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Ganon in Teams

Linguini

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 17, 2006
Messages
4,698
Location
Weston, Florida
As Ive been playing teams a lot lately I noticed how radically different ganon must be played in teams compared to singles,much more so than the other characters.The issue lies in is his size and mobility out of shield.

In teams characters like fox, sheik,falco, and peach dominate due to their easily accessible fail-safe moves in tight situations. When I say "tight" situations I'm speaking about what we ganon players find happening all too often in teams;all 4 players in a small area throwing out attacks.

Let's say your falco and your shielding,which is the right thing to do in the situation,sheik fairs your shield and you shine out of shield, escaping the action and taking sheik with you.
Now, replace falco with ganon and what do you do. Your facing towards her, a shieldgrab would get you hit by one of the other players attacks and the probability of you even finishing the throw is not high, aerials oos have way too much start up lag and would also get you hit.

Fvck.

What we learn here is that ganon has to play less aggressive, don't be tempted by situations that appear to be advantageous to your team, in the one described above, get the **** out would be the right decision.

Now i'll touch on rolling.

2 facts we know.

Ganons roll is pretty good.

Rolling too much is bad.

Not in teams it isn't.

Taking advantage of the roll is something that is essential to performing well in teams. In these situations rolling with ganon is usually the best option unless it's obvious someone is waiting for you on the way out. I even find myself rolling 2 times in smart ways to make distance and space myself.

Which brings me to the next area, Ganons spacing. Ganon needs his space, doesn't matter if it's singles or teams, to facilitate this splitting into 1v1's is a great strat for a ganon/character team, with occasional fisting to help out your partner. On platform stages I like to chill above while my partner is distracting the opponents and,like an opportunist, dropping down with a well placed bair/fair.

The last point I'm going to touch down on is hitting your partner. This happens all the time, and with ganon more often than any other character. The thing is,most of these hits can be avoided with simple communication and easy team strats.
With ganon I've found the most effective strat to be "the wall". This strategy minimizes the hits you will get on your partner,and works pretty **** well.

Ganon is always in front, make a wall of fairs/bairs and close in on your opponents while your partner hides out behind you. If by any chance your wall is breached, now is the time for your partner to get aggressive, and you have a chance to fall I'm about to finish an edge guard and my partner jumps out to "help" me but end up saving the opponent.
It's all in the partner communication, just a couple of words.


I didn't even notice I typed so much, I guess the words came straight from my mind. Hope they help.

Later.
 

-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
Great post. I like to say in teams, not failing is better than succeeding.

Do you think Ganon should still be the front man if Fox is his teammate? I've teamed with l0zR's Fox before (June of this year) and we did well with him as a front man and my Ganon playing more of an opportunist role. We beat Chu's team (IC/puff) in winners, got 3-0'd by PP's team (Falco/Fox), came back to 3-0 PP's team in losers finals and lost the GF's 2-3. On platform levels I was able to create some good setups for edgeguards by fair/uair'ing them back out as they recovered onto the stage/platforms. We didn't really think it through though to be honest. Do you think it's mildly dependent on who you're against? Just curious.
 

RestInPeace

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 24, 2008
Messages
612
Location
Toronto, ON
I find that your partner being the wall is better than Ganon being the wall, because getting past gets more punishment. I think Kage said this, but if you're behind your partner (so he's the wall) and you're standing around, charge a smash so that if they decide to roll behind your wall or jump over, they'll get hit, which leads to more combos.

Am I wrong?

And can we also discuss Ganon's team partners in detail? So list things like best partners, why they make a good team, the playstyle with this partner, matchups, and stage CPs.
 

Linguini

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 17, 2006
Messages
4,698
Location
Weston, Florida
Great post. I like to say in teams, not failing is better than succeeding.

