Camping, Shields and Recovery

[theSug1]

Camping.......Players are beginning to do this a lot. Sit by the corner, wait for you to come in, shield, grab, throw you off the ledge, run to other side of field. Rinse wash repeat. Players will shield when you attack. That's fine. But somehow when I throw an attack, rush, jab, smash, tilt....the attack whiffs and they come out of shield before I can recover. In fact sometimes even while I'm still in the attack animation.

The question is this: How do I deal with wiffed attacks on shields and rolls? I know how to play smash since the 64. I am somewhat confused why I will throw an attack and I get punished when the opponent's shield is "stunned" from the attack and they can recover faster than I can. I understand shield grab, but not when they roll and I throw a punch and they can get their shield up before I connect. We are talking mid roll here, I will force out the roll, attack in the direction of the roll, they roll away then shield almost instantly and that causes my to be stunned while attacking the shield, then I get a tilt or smash attack to the face.

Also another thing I don't understand is how this doesn't work for me. I have been attacked while shielding, I drop the shield to counter attack and I get punched in the face. I know the fundamentals of smash, so if you say it's because my timing is off, I would have to disagree. Yes it is possibly, but I am imputting moves fast upon blocking with shield and attempting to attack back.

I'm just not sure how come so many characters can roll then shield then punish so freaking fast. I have read the forums about camping, and mixing up your play style and getting better. Sure, I get all that. But I am looking for fundamental data as to how the shield works and how to punish it, not how I can improve as a player with my tactics.

 

[Cammed Z28]

Camping has been in every multiplayer game ever, and will be. Why there are SOO many threads about camping, and camping in ssb4 vs camping in brawl, or why campers suck, or how to beat a camper? Come on people lol

Camper gonna camp.

 

[theSug1]

This thread was about shields and how to use them against campers actually. I was not complaining, just setting the stage for my question.

 

[Jerm]

Its tough man. I'm a Shulk main and its extremely frustrating playing against people like that because it runs out the timer on my arts lol. The only thing I've found to work against people that camp the edge is to use a character with a projectile. My main alongside Shulk is Mario and Mario's fireball goes a loooong way. It allows me to more easily close the distance, to constantly pressure my opponent, and to deter frequent and abusive rolling.

So if your mains are DHD and Greninja, just spam your projectiles until they are forced to leave the corner or until you can safely approach and punish their shielding with a grab.

 

[theSug1]

I should change that Main character. I am playing a LOT of characters trying to find a main. I'm just not having fun against characters that stand on the edge all game. I like a good and fair fight. I know camping is a tactic, but it's not really fun. And that's why I bought the game. Mind you using the edge is fine, but just standing there or running from edge to edge is just meh.

I am starting to get a grasp on rolling over and over and responding to shields. But I am honestly unclear on how attacking a shielded character opens you up for SO MUCH punishment if you land a hit on the shield.

 

[Jerm]

I should change that Main character. I am playing a LOT of characters trying to find a main. I'm just not having fun against characters that stand on the edge all game. I like a good and fair fight. I know camping is a tactic, but it's not really fun. And that's why I bought the game. Mind you using the edge is fine, but just standing there or running from edge to edge is just meh.

I am starting to get a grasp on rolling over and over and responding to shields. But I am honestly unclear on how attacking a shielded character opens you up for SO MUCH punishment if you land a hit on the shield.

Yea its insane. Even using Shulks Nair, which is his only lagless attack, I still am unable to act fast enough to punish their shield. I end up getting shield grabbed. I wish there was a tiny bit of shield stun so when you hit a shielded enemy they cant move for a certain amount of frames to prevent super hyper defense. Again the only thing that I can do that works against that is approaching behind a projectile, like Mario's fireball, and then going for a grab.

 

[Rhubarbo]

Smash 4 has a bunch of defensive asymmetry to accommodate new players:

-Forgiving ledges help players recover more easily.
-Shields that come up and down quickly allow players to block more reliably.
-Multiple air dodging allows players to evade getting juggled.
-High landing lag discourages attacking grounded players with aerials (a relatively advanced tactic).
-High knock back stunts potentially frustrating combos.

And so on.

However, these attributes are easily abused by skilled players, making intermediate-high level play extremely imbalanced toward the defensive side of things.

There are novel strategies around campy, defensive game play, but they usually require your opponent to mess up. Like the cliche goes, don't hate the player, hate the game.