Bandana Dee, the Spear Master! (v(- ' ' -)>↑ ~ Dee wait is killing us...

[Turmalinium]

lol nobody likes Beam, no matter how much Hal tries to make it popular, it simply not going to happen

Beam was actually pretty good in Super Star Ultra.

 

[Aunt Jemima]

lol nobody likes Beam, no matter how much Hal tries to make it popular, it simply not going to happen

Beam is one of the most fun powers to use in the game. I'd go to say that it's the staple power of the Kirby series, usually being the first one you get. Also, Beam has one of the most addicting jumping dash attacks.

 

[BandanaWaddleDee]

Okay, another thing I'm wondering is in terms of Kirby games - if HAL were to remake another Kirby game for either 3DS or Wii U (you decide), what game would you want?

For me, I'd love a re-make of Kirby & The Amazing Mirror on the 3DS using the same engine as Triple Deluxe. That'd be really fun, haha. I honestly think it would be great to have another multiplayer Kirby game, mostly a free-roaming one. I'd like it more on the 3DS because there wouldn't be any framerate drops when doing multiplayer, due to the fact that there's multiple pieces of hardware all connecting. On the Wii U, I'm sure loading four different areas would cause framerate drops, so I'd prefer to have it on the 3DS.

A remake of Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards on Wii U running on the Return to Dreamland engine with four or even five players at a time. Give the powers more than just one attack and improve the combined powers. Also change Waddle Dee to Bandana Dee

 

[kirby_queen]

A remake of Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards on Wii U running on the Return to Dreamland engine with four or even five players at a time. Give the powers more than just one attack and improve the combined powers. Also change Waddle Dee to Bandana Dee

Everything said here.

Though I'd doubt they'd overhaul the original game. At this point it'll be a straight up new game with that many changes... Still a lot of people seem to want a remake of this game so I imagine if they did do it, than it'd probably just be an HD remake of the original or something. With updated graphics. They probably wouldn't change it THAT much because it may be too different for fans of the original.

Instead they can just straight up make a new game and bring back power combining AND give the powers movesets. Kirby would be a one puffball army with a ton of moves. It'd be cool.

My favorite Kirby game was already remade so I"m happy. KSSU was fantastic.

 

[IceBreakerXY]

so let me get this straight the main 6 character people want in smash 4 are Ridley,K roil,Shulk,bandanna dee,Krystal,issac.They seem to have the must following but why does everyone count out bandanna dee i think he has a higher chance in K roil(Someone i don't even want in the game but whatever).

 

[Aunt Jemima]

A remake of Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards on Wii U running on the Return to Dreamland engine with four or even five players at a time. Give the powers more than just one attack and improve the combined powers. Also change Waddle Dee to Bandana Dee

I would love a Crystal Shards remake, but PLEASE not on the Return to Dream Land engine. The way momentum is handled in Return to Dream Land is horrible. Although, I wouldn't want Crystal Shards physics either because it felt way too clunky on some parts, mostly with the fact that momentum wasn't really carried into anything, and most actions canceled all momentum. I enjoy games like Super Star Ultra and Amazing Mirror that actually know how to handle momentum.

crystal shards in hd though

IN HD

THOUGH

DAMN

HD

Also, several changes would need to be made to the actual game itself, to fit the Kirby universe more. Some enemies would need to be replaced, removed, or added in to fit more recent iterations. Also, we need more abilities! We need abilities such as Sword (replace some Cutter combinations, along with new), Beam, and Plasma (to replace Spark). We'd also hopefully get a few newer copy abilities, such as Water, Leaf, and Beetle. It'd be fun, haha.

 

[Lloyd91]

so let me get this straight the main 6 character people want in smash 4 are Ridley,K roil,Shulk,bandanna dee,Krystal,issac.They seem to have the must following but why does everyone count out bandanna dee i think he has a higher chance in K roil(Someone i don't even want in the game but whatever).

That seems true, although I have not seen much Issac support outside smash boards

 

[IceBreakerXY]

That seems true, although I have not seen much Issac support outside smash boards

yeah it's mainly smash boards but he does have a following here.Hell i support him

 

[kirby_queen]

I would love a Crystal Shards remake, but PLEASE not on the Return to Dream Land engine. The way momentum is handled in Return to Dream Land is horrible. Although, I wouldn't want Crystal Shards physics either because it felt way too clunky on some parts, mostly with the fact that momentum wasn't really carried into anything, and most actions canceled all momentum. I enjoy games like Super Star Ultra and Amazing Mirror that actually know how to handle momentum.

crystal shards in hd though

IN HD

THOUGH

DAMN

HD

Also, several changes would need to be made to the actual game itself, to fit the Kirby universe more. Some enemies would need to be replaced, removed, or added in to fit more recent iterations. Also, we need more abilities! We need abilities such as Sword (replace some Cutter combinations, along with new), Beam, and Plasma (to replace Spark). We'd also hopefully get a few newer copy abilities, such as Water, Leaf, and Beetle. It'd be fun, haha.

