Fox's strategies.

[BlazeSSB]

I play fox, and i have a lot of difficulties to attack properly when facing some kind of people.

Normally I start my combos with shdl to drill or fair, but most of the times I get grabbed when the oponet dash dances, rolls or even does a strong DI, even though I can sometimes predict the roll or the dash dance and do a bair/ drill / jab it's not as bad as getting grabbed and then easily edgeguarded.

I'm not sure about what to do with campers ( plankers ) that stay the whole battle near the edge, if I don't go there they won't even move.

I really like an offensive style of playing , but facing these problems I'm not sure if I should keep being offensive or try a more careful way of fighting. Most of my oponnets won't even attack me if I don't do it first

Please help.

 

[Surri-Sama]

I play fox, and i have a lot of difficulties to attack properly when facing some kind of people.

Normally I start my combos with shdl to drill or fair, but most of the times I get grabbed when the opponent dash dances, rolls or even does a strong DI, even though I can sometimes predict the roll or the dash dance and do a bair/ drill / jab it's not as bad as getting grabbed and then easily edgeguarded.

I'm not sure about what to do with campers ( plankers ) that stay the whole battle near the edge, if I don't go there they won't even move.

I really like an offensive style of playing , but facing these problems I'm not sure if I should keep being offensive or try a more careful way of fighting. Most of my opponents won't even attack me if I don't do it first

Please help.

This was a major hurtle for me too actually, I used to play 100% offensively, which used to leave me open to these things your having troubles with...

the way i found works best (while keep the offense) is not to play so much...defensively ...but to play a smart offense.

If your foe is camping, fake an approach, most campers will usually try to counter your approach and grab...the throw you off the edge... but if you fake it, ...empty SHs Dash dancing, ect. They will go for the grab, and then miss...this is when you go on the offensive.

Do not try to approach from directly above, unless you are kirby, most of the time what your doing will be far to obvious to lure out a good camper.

Also remember fox has some pretty easy Gimps with that shine, campers who camp by the ledge are obviously...going to be by the ledge...you can use that to your advantage just as much as they can

Remember Camping is legit, just work around it.

 

[HiddenElf22]

I've had the same exact problem with you while facing my main opponent who is ALWAYS Falcon. We love to play on Hyrule, and he loves to camp on the left wall of the right side. He just stands there until I go to him, either does an upsmash or grabs me, throws me against a wall and does his upsmash bs.

This thread is very similar:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=204029

And allow me copy pasta my own post

Hey I need some serious help. I play a very good fox and can string up random combos ll the time. i use these combos too, especially the hyrule right side backgrab action to backgrab nair upsmash. The only thing is my main opponent here plays ONLY Falcon. After endless fox vs. falcon matches, he's gotten my strategy down almost too well. I can beat him with any other character though, and he can't play anyone else for ****. But, whenever I approach this kid all he has to do is get an upsmash, then I'm automatically at 90+ percent. I also have LOTS of trouble doing a dtilt to drill. He seems to always land and tech so every hit goes right through him at the exact time and he gets his grab or most likely, upsmash. Edgeguarding he fsmashes me like no other. But my problem is his constant upmash repeptive upsmash juggling. With fox's weight/recovery time, its just upsmashx3->upair->upair->upB dive. I cna't get past that first upsmash.

The only thing I found that helps me is if I take a break from my Fox and play other characters. Then when I come back to fox, I sort of have a new playstyle that he's not used to. But I think the main thing is I need to re-work my whole strategy. I'm like you as in very offensive, I always try to continue stringing the combo together. The problem is either when he techs/rolls and upsmashes, or when he shields and then shield grabs me. I think I've found that if I stop playing his game of chasing him around, and take things slower in a hit and run fashion, I do better. I think. But it's so hard to not get caught in his stupid upsmash 0 to 91% crap. Yea. I also need to get shdl down.

 

[Surri-Sama]

lol your lucky its only 0-91%, most of my Falcon on fox combos lead 100+ ...or death

Do either of yous play online?

