How do you teach your friends how to Smash?

[Zionaze]

I have 2 friends that I regularly play smash with. Both of them ask me to coach them to get better.
Friend-A has a basic understanding on how the game works and can analyze the situation to make good reads.
Friend-B doesn't understand a single smash acronym such as N-air and likes characters with spammable projectiles and counters for easy damage.
Coaching Friend-A is really easy because I can tell him to do a B-air instead of a D-air and he'll understand what I'm talking about while Friend-B needs a through explanation on why "Holding the analog stick on the opposite direction of where your facing in the air and pressing A" is better than D-air. Another problem is that he forgets everything I tell him the next day, causing an infinite loop of misery.

Where do I start? How can I help Friend-B get better?

 

[Nixon Corral]

Man, this is a good question. I have a small group of friends that are pretty good at Smash, and a lot of times people get turned away from learning/playing with us because it's kind of hard for beginners to get started playing against only good people. Would love some advice on how to make that process better.

As for friend B, he sounds like kind of a lost cause. Has he played many other video games?

 

[Zionaze]

He plays games like Battlefield and LoL so no real experience with fighting games

 

[Kurri ★]

I think the question then is, does Friend B have an understanding of those games? If they play those games extremely casually, not actually trying to improve (which isn't a problem mind you, just wanting to have fun is okay), then it's probably is best to leave them be until they want to get better.

But if they don't, then all hope isn't too lost. Admittedly I'm not the best teacher, more of a student really, but sometimes I learn best by playing dittos. If you're going to play the same character as me and beat me, you're obviously doing something with that character better than I am.

 

[Zionaze]

Friend-B is kind of slow in terms of understanding the fundamentals of a game in general but sincerely wants to get into the competitive smash scene.
Another problem he has is physically inputting the commands. When I tell him to space with SH-Fairs, he will do FH-Fairs instead,
or using tilts instead of smash.

 

[GideonSmash]

I have exactly a kind of Friend-B that I play smash with regularly and it annoys me a lot that he doesn't want to learn anything or just forgets.... He still doesn't know how to shield or grab or airdodge even though I have told him so many times! I would like some advice too

 

[Kurri ★]

Hmm... I sound a lot like your friend, just replace LoL with Dota.

Well in that case, slow it down. Try one, or a few things at a time. Can't SH-Fair? Well first make sure you can SH, once you can consistently do that, then add in the attacks. When it comes to execution it all boils down to practicing till it's consistent. Have your friend sit in training mode till they get a feel for SH timing.

 

[Zionaze]

Oh anyone can execute a command, it all boils down to if he can do it in the midst of battle. I noticed he starts the game fairly well but as soon as the match gets heated or he gets grabbed, his usual response is to mash his panic button; counter, airdodge, etc.
Trying to tell someone that a move is unsafe is pretty hard too (kirby specials i be lookin at you).

Its almost like he's playing the game IN training mode, where the opponent doesn't fight back.

 

[Deleted member]

A few of my friends like smash but they don't have the game or console at home.
Honestly we don't have a teaching method, we just play constantly.

 

[Paxadin]

Maybe you could change his control scheme to remove Specials, then ask to have match only using aerials for example.
Force him to get a habit, then later return to normal and see if he uses it more.

I'd consider also showing videos of tournament matches with his character, it could spark new ideas from him or potentially show him the potential it has.

 

[Deleted member]

I definitely think advising him to go into training mode to practice this would be a wise decision. He needs to, in a relaxed environment, spend time practicing the trade without combat going on so he doesn't have to worry about defending himself. After he spends some time in there, then he can start practicing against CPU's or people. With CPU's, you can have him start with Level 4s, then as he progresses, raise him up one by one until level 6 (I don't recommend CPU's past 6 with the way they are with air dodging).

Another thing to consider is you're going to have to tell him that

"The more defensive moves you use, the more predictable your play-style is to your opponent and they will be able to read what you're going to do next. It also means you won't make offense, and thus, not win.

Don't panic during the fight, if you get hit it's not the end of the world. You need to stay in control to win and take the hits, but come back from them with the mindset you are always going to have a chance to turn the tables and go offensive again."

 

[LunarWingCloud]

I ease them in. I tell them basic actions like jump and how you have specials, tilts and smashes. I specifically mention how most characters' up-B and many side-B help you get back on stage. Then as they play more and show interest I explain less and less basic things.

