Downsides of the online gameplay

[Lawrencelot]

<sorry if this topic is made before>

As I was thinking about the possibilities of the online gameplay for Brawl, I figured there were some downsides, although it would of course be very awesome to fight anyone on the world.

-Maybe there will be less tournaments. As everybody can just fight humans over the internet, you don't need to go to a real-life tourney to fight the best players. The tournaments won't disappear of course, but I expect they will be less.
-Any trick/technique you invent will be known to the rest of the players if you play online. In Melee, when someone made up a combo, it would take some time before other players got to know it. The only way to do a trick somebody else invented, was to see his vid or see him in real life. In Brawl, you can't do a trick of your own anymore because everybody who you play with can see it.
-There will be a whole lot more competition. Someone living on an isolated island with only one smasher might become as good as someone living in NYC for example. In Melee this was hardly possible. If everybody can become good at Brawl with little effort, it will look more like an MMORPG where everybody keeps training to get better. In Melee you have to go to tourneys, travel to friends in your country, to get better aside from fighting cpus and watch vids.

So, I think the online gameplay has a lot of downsides, and I hope it will be different from offline multiplayer gaming, so that the offline multiplayer gaming won't disappear. Maybe they could limit the options (only items for example) so that the online gaming will just be for fun and not to get better, but I doubt it.

 

[TaikaAli]

First of all I think the best players and many many more will still go to tournaments, in there you will have no lag at all and good place to get knows by smash community.

Well this might be true, but its not a big deal, everyone will have to train to learn them even if you see someone using them.

It's a good thing that you can play against humans from countries that have no tournaments. Like me, i life in Finland. And theres no Tourneys near me ever. So this really gives change for me to test my cabalities.

Just items would be really stypid, because then it would be random and people who cant go to tournaments would never have a change to play against anyone but their friends.

This is all just my opinion of course, some people may and will disagree with it but it dosent matter. And by the way, Dont be sorry, just use search button.

 

[TedBoosley]

I used to go to Halo 2 Tournaments all the time, even though most of my playtime was on XBL. Playing in real life is so amazingly different than playing online that it isn't even comparable.

 

[Markus Aralius]

If anything i see there being more tourny's, if i recall Halo 2 has incorporated online tournaments. this i thought was a great idea giving those with limited travel optons a chance to compeat and show their stuff. i dont think this will elliminate RL tournaments either, because nothing can replace whooping the competitions *** in RL.

and wouldnt more competition make you better? i found where im from good competition is scarce, so being able to log onto my wii and play someone with superior skills will in turn better mine.

 

[MeloDeath]

Interesting post. At first i'd like to say that nothing is better than smashing with a couple of dudes in real life, which is just awesome.
I dont think we will be battling around the world, because of lag issues.

I'm happy with online, because:
1) Good competition
2) No traveling or finding locations
3) Plug in and play
4) not being dependant on others

I think there will be some alterations in online play ( And please Ninty... make a Stamina-stock mode, which would rock ). I really hope there will be no items in online play, since in Melee items meant winning or loosing. If in Brawl items would not KO at 70 damage, but rather at 120, i wouldn't mind playing with them, but f*ck those **** baseball bats and Star rods...

 

[Mic_128]

-Any trick/technique you invent will be known to the rest of the players if you play online. In Melee, when someone made up a combo, it would take some time before other players got to know it. The only way to do a trick somebody else invented, was to see his vid or see him in real life. In Brawl, you can't do a trick of your own anymore because everybody who you play with can see it.

Seeing it doesn't mean you know how to do it. You saw a guy stuff himself in a box, think you can do it because you saw it a few times? The Internet, not online gming, is going to give the combo's away.

-There will be a whole lot more competition. Someone living on an isolated island with only one smasher might become as good as someone living in NYC for example. In Melee this was hardly possible. If everybody can become good at Brawl with little effort, it will look more like an MMORPG where everybody keeps training to get better. In Melee you have to go to tourneys, travel to friends in your country, to get better aside from fighting cpus and watch vids.

Because you were born in a certain part of the world means you shouldn't be able to be as good as someone else born in NYC? More competition is GOOD. It lets more become good, and lets the best get even better. How is that a bad thing?

 

[Lawrencelot]

Seeing it doesn't mean you know how to do it. You saw a guy stuff himself in a box, think you can do it because you saw it a few times? The Internet, not online gming, is going to give the combo's away.



Because you were born in a certain part of the world means you shouldn't be able to be as good as someone else born in NYC? More competition is GOOD. It lets more become good, and lets the best get even better. How is that a bad thing?

1. That's true, but a fighting style for example can just be copied by someone else, if you never play online you could create your own style and surprise them on a real-life tourney.
2. That's not exactly what I'm saying, but I think the people who live in a place where a lot of smashers are will have a disadvantage compared to melee if there will be online gaming. For the people who live in isolated places it is good of course. But if you've ever played an mmorpg, more competition isn't always good. It makes it too hard to get to the top.

