Help request: Dealing with Falcon.

[Daysoo]

Been searching around, but haven't found much useful information in the way of dealing with the manliest character in Melee... Didn't find anything using the search function, and the match up isn't listed in the Samus threads thread... Basically watching a few of the Samus VS C.Falcon vids in the video archive to see if I can find any new trixies to learn.

What I'm trying to do for most of the match is **** up his spacing so I can get some hits in. (S)WDing around, tossing out missiles and bombs when I'm in a safe enough position to do so, that kind of thing. I try to stay defensive.

I have a little trouble making it back to the stage with Falcon waiting around, too. Coming in high usually ends in tears, and my big bag of ledge tricks aren't always as effective as they are in other match ups.

I have little to no trouble edge-guarding Falcon once he's actually off the stage. Angled ftilts, smashes, and the magnificent utilt cover most of the bases. Sex kick and bair cover the remaining gaps.

--

What I'm looking for is a bit of advice on approaching and playing a bit more offensively (unless I should really spend the whole match playing defensively, in which case any further insight on how to do so would help just as much), and perhaps some safer ways to return to the stage.

What I'm NOT looking for is people telling me that the match up is impossible, and that I should pick a different character to play against Falcon. I understand it's a bit harder, but it's not impossible.

That said, thanks for reading this wall of text, and thanks in advance for any advice posted.
(If there's already a thread or existing resource for this, please point me in the right direction.)

 

[JettythatSamus]

You're going to get much better advice from others in here, but my hopefully helpful suggestions would be:

1. Try to get out of the habit of spot dodging A LOT during a Falcon match up. Wavedash out of danger and shield because getting grabbed is better than a dair to a knee.
2. Uncharged shots and missles are good just to keep Falcon on the defensive
3. Ftilt Ftilt Ftilt Ftilt Ftilt
4. Btilt Btilt Btilt Btilt Btilt
5. Falcon is a fastfaller so whenever you can look for a opportunity to combo him.
6. Down angled fsmashes protect you a little better against ledge techs
7. Run a lot shield a lot upB out of shield when convenient and don't stationarily shield dairs because an l cancelling falcon can easily just keep doing them. Either spot dodge wd back or forward or shield wd back or forward or upB out of shield.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Theres no such thing as a B-tilt. Theres the u-tilt, the d-tilt, and the f-tilt.

I'd only advise up-bing out of shield when theres a platform to cancel your lag upon.

I really don't know this matchup well so I'm not going to put my 2 cents in.

 

[Daysoo]

Theres no such thing as a B-tilt. Theres the u-tilt, the d-tilt, and the f-tilt.

Pretty sure he meant back-tilt, as in ftilting in the direction opposite you're facing. (Basing this on the repetition in his post.)
I thought it was funny, anyways.

I'd only advise up-bing out of shield when theres a platform to cancel your lag upon.

Was about to make that same point, figured it was understood.
Looks like I was right. ;D

 

[JettythatSamus]

Theres no such thing as a B-tilt....

ssshhhh don't tell him

 

[Wii4Mii 99]

If a Falcon starts doing SHFFL Knees or something, you could:

1) CC, then Dtilt and start combos
2) Sheild, then Up-B out if it.

For approaching Falcon, slowly make your way forward while shooting missiles for offense, and dropping bombs for defense. (to hopefully stop a running SHFFL Knee)

If you're recovering from up high, idk if this works, but try shooting a couple of homing missiles.

For missile stuff, check out my Missile Guide at my sig. I have a section you might be looking for, but it isn't complete. Nonetheless, it has missile stuff, like different ways to shoot missiles, etc.

Hope this helps.

 

[Paradigm]

I've found if I try to CC the falcon's moves, he'll try to use his dair on me. CCing doesn't help there. If I'm not, he usually approaches with his nair - even eating my missles with it on his aproach. A large part of my matches are dependent on who can read/mindgame the other better in those two options, lol.

Well spaced/timed good long-jump with falcon, with a properly spaced nair or fair, cannot be avoided in one wavedash back - you may have to do two.

You can combo falcon out of an upthrow at lower damages, downthrow at higher.

When being edge-guarded, I usually like to come low, with my second jump saved. I try to bait him to jump out (usually his uair, fair, bair) and avoid it, then try to get back on before he does. It won't work on a patient Falcon, but you may as well give it a try. Otherwise either try to have your fair up in front of you as he tries to hit you back out.