 

[HiddenElf22]

Well yea my friend hasn't developed ultimate juggling with falcon, but it's hard to beat.
I also used to play online, and I had a controller adapter. The thing is my internet sucks; like any online game automatically has lag in it. I can't even play CS 1.6 anymore. Like come on, my computer turned to waste. I'd like to play online with a comp that can, and maybe I'll try it again on this comp just for fun. I also can find friends to play console with, and I got all my dorm buddies up here into ssb, so I play every day with them. And my only problem is this kid's Falcon against my fox. it's so weird because my Fox is my prized possession because of all the cool stuff he can do but his Falcon sometimes puts me to shame.

 

[Surri-Sama]

Well yea my friend hasn't developed ultimate juggling with falcon, but it's hard to beat.
I also used to play online, and I had a controller adapter. The thing is my internet sucks; like any online game automatically has lag in it. I can't even play CS 1.6 anymore. Like come on, my computer turned to waste. I'd like to play online with a comp that can, and maybe I'll try it again on this comp just for fun. I also can find friends to play console with, and I got all my dorm buddies up here into ssb, so I play every day with them. And my only problem is this kid's Falcon against my fox. it's so weird because my Fox is my prized possession because of all the cool stuff he can do but his Falcon sometimes puts me to shame.

Well something to remember too is that even if you and your friend are =/= in skill Falcon can come on top by a large margin very easily if he gets the right combos...

Usmash x2-->Uairx2--> Dair if your close to the edge...you die xP

Fox is a lot more technical so in order to be winning by a large amount, you have to be a large amount better.

 

[BlazeSSB]

yeah i faced the same problem with a falcon... the guy didn't even z cancel well.. but as you guys said, u gotta be a lot more technical.


oh and yeah i'm always online .. but my ping at emularena is like 130.

 

[HiddenElf22]

Ah very true. Falcon's combos are also very easy to pull off, pretty **** hard to screw up, and it's even harder for Fox specifically to break out of it. Aside from that combo that I deal with, he's got his forward smash timing down perfectly when edgeguarding me. I've learned to change up my recovery but that doesn't stop him from spiking me or throwing me back off the edge. lol he likes falcon's back throw more than forward.

Edit:
Ok, so my course of action is going to be, practice shdl A LOT. I'm going to try to work my dtilts with it's range. Maybe I'll do an empty sh JUST out of his upsmash range, which he will do. Then hit him with dtilts till it hits and take it from there. I think I should also focus more on getting him off the edge and efficiently edgeguard him. The other thing is half the time I can hit him with y shine off the edge, but he's been able to dodge it and land. i think I'm going to stay on the edge and rock the fsmash/dsmash to keep him off.

 

[Surri-Sama]

Ah very true. Falcon's combos are also very easy to pull off, pretty **** hard to screw up, and it's even harder for Fox specifically to break out of it. Aside from that combo that I deal with, he's got his forward smash timing down perfectly when edgeguarding me. I've learned to change up my recovery but that doesn't stop him from spiking me or throwing me back off the edge. lol he likes falcon's back throw more than forward.

well a camper would...its a very strong back throw...

but at low % Fthrow will set up for a LOT better combos

 

[HiddenElf22]

well a camper would...its a very strong back throw...

but at low % Fthrow will set up for a LOT better combos

Haha I good thing he hasn't fully realized this yet. It's also hilarious when I Falcon his Falcon. God I put him to shame. Lots of 0-death action, i spike better, uair combo smarter. And then i go back to fox and it all changes. Funny stuff. But how does my strat for improving my strat sound?

 

[Surri-Sama]

Sounds good.

even if that doesnt help you beat him all the time, look to see if you can find more flaws and exploit them xP

 

[BlazeSSB]

I've been testing everything mentioned above... empty sh works well against falcon and ness , another good thing i test was instead of shield pressuring the oponent doing another sh a bit to your back and then dair, most of the times it avoids a shield grab and a roll. But i still have a bit of problem... i guess we just need a lot of game experience to be able to deal well with these situations.