 

[TaikaAli]

Why do you compare Smash to mmorpg? It's nothing like any mmorpg.

 

[Lawrencelot]

Why do you compare Smash to mmorpg? It's nothing like any mmorpg.

No, that's what I'm saying, because of the online play it might look more like an mmorpg considering the way people get better and the amount of competition.

 

[Mic_128]

By that logic EVERY game is an MMORPG.

1. That's true, but a fighting style for example can just be copied by someone else, if you never play online you could create your own style and surprise them on a real-life tourney.

You just solved the problem. Want to keep your stratagies and moves secret? Don't play online. Problem solved!

2. That's not exactly what I'm saying, but I think the people who live in a place where a lot of smashers are will have a disadvantage compared to melee if there will be online gaming. For the people who live in isolated places it is good of course. But if you've ever played an mmorpg, more competition isn't always good. It makes it too hard to get to the top.

People who have the ability to play in a lag free environment, right there with smashers whom they can discus the game will be at a disadvantage because some guy in a small town can play online? How the heck does that work?

And there is no "top" of online brawl, since Sakurai said he doesn't plan on making any leaderboards for brawl. Which means the only real "rankings" are going to be the same we have for melee.

 

[AS Juggernaut]

There will be a whole lot more competition. Someone living on an isolated island with only one smasher might become as good as someone living in NYC for example. In Melee this was hardly possible. If everybody can become good at Brawl with little effort, it will look more like an MMORPG where everybody keeps training to get better. In Melee you have to go to tourneys, travel to friends in your country, to get better aside from fighting cpus and watch vids.

Competition is a good thing, it makes things more exciting when you can play more people who are on your level then always just going to a tournament and having to drop some cash to get the same experience. Yeah people could copy techniques, but who cares? If they become better than you with it, then they are just plain better than you. Just because somebody lives in an isolated area doesn't mean they should get the **** end of the stick, them being helped is good. People have to try hard at things to learn them, they can't just learn them from seeing them once. They actually have to work at it and become good. So I think the whole online concept is good because it makes people better, but by playing better people, you in turn will get better. It is not like an mmorpg because in those just by killing things you get better. In this you have to learn your mistakes and what you did wrong to improve yourself. You have to learn the most recent techniques that makes you kick some ***. So I'd have to say online is good.... the end.

 

[Fastinyoh]

It sounds like you don't want to step up to the challenge of fighting a more experienced player base. More competition means the average online player will get better very fast. It will be fun.

End.

 

[Garath331]

Short answer:
There will be no 'grinding' in Smash as there is in MMORPGs, as it seems you are suggesting.

Long Answer:
The MMORPG comparison is way out of line. In SSBM and an MMORPG, a player's skill goes up the longer they play. However, this isn't uniform through all players by any means. Some people learn faster, other slower. Some people can't conceive great strategies like others can. Others just aren't as dexterious. A few can read and predict their opponets moves better. These differences are much more pronounced in a fighting game than an MMORPG.
The main difference is that in an MMORPG, your character's skill goes up at a uniform rate with everybody else. This means whoever wins has probably just spent the most time playing. This is not going to be seen in Smash online. I could play for 8 hours, and possibly beat someone who has played hundreds.

 

[Kerocola]

My thoughts, online should be for fun and for battling friends only, not as tournaments and competition. If there is random battle features, you could get hackers, etc. I'd use the online play for fighting and practicing against humans only. I'd much rather be in person at a tournament.
How do online tournaments work, anyway? I don't do that online stuff very much, so it's a dumb question on my part. But, I don't think it should be determined as a mean to find out the best players. Maybe you have a really good friend play for you on your Wii and you suck, nobody will know who's actually fighting in person(or if you brag about how good you are and challenge someone, get their friend to fight for them). But if you want to get really big, I doubt you could pull that one off anyhow. Personally, I think there might be tournaments, but I don't think there will be a rating system(glad) so that's for fun. The major stuff, in my opinion will be in person. So online won't have much downsides, just to play and practice against friends you know, and not use that for your recognition.
'Scuse my online-knowledge for the tournament part, but all the other stuff I said hopefully makes sense. Online will, to me, be good for playing my friends who live far away(always wanted to)and more human practice. For major stuff, I'd say in person. There will still be those tournaments, or at least I'm pretty dang sure.

 

[HideousBeing]

lol, OK, these could all be seen as pros instead of cons.

-Maybe there will be less tournaments. As everybody can just fight humans over the internet, you don't need to go to a real-life tourney to fight the best players. The tournaments won't disappear of course, but I expect they will be less.

Pro: It's convenient to not have to travel or pay to get a chance to play good, experienced players.
Con: I can see how this is a con too. A tourney is something you look forward to, and having to pay and travel to get in only makes the experience that much more rewarding.