I aproach falcon with wavedash-jabs and wavedash-ftilts (often up-angled). If I hit I may follow that up (I'm a big fan of the dtilt in this matchup), if not I'll try to be trixy with dashdances and wavedashes and try again. Often I'll try to wavedash-shield into and past the falcon as he aproaches with an air move, then tilt him from behind.

If he gets all up in your face, as others said, up-B out of the shield.

IMO this is Samus worst matchup.

 

[hugQ Cortex]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=NQPP5h3q4bs

Lots of good stuff here

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Wii4mii, you do realize that once samus has taken any sort of reasonable damage, relatively low to mid, she cannot cc knees?..

Ccing game is very very limited in this matchup..

 

[Reno>]

I have a little trouble making it back to the stage with Falcon waiting around, too. Coming in high usually ends in tears, and my big bag of ledge tricks aren't always as effective as they are in other match ups.


--

What I'm looking for is a bit of advice on approaching and playing a bit more offensively (unless I should really spend the whole match playing defensively, in which case any further insight on how to do so would help just as much), and perhaps some safer ways to return to the stage.

What I'm NOT looking for is people telling me that the match up is impossible, and that I should pick a different character to play against Falcon. I understand it's a bit harder, but it's not impossible.

If Falcon is waiting to pick a spot to attack samus when ur off the edge and bomb jumping position ur bombs so they're guarding you from any approaches he'd want to take. And if Falcon lands into ur bomb bounce off it and Dsmash his ***. Always be ready to Dsmash Falcons when ur off the edge once u've established to the falcon that ur eyeing him up as much as hes eyeing u up he'll back off till u get closer to the edge. Falcon can use ur bombs to get back to the stage so don't be careless when laying them.

Sex kick out of ur shield works great if hes trying to shffl knees in ya. Ur offensive work against Falcon should be grounded. tilts own. wave dashing back and forth works.Falcons hate ur Fsmash. CCing isn't really an important part in this match up.

This matchup is far from impossible. it is my favorite charcter to play against. Watching Samus vs. Falcon is watching a Matrix fight.

 

[-F_a_T_e-]

i almost literally agree w/ all of jetty's post, especially the part when wavedashing and shielding out of danger. Falcon has speed and in order to "avoid" his attacks you need someone of a "avoidence" technique..

Sex kick (Nair) is also helpful imo.

 

[mach5]

at my biweekly i usually beat all the falcons there. simply with high MC so if the falcon were to stand still it'd get hit in the head, if they were to jump their foot would get caught, and if they were to duck you could simply chase your missle and grab him. usually they jump at you with a knee or nair, or maybe dair. if you see a dair or a fair coming at you spot dodge, but if its a nair shield and up b out of it. (nair out of shield works well too) I've found that getting your wave dash to near max distance is one of the most useful things you can have for samus. one good wave dash forces the falcon to miss any knee or any dair to f smash.

 

[BDAOutlaw]

Just recenlty I saw these videos of Aftermath fighting a Falcon.....and after watching 1-1 through to 2-2 I'm pretty confident about fighting a Falcon now but Aftermath is definalty one of my favorite Samus's to watch specially after watching the Mission Breifing Video he made too.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=FFEgWhWgHQk&mode=related&search=

If this aint enough watch the others on the related section to the side......
this falcon he's fighting seems to know him pretty well too and is very aggresive IMO so may be of some help for those annoying "in ur face" Falcons

 

[ESAM]

I have a very aggressive play style and my strategy is this:

1. If he nair whores you, nair right back, yours will hit him and falcon doesn't regain mobility that fast so you will end up winning the blow trades.
2. if he dair whores you, up-b our of sheild, much easier than wavedashing out of shield, and deals him damage instead of running away, then once you wavedash he can just start dairing you again.
3. Stay on the ground. If you play aggressive, run and wavedash back, be ready to shield and don't use laggy attacks unless you know it will hit. If you miss you get comboed.
4. When recovering, make sure once you get a certain distance from the stage, like his jump out, start bombing, if he tries to intercept you in the middle of the bomb jump, just u-air, it will be weird trajectory for him, he might die if its dreamland 64, and you can just rising grapple since it goes higher than up-b. Don't bomb afterwards cuz the falcon will recover using the bomb's explsion.
5. D-SMASH A LOT. If you won't follow you to the end of the stage, missile. If you can judge his distance, missile accoridngly. Double missile usually doesn't work becuase he runs, nairs through the second missile, and starts hitting you. So my advice would be grab the ledge and start ledge-hop missiling. If he gets too close, d-smash to edgeguard.

That's it for now, if you don't think my advice is helpful, whatever, just don't yell at me ^_^