a bit-- moving as below-Ganon speeds has this feeling rather nostalgic now. Cross-training between characters will certainly be of help, methinks-- and it gives me some room to figure matchups out from more than just Robin's angles, for that matter.

 

[Pocket Freye]

Heya, I'll practice with ya!. 0018 2697 0732 I'm a little sleep deprieved today, but I'm up for smash anytime.

 

[CharZane]

Added-- and I think my new 'main' is just going to be 'Fire Emblem'. ^^"

Also cursing Nintendo on a daily basis for Final Destination being the only For Glory map... Battlefield must feel like Gaur Plains to a Little Mac. :S

 

[Pocket Freye]

Awesome! Fire Emblem is pretty much my main too lel. You up for some games right now? I can play for a little bit before work.