-Any trick/technique you invent will be known to the rest of the players if you play online. In Melee, when someone made up a combo, it would take some time before other players got to know it. The only way to do a trick somebody else invented, was to see his vid or see him in real life. In Brawl, you can't do a trick of your own anymore because everybody who you play with can see it.

Pro: I'll just state this gaming proverb: "To lose is to learn. To win is to teach."
Con: Yeah, it would be unfortunate to get robbed of credit for a move you discovered, and it is nice to **** with a new trick you discover while it remains your trick.

-There will be a whole lot more competition. Someone living on an isolated island with only one smasher might become as good as someone living in NYC for example. In Melee this was hardly possible. If everybody can become good at Brawl with little effort, it will look more like an MMORPG where everybody keeps training to get better. In Melee you have to go to tourneys, travel to friends in your country, to get better aside from fighting cpus and watch vids.

Pro: Again, there are people, like those guys on the Global Smasher Compendium with no other marked players within miles, who would give anything for this opportunity. You have to respect the needs of players who are disadvantaged by their locale.
Con: Mmmm.... I really can't see how this a bad thing at all. If everyone is better from online play, there is more of a challenge for all players. I read some Mod's post saying something along the lines of, "You can't get better ****** n00bs over and over again. You need competition and a challenge to improve." So true. Players need the online play to expose them to better players, and better strategies.

 

[Lawrencelot]

Alright, you guys convinced me: the advantages of brawl online are worth more than the disadvantages (although we still have to see how it looks like). But I wasn't stating the advantages, this was to see what you guys thought about the disadvantages. No need to try to convince me anymore, but feel free to still give your opinion and discuss.

 

[h2ownage]

this is a bit off-topic and probably a few slightly ******** questions, but i thought i might as well post it here rather than making a whole thread.

with online play will u be able to wear headsets to chat with your opponents? and also will it be automated match up? like in some games where its based on wins and win percentages so u would play someone ur own level.

 

[Lawrencelot]

this is a bit off-topic and probably a few slightly ******** questions, but i thought i might as well post it here rather than making a whole thread.

with online play will u be able to wear headsets to chat with your opponents? and also will it be automated match up? like in some games where its based on wins and win percentages so u would play someone ur own level.

You can just ask that here. I think we don't get headsets, or maybe a few years later, nintendo doesn't have many games with headsets, and smashbros would be more fun with one, but it isn't necessary. I think the match up is something you can choose, someone hosts a game and you see their player name and you join it if you want. There will be no online ranking, as Sakurai said.

 

[DeeDoubleU]

Jeez... I wasn't expecting to come into this topic and only see things that I actually like or am ambivalent to as the reasons for online being bad. Since when was strong competition a bad thing?

 

[Garath331]

Nobody knows anything about Brawl's online play except that it will exist.

And as long as products like http://www.everythingusb.com/microsoft_lifechat_zx-6000.html exist, it's a possiblity. Remember, the Wii has USB ports in the back.

 

[Mysteryfox1]

jeah online brawl should be cool because if you don't have a lot of friends that are good like me and you don't want to travel very far you just do it on the wii you never get always the same strategies and mains from you're friends and maby you can play a tournament on brawl if there is a forum involved there you can just do a tournament It'll not be as fun as a real tournement but it's still a tournament my opionon is that online brawl should rock

 

[Edg]

<sorry if this topic is made before>

As I was thinking about the possibilities of the online gameplay for Brawl, I figured there were some downsides, although it would of course be very awesome to fight anyone on the world.

-Maybe there will be less tournaments. As everybody can just fight humans over the internet, you don't need to go to a real-life tourney to fight the best players. The tournaments won't disappear of course, but I expect they will be less.
-Any trick/technique you invent will be known to the rest of the players if you play online. In Melee, when someone made up a combo, it would take some time before other players got to know it. The only way to do a trick somebody else invented, was to see his vid or see him in real life. In Brawl, you can't do a trick of your own anymore because everybody who you play with can see it.
-There will be a whole lot more competition. Someone living on an isolated island with only one smasher might become as good as someone living in NYC for example. In Melee this was hardly possible. .

I totally disagree with everything said here. First of all, there would be the ability to host tourny`s online, which makes setting them up 100 times easier. Also with the online play, people will be able to practice more and the tournies would be funner. What you are saying about tricks/combos is just stupid Competitive multiplayer games should be a true representation of game skill, not secret moves or unknown tactics. If the only reason you are winning is because of a move you know how to do and they dont, you dont deserve to be winning. Being creative still has its benefits because you are playing with an original playstyle, and moves are still usually credited to thier maker/user(wobbling/vidjo drop). Your third statement saying more competition is a downside is so ridiculas it isn't even worth discussing.