 

[BtheDestroyer]

Honestly, I'd say either one or both of the following:
A. Take it one step at a time. Explain the mechanics in a way they'd understand (for the LoL player, learn some of those terms and use them when it makes sense) and take it one part at a time. Then run through about 15 seconds and pause before asking "What are you going to do now andy why?" and offer explanation as to what could be one or two choices (don't say it's better, just give them another option) and unpause the game and see which one they go with.

B. Have them learn from practice. This is a bad choice for if they only know one kind of game as they won't know where to start, but if they're fast learners and know how to pick something up, load up a team match with you and them on one team and some low level (3-6) CPUs on the other team. Help out a bit now and then (if one of them is getting completely destroyed) but have them do most of the work.

 

[Mythra]

I teach my friends by Smashing them

I have one that acted like your Friend-B so I played without mercy against him to make him see that his strats like projectile spam and counters just doesn't work, after that I said to him to do training and some Classic runs. After some really long time he became a better player with a more unpredictable attitude and capable to string attacks.

 

[Deleted member]

Beat the ever-living **** out of them.

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

I have basicly the same situation with my friends im teaching smash aswell, one has picked it up really well and the rest of them kind of struggle.

I've noticed that my "friend-B" learn better whilst having fun, i give him tips on how to setup easy kills as stagespikes and such and sometimes we "pause" the game just to talk or show the mechanic behind something. He usually forget the mostpart until the next time we play, but if thats the case ill just stomp him for doing his own mistakes again, tell him what made him lose and what he can do instead of his first options. And then we play some games for fun, rinse and repeat

I hope they learn eventually tho, i've made it so two friends have bought wii u's and smash! Hopefully we'll expand the circle

 

[Zionaze]

I have basicly the same situation with my friends im teaching smash aswell, one has picked it up really well and the rest of them kind of struggle.

I've noticed that my "friend-B" learn better whilst having fun, i give him tips on how to setup easy kills as stagespikes and such and sometimes we "pause" the game just to talk or show the mechanic behind something. He usually forget the mostpart until the next time we play, but if thats the case ill just stomp him for doing his own mistakes again, tell him what made him lose and what he can do instead of his first options. And then we play some games for fun, rinse and repeat

I hope they learn eventually tho, i've made it so two friends have bought wii u's and smash! Hopefully we'll expand the circle

Yeah, I feel obligated to teach Friend-B how to smash because I kind of convinced him to buy a wii u. Dont want him to waste it

 

[Purin a.k.a. José]

Instead of telling him, show him the differences in air attacks, and fight with him. Also, even if it's not a problem, I've noticed he likes projectiles: Show him which characters have reflectors so he does not get surprised.
Edit: I did not answer the main question!!! Well, I do it like that: I tell them how the game works (Damage, knockback, A and B attacks), give some advice about the character they are going to use and play a little to show them. But they only want to play with Level 9's!

 

[Freduardo]

Have you ever watched TeamFourstar's Dragon Ball Z abridged?

It's a lot like Piccolo teaching Gohan from that series. As in, hitting them while shouting 'Dodge'.

Before claiming that's how OP dodges are in this game, this has more or less held true for everyone down to 64

 

[ElectricBlade]

Have you ever watched TeamFourstar's Dragon Ball Z abridged?

It's a lot like Piccolo teaching Gohan from that series. As in, hitting them while shouting 'Dodge'.

Before claiming that's how OP dodges are in this game, this has more or less held true for everyone down to 64

That was actually a really really good example..*highfive*

To stay on topic I have a friend who is exactly like friend B, they could either be a lost cause or actually want to learn to play, just don't be a **** about it..

 

[MarkedRaptor]

I've taught a bunch of people how to play video games. I even got three of my friends into a fighting game and they were relatively good. The problem with Smash 4 however, is that the structure of the game isn't clear. Most of the time from an outsiders perspective the game looks like you rush in, grab, and just never stop going in. There doesn't seem to be a method to it all since it is so fast paced, and a lot of moves go unpunished or seem safe.

In a typical fighting game, an outsider can watch as two players space each other out, use footsies. Oh one person is jumping and going in, did player B read that? He didn't, now Player B is on the defensive, he has to block Player A's offense. He successfully blocked Player A's offense, now Player B has a shot of going in, ect.