I personally liked the RtDL engine better. K64 is SO SLOW in comparison and it may not be perfect but I feel like the controls were improved in Triple Deluxe. In k64 it felt as if Kirby had bricks for shoes and his flying is limiting. That's because unlike RtDL, Triple Deluxe, Amazing Mirror, etc... this game is more forced platforming and less action element to it. Kind of like Dreamland 2+3. You're forced to mostly use the powers to get around. I'm not as fond of these types of Kirby games as much personally but still like them enough and am quite nostalgic about K64. I wouldn't be opposed to a remake for the fans of this game though I'm more interested in a new Kirby game. Especially a 3D platformer.

so let me get this straight the main 6 character people want in smash 4 are Ridley,K roil,Shulk,bandanna dee,Krystal,issac.They seem to have the must following but why does everyone count out bandanna dee i think he has a higher chance in K roil(Someone i don't even want in the game but whatever).

I personally think Ridley is an odd choice but maybe I think that because I'm not a HUGE metroid fan. It's not like I don't like his character or think he's a bad or anything. I just find it surprising that fans want to downsize him. I mean I know his canon size seems to differ between games but he looks so much more impressive as a huge badass boss. I'm kind of surprised fans of the series want to see him downsized and less impressive looking just to play him. I guess I look at it this way. If a big and menacing boss from the Kirby series were shrunk down from a more impressive version.... I'd be kind of insulted, personally. Look at Nightmare who is HUGE. Now he's an AT and he's still HUGE and cool looking. The way Ridley looked as a boss in Brawl was badass... to see him small from that game to this one will feel silly to me as someone who maybe isn't as familiar with him across metroid games... but that's just me. I have a feeling that demand for him is so huge in the west that Sakurai will probably just do it.

I think Bandana Dee has a decent enough chance in comparison since he's not a character whose image you'd have to worry about in the same way. He's already got a moveset you can work with and comes from a game somewhat related to the smash series. He's charming and visually I think he fits in easy with the rest of the cast. I dunno. I don't think he's that odd of a choice vs some other suggested characters I've seen about. It's now just a matter of Sakurai feeling like adding a Kirby rep.

 

[Jiggly]

Favorite Abilities

1. Saucer? UFO? Forgot the name, but it was beam and laser hybrid, and you could also float

2, Bell was Awesome, it's block hav invincibility, plus it's dash attack was beautiful.

3. Spear. Do I need to explain?

4. Spark. It was my saving grace in Rtdl, cause when charged, all projectiles bounced off of you.

5. Leaf. Cause swag.

 

[LF2K]

My favorites.

1) Whip
2) Spear
3) Suplex
4) Yo-Yo
5) Archer

On the topic of the leak, I think it's fake. If the Ice Climbers were DLC, why would this guy show up in Smash Run?

 

[Aunt Jemima]

I personally liked the RtDL engine better. K64 is SO SLOW in comparison and it may not be perfect but I feel like the controls were improved in Triple Deluxe. In k64 it felt as if Kirby had bricks for shoes and his flying is limiting. That's because unlike RtDL, Triple Deluxe, Amazing Mirror, etc... this game is more forced platforming and less action element to it. Kind of like Dreamland 2+3. You're forced to mostly use the powers to get around. I'm not as fond of these types of Kirby games as much personally but still like them enough and am quite nostalgic about K64. I wouldn't be opposed to a remake for the fans of this game though I'm more interested in a new Kirby game. Especially a 3D platformer.

Oh god, I can see where you're coming from. Crystal Shards is really slow, mostly compared to other Kirby games. One of my biggest problems in some Kirby games is how momentum is carried over into actions such as inhaling, flying, and the air bullet. It handles similarly to Super Smash Bros. Brawl, where as none of your momentum from the ground can be carried over from a jump, but in this case, it's when flying. In Return to Dream Land, and I believe Crystal Shards, all of Kirby's momentum was canceled when trying to float out of a dash, and it really ruins the fun for me, honestly. While playing through my Bandana Dee run of Return to Dream Land, I would rarely jump more than once while in the air when going across a stage, and would rather use his dashing jump attack, even though it only gives slight momentum, just for the fact that I could carry my momentum from a dash for a little while. This is also why I find powers such as Beam more appealing, as the dashing jump attack gives a little float in the air, a boost of momentum, and still carries over the dash momentum. I also find Dream Land 3 to be insanely annoying, as you can't even move at all when you're using the air bullet. Kirby: Super Star (Ultra), and Kirby & The Amazing Mirror are the two games I'd say have the best physics for a Kirby game. I've replayed Super Star countless times just for the fact that the way physics work isn't annoying as heck.