 

[HiddenElf22]

Ok so I tested most of this stuff against my friend. We played like 8 matches and I only lost 2 of them. My dtilt works a lot better than I could imagine, it could be a strategy in itself. I just keep my distance ready to dtilt. I still haven't really gotten the dtilt to drill yet with his teching, but I have realized and figured out that I only need to delay my sh->drill for only a fraction of a second and that should work. I haven't yet tested out the empty sh, I'm afraid it might not work on him, because he loves the fsmash. Also using my smashes more to edgeguard gave me the win a bunch of times. I also learned that I cannot nair his up+b, i must fair or bair. sh uair has been really effective, as once I get the first uair down I can continue with utilt to more uairs or just more uairs. Problems I still have are his god**** throw. I always attempt to grab, but it doesn't connect, then no matter how far away I am he grabs me right after. I also forward smash dropkick to his face, but instead he decides to just grab me. It's not fair he grabs me in the middle of my smash

You couldn't be more right about not approaching directly from above.

And the other thing I noticed is that if I'm super focusing on what I'm doing I can clean house. But if I run on autopilot it's like autopilot mode so that he can win. It's weird, I just gotta maintain focus and know what the best move to do is. I'm also learning more on how to use his jab effectively. Like if he's shielding and I'm in the right position I can jab once or twice the shield and then grab him. I don't know but this topic is good help.

 

[Superstar]

The best strategy is to unplug the opponents controller. If that don't work, beat em up.

Careful offense looks like it'd be good for my Mario. I notice I get grabbed, thrown, then edgeguarded so many times. Not as much a problem with my Fox though, so meh.

 

[HiddenElf22]

The best strategy is to unplug the opponents controller. If that don't work, beat em up.

Careful offense looks like it'd be good for my Mario. I notice I get grabbed, thrown, then edgeguarded so many times. Not as much a problem with my Fox though, so meh.

I never have that problem with mario. First of all, fireballs. You can't get grabbed with mass fireballs. Second, Mario's throw is great, you should be able to throw them first. Third, Mario has a decent recovery that you can change up a bit with his down+b tornado. His up+b has lots of priority and is hard to block. Just use your tornado to get some extra height, spam fireballs, second jump, then if you can make it to land do so while attacking, if not then let yourself fall so that your up+b should allow you to grab the edge. You may steal a precious coin doing so too.

Also fox's up+b is obvious when it's happening and fairly easy to predict, whereas Mario's comes out of no where, is really fast, and almost guarantees that you hit the opponent.

 

[Superstar]

Once I'm thrown, I don't have much problem getting back, unless my opponent is Pikachu. THEN I notice I shouldn't be getting grabbed in the first place.

It's usually cause I drill/utilt shields. Also, mass fireballs isn't full offense, so it doesn't go against what I said "careful offense".

My Mario just sucks, that's it.

 

[HiddenElf22]

Ah yea I see. I was just making the point that you shouldn't have that much trouble being edgeguarded, except from Pika. Usually I just hop around with my fireballs, and once they connect with them or their shield I'm right next ready for a grab or downsmash or drills, you know. Sometimes I rush, do a little shorthop backwards and hit with fair or something. I guess that's kind of careful offense.

 

[Surri-Sama]

Pikachu, Kirby, Falcon and DK can edge gaurd Mario / Luigi very well

Dtilts and Dairs on the edge

Rock works too, plus its just awesome to see someone get killed with the Rock, xP

 

[Daedatheus]

Yeah for Mario's/Luigi's crazy up+b, you can usually spike it mid-move. You *will* trade hits, but one of you is sent slightly up while the other is sent very far down. A pretty good tradeoff if you ask me.

Rock works too, plus its just awesome to see someone get killed with the Rock, xP

I once went out to edgeguard a Mario with Kirby's dair, missed, then turned around mid-air and did a reverse moving up+b, landed on the stage and spiked for the last stock

 

[Zen Yore]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7YjXRaVCkY

Fox ditto.
Shows some strategies xP

0:32 - 0:39
even if i get pwned in that moment i find it epic

 

[Wenbobular]

You could try reading my guide for tips ;D see siggy.