Now in Smash you see like, Shiek and Luigi constantly rolling around and running around on stage. Then Shiek gets a grab. Oh that means that shiek has the advantage and will go in right? Wrong Luigi neutral aired out and stopped Shiek from going in. Luigi knocked shiek in the air, that means that Luigi has the advantage right? Wait no cuz shiek air dodged and threw out hitboxes. The thing with smash is there are so many....strange variables you have to get used to. Fighting games are already very technical, when you throw more gears into the system a new player will never know WHAT he is doing right.

If in Soul Calibur Astaroth grabs me, he puts me in a "GUESS RIGHT OR DIE" situation. No matter what, I have to make a 50/50 guess. Is he going to grab me high, or grab me low? If I failed it, I know it's because I didn't read him.

In Smash 4. I down throw as Little Mac and put Luigi in the air. He's not in a 50/50, he's putting ME in a 25/25/25/25. Will he double jump? Will he air dodge? Will he neutral A? Will he land fast and grab? How does one teach a new player to comprehend this?

The best way I can say is teach them the fundamentals of competitive play. Grabbing, dash attacking, limiting rolling, down dodging, anti airs. Teach them what Punishing and being Defensive is. Teach them fundamentals of fighting games that apply across all of them. Then when they have a solid idea of these things you can start teaching them the strange logic.

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

That was actually a really really good example..*highfive*

To stay on topic I have a friend who is exactly like friend B, they could either be a lost cause or actually want to learn to play, just don't be a **** about it..

Yesterday i kinda gave up on one of my friends. I told him that he needs to use shield in order to get better, and he started going on about it being try-hard, and that he didnt really care about getting better. Kinda made me mad since he allways complains about mechanics and whats broken or not (even tho he has no clue), when i sandbag him. I tried to tell him that a game with two equally skilled players are much more fun than one that doesnt even understand the basics of the game. Oh well...

 

[Zionaze]

Yesterday i kinda gave up on one of my friends. I told him that he needs to use shield in order to get better, and he started going on about it being try-hard, and that he didnt really care about getting better. Kinda made me mad since he allways complains about mechanics and whats broken or not (even tho he has no clue), when i sandbag him. I tried to tell him that a game with two equally skilled players are much more fun than one that doesnt even understand the basics of the game. Oh well...

My friend-B asked me who was the worst character in my opinion and when I answered Charizard (riot shield activate) He said he wanted to main charizard :l
I understand the whole low tier hipster mentality but if your practicing to win, why on earth would you want to main a character who probably won't net you any wins?

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

My friend-B asked me who was the worst character in my opinion and when I answered Charizard (riot shield activate) He said he wanted to main charizard :l
I understand the whole low tier hipster mentality but if your practicing to win, why on earth would you want to main a character who probably won't net you any wins?

I've had several friends who insisted on playing Palutena for a while, and we never play with customs. Tier lists isnt everything, but im agreeing with you, why make it even harder to net the kills when being completely fresh to the series?

 

[Raijinken]

Especially for the friend who is having basic mechanical issues with input and understanding, it can sometimes be helpful to simplify his control scheme. If he struggles using smashes, just have him use the C-stick, don't bother with direction+A. If he struggles with certain aerials, disable Tap Jump. Past that, it's just drilling and practice, and frankly if he's got some sort of mental disorder that results in mechanical memory loss on a recurring basis, it's going to be a struggle, and I'd advise not burning yourself out on his own issues. Try to help, but part of it has to be up to him.

As for mains, Mii Swordfighter is far worse than Charizard. But especially when someone's just trying to learn, either have them pick a character (easier if you know something about the character to guide your teaching), or have them go Mario. At a mechanical level, it's best to learn the basics on a single character, then learn non-mechanical basics while playing many characters and searching for a preferred playstyle.

Do you know if he actually likes Charizard as a character? Because tier mentality aside, he could just actually like flaming lizards. And until he goes really pro, odds are fair that once he develops skill, he can win some games on Zard (unless your Smash circle is a bunch of semipro tier pickers). Zard's weak, but not so weak as to be a laughable joke pick.

 

[Zionaze]

He doesn't even play pokemon :V
I'm ok with playing low tiers and all because thats what I do but if he just started playing the game and struggle to win, I don't think he should start with a harder to work with character.
How do people even get good at smash? How did I get good? When did you get good?

