Edge Guarding Sweet Spots

[SomethingRaven]

I play with a Doc and Marth and they have gotten to a point where they can sweet spot the ledge perfectly. How am I supposed to counter this?!
Dair and d-smash don't work near ledge and I usually end up getting poked by the up b.
Plus whenever I go to contest the recovery I end up taking a weak hit and being put in a bad position.
Is the only way to contest their recovery to go off stage and d-air and hope it collides with the recovery?
Thanks in advance

 

[Teran]

Try esgehogging them lol

 

[gmBottles]

Try esgehogging them lol

Edgehogging is really the only option here. If they're sweetspotting consistently than you have to edgehog.

 

[SomethingRaven]

Try esgehogging them lol

I attempt this too sometimes but usually the tip of the up-b hit me. Does that just mean i'm doing it too late?

 

[Stalled]

You're staying on the ledge too long and losing invincibility, roll back on when they come up and it should help. You can also lightshield edge hog marth, just roll to the edge, hold z, and angle shield offstage, it'll work unless they recover onstage or get a really really tight sweetspot window.

 

[AirFair]

Best option is to lightsheild marth, the "marth killer".

Doc shouldn't be as hard. Try and read when he might need to upB to recover, then quickly take the ledge. Other then that, just go in and spike if you are up lol

 

[BirdLordMasterBeak]

Marth killer works great against marth as they said. Against characters like Doc/luigi/mario/anyone with a big vertical recovery, I LOVE abusing the fact that they need to be really close to the actual stage. Just get invincibility, drop a little low, and do a rising dair back onto the stage. This covers sweetspot and them landing on stage. (Watch out doing this against marth though, he can try swatting at you and his up-b sometimes pokes if you dont time invincibility right)

 

[Stalled]

Also, don't discount scrubby edgeguards, depending on how a doc spaces his upb, you can sh dair him and trade for the spike.

 

[BirdLordMasterBeak]

Also, don't discount scrubby edgeguards, depending on how a doc spaces his upb, you can sh dair him and trade for the spike.

Very true, this can be used as a mixup. but generally rising dair covers more, is invincible (if you time it correctly) or can still trade but you are in almost the exact same position. If you mess up ledge situations though, it can lead to SDs so sh dair is definitely safer in that regard.

 

[MALVM MALVM]

Because their up bs are too fast to react to, a lot of Marios and Marths will stall off the edge until you invincibility with down b or dancing blade respectively and then up b to knock you off the edge. What you can do against this is up b stall on the edge to refresh your invincibility.

 

[SomethingRaven]

Just get invincibility, drop a little low, and do a rising dair back onto the stage. This covers sweetspot and them landing on stage. (Watch out doing this against marth though, he can try swatting at you and his up-b sometimes pokes if you dont time invincibility right)

So effectively the startup of the bair will be invincible?

 

[BirdLordMasterBeak]

So effectively the startup of the bair will be invincible?

I was talking about dair but it applies to bair too, when you grab the ledge, you get invincibility, if you time your ledge grab right before they up-b, you can do a rising dair/bair and be invincible when the attacks would trade.