Getting past over reliance of DED

[Oddyesy]

Hey, guys. I've known about my over reliance on DED for a long time, but since most people on netplay didn't seem to know how to beat it, I've developed quite the unhealthy addiction to DED. Most times I'll finish off the 4th hit even if I know it'll whiff because I'm just so used to finishing it. I'll explain more later with an edit when I have time.

 

[Leafeon]

Play a match with someone on the training/testing stage with smart bombs and bumpers. You'll forget you ever had it.

otherwise try to play matches without using it at all, so you can know what your other options are and when.

 

[Oddyesy]

Play a match with someone on the training/testing stage with smart bombs and bumpers. You'll forget you ever had it.

otherwise try to play matches without using it at all, so you can know what your other options are and when.

I swear you sound exactly like my friend on Skype, haha.

 

[Hellrazor]

I like to play matches where I only let myself use SHFFL aerials or only throw followups, so those may be useful for you. I try to iron out all my options offline on CPUs before going against humans, and it does help, since I go in with an arsenal of diverse setups that I can try on thinking opponents to test their viability.

In essence, change up your opponent type.

 

[G13_Flux]

your big hitters out of neutral (best reward) are DED, dtilt, dash attack, and grab. next in line you have moves like ftilt, jab, nair, and fair, which are generally going to be more defensive for you in neutral, and wont yield as much reward (fair can combo but you wont get anywhere trying to use it as an approach on a grounded opponent; youll just get CCed).

out of the ones ive mentioned, try mixing it up, especially by trying to land dtilt, which is arguably your best set up, and one of your safest moves on a shielded opponent (besides grab obviously). between dtilt and DED, youve got two moves that set up greatly, can be used safely on shielded opponents (when used properly), and offer differing coverage. DED covers the airspace above and in front of you very well, while dtilt offers a good, long range poke to the ground that can be used with CCing. when to use which move depends on where youre looking to cover space, and the dynamics of your opponents approach game. both however, can be beaten by CCing, which is where you can mix in DDs, grabs, and sometimes even a surprise DACUS.

the main need for roy to carefully choose his moves from neutral is the fact that everything he has besides grab and upsmash can be CCed, and DACUS isnt exactly a reliable approach when used too often, and gets beaten too easily by shields. i can see how its easy for you to get used to DED if your opponent doesnt CC, but when they do, it really forces you to weigh your other options. if CCing werent in the game, DED would turn into one of the most reliable approach moves in the game, as it racks damage, kills, and can combat shielding opponents.

 

[Ekans647]

What are the uses of DED anyway? Are these used translatable to Marth's Dancing Blade?

 

[G13_Flux]

What are the uses of DED anyway? Are these used translatable to Marth's Dancing Blade?

when looking at uses for DED, you have to start out with the use for a single hit, then add on uses for the subsequent hits in order to understand the transition of the move. the first hit of DED comes out on frame 6, surpassed in speed by only his jab, and equal with his dsmash. the move does not have a lot of endlag, and it covers a lot of space in front and 45 degrees above him. the great coverage and low commitment makes it a pretty safe move to throw out, save only for the fact that its easily CCable, like many of roys moves. the beauty of the use of the first hit is that you have the option for a second hit, or you can forgo that option to run away, bait out something else, or land a grab or dtilt. staying unpredictable with it is what allows you to get follow ups. for the second two hits, x^ is great for combo starting, as it pops them up. this easily allows you to follow up with xx^ or xx>, both of which can yield great reward through combos and killing, respectively. the fourth hits are used to cover various options: if the opponent rolls/DIs away (xxx>), jumps (xxx^), rolls/DIs behind, or stays in shield (xxxV). again you should experiment with continuing the combo, versus ending it a varying points to stay unpredictable and prevent your opponent from guessing the proper escape path. most of the hits are around -9 on shield, so spacing and unpredictability are key.

as with many things on this board, players will link you to sethlons guide, which is probably your best source of info for the general uses, and slightly more advanced uses for his moves and tactics. you will find individualized uses for each of the DED hits here. http://smashboards.com/guides/playing-with-ph1r3.62/

they can be translated to marths dancing blade, but the reward for marths dancing blade is generally less, and it does less damage typically, even at the tip. this makes it less safe on shield. he also doesnt posses a backwards 4th swing, and his 4th hits are less rewarding, in KB and in coverage, excluding his 4th hit down, which is highly damaging for shields and otherwise. not to say that marths DED isnt useful when compared to roys, and the difference isnt quite "gaping", but roys is generally superior in safety, reward, and threat potential.