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Does SSBM requeres more skill than UMVC3?

yahyakun

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Dec 23, 2009
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So yea, I was discussing with my friends about this. they came with some points but I was able to counter them. what they lastly said was that I cant tell which one requires more skills because I'm not a Pro in both games.
I'd love to hear from someone that knows both games, but any other opinion would be nice as well.
happy new year

edit: requires*
 
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Bones0

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It's hard to determine which requires more skill because each game demands players develop different skill sets. I don't think there's anything wrong with debating these sorts of topics with friends as long as you accept you'll never reach any sort of conclusion. I tend to just enjoy explaining the skill sets Melee demands and let the other person decide if that is hard enough for them to enjoy or not. Anyone who knows their stuff about fighting games won't doubt that Melee has depth if they are given proper explanations on all the intricacies the game has to offer. Melee has so many mixups and mixups within mixups, precise and balanced footsies in neutral, and so many other things that make up a good fighter that it shouldn't be hard to convince open minded people the game takes a lot of skill.
 
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Spak

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In MvC, you can be combo'd literally from your first guy to your last if they don't mess up and there is literally nothing you can do about it since there is no invincibility whenever there are character swaps or when a character gets knocked out. In Melee, if you mess up then you can recover the next stock and there is no point where you literally can't do anything to help your situation. I agree with Bones0 that it is really hard to see which requires more skill because they require different types of skill. MvC is a lot of muscle memory for combos while in Melee, you have to read their DI, techs and rolls while mixing up combos so that they don't adapt and counter.
 

Massive

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Based purely on actions per minute, I'm willing to bet that SSBM is substantially more complicated than UMVC3, especially considering that Melee's inputs need to be done situationally and not in any pre-memorized order.

Then again, I've always said that UMVC3 is closer to DDR than a fighting game.
 

yahyakun

Smash Cadet
Joined
Dec 23, 2009
Messages
65
@ Bones0 Bones0 , yea you are right. i showed them your comment and they were impressed because they said that you guys will me melee biased. but you prove them wrong lol (he had another discussion about that lol)
so yea i guess we wont reach any conclusion. they got tired of speaking about it. we were debating from 3am to 6am lol.

@ Spak Spak , i told them exactly that. and they had to agree at the end. though i didnt came with the muscle memory fact.

@ Massive Massive , you are so right. that game depends a lot in memory. But in melee, while you need even more training to master some techniques, you also have to know where, what percentage, gravity, to who, with who, stage hazards and be careful of killing yourself (edit: and the DI, which is the most important fact). you cant DDR and expect to always have a combo in melee lol
 
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Teran

Through Fire, Justice is Served
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What makes Melee so difficult is not necessarily the individual techniques, since being able to perform them in isolation is pretty attainable for most players, but rather the fact that all of the tech has to be dynamically applied in action chains.

Although the individual actions and some action chains are obviously commuted to muscle memory, a lot of the tech skill you're going to apply has to be decided on the fly in extremely narrow windows of time, which can often lead to technical flubs in a chain of actions. So while performing that chain would be easy in solo practice when you're prepared to perform every action, the dynamic nature of a match changes things completely.

To me top level Melee play isn't so much defined by technical skill as it is incredible presence of mind and decision making speed. Some players may compensate for the lack of the latter with great knowledge of options within the game and planning everything several steps in advance, but then that ties to the former, having the presence of mind to assess and understand the many options within the game before committing to a sequence of actions.

This level of depth, pace and flat out difficulty makes Melee rightfully daunting to tackle but hey it's also makes it so rewarding and fun to play, as well as to watch.

I can't compare it to MvC, but as a game in general, Melee has a level of strategic depth combined with execution requirements that make me feel the game has one of the highest skill ceilings of anything (even outside of just videoganes) I've ever seen.

But idk just my .02
 

ItsChon

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...of the highest skill ceilings of anything (even outside of just videoganes) I've ever seen.
Great post, all true; but this sentence though. While Smash is definitely one of the hardest games out there, it doesn't really compare to any kind of Sport that you could play.
 

Teran

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Great post, all true; but this sentence though. While Smash is definitely one of the hardest games out there, it doesn't really compare to any kind of Sport that you could play.
Well idk I'm an ex athlete so I might be biased in some regards to the difficulty of athletic stuff, but I'm also referring to a skill ceiling.

Sports and such other things foster such intense levels of competition and excellence because billions of people play certain sports, coupled with obscene amounts of money invested into said sports incentivising the level of dedication and training required to reach that peak.

Melee is just a grassroots fighter, although it has a pretty large player base. Funnily enough though it's been around for 12 years and it's still not been technically maxed out, and some people insist that certain things are just flat out too difficult to apply practically.

So hey if it's 12 years strong with dedicated players and not even at its potential peak of technical execution (forget the strategic application), then I think that counts for something haha.

Hardest game ever is Go/Weiqi though obv
 
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ItsChon

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Well idk I'm an ex athlete so I might be biased in some regards to the difficulty of athletic stuff, but I'm also referring to a skill ceiling.

Sports and such other things foster such intense levels of competition and excellence because billions of people play certain sports, coupled with obscene amounts of money invested into said sports incentivising the level of dedication and training required to reach that peak.

Melee is just a grassroots fighter, although it has a pretty large player base. Funnily enough though it's been around for 12 years and it's still not been technically maxed out, and some people insist that certain things are just flat out too difficult to apply practically.

So hey if it's 12 years strong with dedicated players and not even at its potential peak of technical execution (forget the strategic application), then I think that counts for something haha.
Fair enough, not much I can say to that.
Hardest game ever is Go/Weiqi though obv
Wow, let's back up a second. You play Go too? Wow, the hype is kinda real. I want to play you now.
 
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Teran

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Wow, let's back up a second. You play Go too? Wow, the hype is kinda real. I want to play you now.
Not since all my Chinese friends went back home after their studies finished but I'm definitely getting back into it soon. I'll definitely let you know when I've brushed back up haha.
 

Shaq

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Yo man alls I know is dat **** be harder for me than basketball
 
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