Do you think Ganon should still be the front man if Fox is his teammate? I've teamed with l0zR's Fox before (June of this year) and we did well with him as a front man and my Ganon playing more of an opportunist role. We beat Chu's team (IC/puff) in winners, got 3-0'd by PP's team (Falco/Fox), came back to 3-0 PP's team in losers finals and lost the GF's 2-3. On platform levels I was able to create some good setups for edgeguards by fair/uair'ing them back out as they recovered onto the stage/platforms. We didn't really think it through though to be honest. Do you think it's mildly dependent on who you're against? Just curious.
I'm not saying it's the only effective teams strat with ganon, just the one that I've found to be the most successful. The thing is, ganons speed hurts him when attempting to take that opportunist role, that fox could cover flawlessly vice-versa.

I find that your partner being the wall is better than Ganon being the wall, because getting past gets more punishment. I think Kage said this, but if you're behind your partner (so he's the wall) and you're standing around, charge a smash so that if they decide to roll behind your wall or jump over, they'll get hit, which leads to more combos.

Am I wrong?

And can we also discuss Ganon's team partners in detail? So list things like best partners, why they make a good team, the playstyle with this partner, matchups, and stage CPs.
Ace is right.

I think ganons best partners are fox,peach,and sheik in particular order.

Sheik can tilt opponents into your aerials,save you with needles, and cover your *** well when you fvck up edgeguards.

Peach has the d-smash.

Fox can be easily saved, his up-b in teams is godsend, any grab you get,he can usmash kill out of. But fox is good with every character lol.
 

RestInPeace

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 24, 2008
Messages
612
Location
Toronto, ON
Ace asked if Ganon being the wall would be matchup-dependant. I'm wondering the same thing, and what conditions would make Ganon the better wall? Of course, we also have to take into account your teammate so let's say the top three you stated? Fox/Peach/Sheik.

I think Fox should be the front man, Peach behind, and Sheik can do both. I would personally not do the "wall" strategy, but the "flanking" one (with Sheik/Fox, since they're faster). I don't know where I read this, but sometimes surrounding someone would pressure them into making mistakes on their own. Ganon punishes hard, so this is a viable strategy. Or... At least that's what I read. What are your thoughts on this strategy?
 

Linguini

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 17, 2006
Messages
4,698
Location
Weston, Florida
I seem to find Jiggs to be a good teammate for Ganon.
I think jiggs is an ok teamate with ganon, I find myself killing her waayyyyy too much but maybe that just me lol.
Ace asked if Ganon being the wall would be matchup-dependant. I'm wondering the same thing, and what conditions would make Ganon the better wall? Of course, we also have to take into account your teammate so let's say the top three you stated? Fox/Peach/Sheik.

I think Fox should be the front man, Peach behind, and Sheik can do both. I would personally not do the "wall" strategy, but the "flanking" one (with Sheik/Fox, since they're faster). I don't know where I read this, but sometimes surrounding someone would pressure them into making mistakes on their own. Ganon punishes hard, so this is a viable strategy. Or... At least that's what I read. What are your thoughts on this strategy?
Like I said to ACE,other starts work, just throwing one that is effective out there. This "flanking" one does work , but if the opponent doesn't make a mistake on his own and simply gets hit, theres not much ganon can do to follow up due to his speed.
 

spider_sense

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 25, 2007
Messages
2,295
Location
Miami, FL (Ives Dairy)
Yo Pasta, any effective strats for teaming with a fox? So far I came up with utilizing more grabs in certain situations. For ex: I grab and the fox can drill shine upsmash to rack up percent, let alone puts his other team mate in an awkward situation. My only concern is how can Ganon help his partner when he/she is in distress? I could use my wavelands to get there, but it still takes awhile to get to them.
 

Linguini

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 17, 2006
Messages
4,698
Location
Weston, Florida
D smash is reaaaaally ****ing good in teams, I was experimenting with it today and its great, especially against teams with fastfallers.
 

Comrade

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
292
Location
Memphis
Actually, this helped a lot brah

I can not begin to count the number of time I've killed a partner :chuckle:

EDIT: that video is amazing
 
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