 

[Seige]

My friend-B asked me who was the worst character in my opinion and when I answered Charizard (riot shield activate) He said he wanted to main charizard :l
I understand the whole low tier hipster mentality but if your practicing to win, why on earth would you want to main a character who probably won't net you any wins?

Tell him Sheik is the worst character in the game.
On another note, show him competitive games, completely wreck him, and see if he REALLY wants to learn.
Also, have Friend A wreck him to show him how they're different. Maybe it'll give him that rival mentality.
On a note: Lol Charizard regular will ALWAYS SUUUUCK.
Just had to say that.

 

[MarkedRaptor]

He doesn't even play pokemon :V
I'm ok with playing low tiers and all because thats what I do but if he just started playing the game and struggle to win, I don't think he should start with a harder to work with character.
How do people even get good at smash? How did I get good? When did you get good?

To be honest, fast characters are the way you get good at this game. When you play a very fast character, you learn that you can punish people for their mistakes. People like bowser have a hard time punishing someone like sonic, wheras captain falcon can catch him.

People learn they are doing it right when they hit the opponent. You are supposed to hit your opponent, you win the game by hitting your opponent more then they hit you. If they hit the opponent after said opponent misses an attack, they understand that attacking isn't safe and has drawbacks. If they play a slow character they learn they can never do anything and just get wrecked. A slow character relies on reads to win, not punishing.

In order to teach someone to read, they must understand. If they do not understand what is going on, their brain fizzles. It's a lot like teaching someone to read. Do you teach them by showing them Shakespeare? or do you show them by teaching them bah bah black sheep?

 

[Sølid]

Beat the ever-living **** out of them.

This pretty much. My smash group is totally comprised of my friends I just destroyed every match (One of them spammed all the time and even complained about my wavedashing, rolling, dodging and shielding and continued to say I 'needed to take my hits like a man'). But they continued to play regardless. I would tell them what they were doing wrong and give them pointers here and there. If they spammed, I would make sure to punish them hardcore to break them of it. I showed them clips of tournament players and pros and explained all the basics the best I could. I would even throw in a little playful smack talk, just enough to make them want to beat me. And here we are, 2 years after doing all of this with Melee, PM, then finally Smash 4, one of them beats me around aprox 3/10 matches and is one of the best Fox players I've fought in Smash 4, I completely broke the other one of spamming (somewhat) and he can now land some pretty decent combos (but refuses to understand the importance or utilize tilts and is a little too fond of specials), and the last one of my friends... well, he isn't so bad now either. The only bad thing is, they are all so good now, last time I tried to bring a new guy to the group, he just got torn apart, and he didn't seem to wanna come back again.

 

[Jellydino]

I haven't gotten anyone into smash, but my friends on my campus got me into smash by telling me to find a character that I like and just play as them.

They used to not punish me for doing dumb things like charging smashes when they're nowhere close to me, but over time, they taught me how to punish and how moves work. After sometime, they taught me how to tech to prevent stage spiking, how to read and what the typical person does and how to counter it. Slowly they took me piece by piece to understand the game, got me into advanced tactics and taught me how to separate myself from the normal players who do bad habits. When it came to controller layout, they just said to pick up something that feels the most comfortable to you.

 

[Narr]

I've actually had to introduce Smash to several friends of mine lately. I just go over all of the inputs, how to put said inputs to use, and then beat them repeatedly until they learn how to play.

 

[Sean²]

It's hard. Really, really hard. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

If they don't have the drive to learn, win, and improve their play, that's not something you can teach. If they're not willing to sit and get beaten over and over and take advice about their mistakes, you may have to let them go. Seen it happen and tried it myself. Getting people to sit and practice ATs with you when they just want to fight you is tough, if not impossible.

If they have the right mentality, then it's easier, but still tough if you're already leaps and bounds ahead of them. You gotta go really slow and hold their hand through the basics.

Though, I feel if someone truly has the competitive mentality for a game, they'll go learn things on their own without much intervention. All you gotta be there for is to beat the snot out of them till they adapt.

Maybe I'm just a bad teacher.

 

[Seige]

So I wonder how his friend's progress has gone. Honestly, as I said before, have Friend A beat the living **** out of Friend B. Might help. I mean they started at the same time.