This portion isn't directed at anybody, but in general:

I'll be honest, as much as I love Amazing Mirror, Triple Deluxe, Crystal Shards, etc. Super Star (Ultra) by far is the best Kirby game in terms of... everything. Even if you're a person who doesn't like Super Star, I don't think anybody can disagree that it handled everything in the Kirby universe the best. There were seven games to play, with the most notable ones, I'd say, being Dyna Blade, The Great Cave Offensive, and Revenge of Meta Knight. Several great features started in Super Star, such as:

- Helper System, which allows you to create a friend to fight with you. This also allowed for the first cooperative Kirby game, allowing the second player to take control of a helper. The AI for the helpers while a CPU is very detailed, especially for it's time, making it truly seem like people were fighting by your side.

Personal Experience: With the fact that cooperative gameplay was present, this game has some of my most favorite Kirby memories. Playing through the game with a friend or a sibling is especially fun, finding all the secrets, exploring areas, and just helping each other out. While it may be a bit weird, whenever I brought out Helper, I would always treasure them. I would actually get a bit sad when they died, so I always tried to protect them, and when they were low on health, I would search for items to help them out. I especially like Poppy Bros Jr. and Parasol Dee. I would love to see this feature come back to more recent titles.

- HP System, which was a continuous tracking of health for both the players and enemies. This feature allowed more depth to the game, as the familiar health bars weren't present. This allowed for actual power to be represented through enemies, with bosses doing more damage to you than regular enemies. The feature also allowed enemies to survive more than one hit, as they had also received health. This feature has been carried over into every modern Kirby game, including Squeak Squad, Return to Dream Land, and Triple Deluxe.

Personal Experience: I favor regular health systems much more over health bars, as it allows for more varying depth to the game. It allows stronger enemies and bosses to show how strong they truly are, such as how Dyna Blade can grab you and strangle you to take hit you multiple amounts of times. Stronger enemies can differentiate themselves from common, weak enemies such as Waddle Dee's, by actually doing more damage. This has been one of the features to carry over to recent Kirby games that would be truly missed if ever left out.

- Improved Copy Ability System, which had made copy abilities have more than one, single attack. This allowed for more depth to copy abilities, and more unique fighting and platforming, as it had made both the player and enemies have several different attacks. Enemies such as Birdon can charge towards you with Condor Head, then use Feather Gun to attack you. This feature has been carried over to every modern Kirby game, allowing more depth, better platforming, and more fun.

Personal Experience: The fact that Kirby had received multiple attacks through one Copy Ability is, in my opinion, the best feature from Super Star. I loved trying out all of the new moves that I received when getting a Copy Ability, instead of one move that I'd know in a second. This had expanded the capabilities of Kirby by a ton, and had thrown in some unique quirks to the franchise. Copy Abilities could truly be recognized as what they are, allowing Kirby to take all of the abilities of an enemy. Unique features on Copy Abilities had been added, such as how Plasma could build up electricity for a shield, or how Wing allowed the player to fly faster. I couldn't even imagine going back to only one attack for each Copy Ability, and could never see this feature going away.

- Multiple Games in one, which had been the several different games to play in one. This included Spring Breeze, Dyna Blade, The Great Cave Offensive, Gourmet Race, Revenge of Meta Knight, and Milky Way Wishes. The game had included multiple stories, showing Kirby as he went through Dream Land, with multiple stories to be told. With several modes to play, the game was expansive, and allowed the player to truly understand Kirby, and what he does.

Personal Experience: This is one of the main features that make Kirby: Super Star feel unique to the other games, and I love it. Every game that was included was a blast, with my favorites definitely being The Great Cave Offensive and Milky Way Wishes. As a child, The Great Cave Offensive was a HUGE, and took be a significant amount of time to finish. It was a fun, challenging, and rewarding game mode, trying to find all of the treasure. Seeing all of the little references to other Nintendo games, such as finding a Triforce, was always fun to see. This was the mode I cared most for my helpers, and where my helpers cared most for me. Exploring the unknown with a Poppy Bros Jr. was an insane amount of fun, and probably my favorite part of Super Star as a Kirby game.

Hopefully this post was a nice read for anybody who finished it, as I'd rather not waste anybodies time, but I just felt like saying it. I do truly feel that Super Star made the most use of all of Kirby's abilities, and the franchise as a whole. The game expressed Kirby how he truly should be, a "jolly fellow" (cheers to anybody who gets that reference!).

Side Note:

I want the "Beginner's Show" to be re-created in 3D, or return in a Kirby game for the Wii U or 3DS. That was such a fun part of Super Star, I really loved it. Also, the music was fantastic. Here's the Air Ride version for anybody who wants to give it a listen (and you should!):

 

[LF2K]

Oh, and another thing that busts this leak wide open... An ESRB employee was supposedly the source of all this information leaking out. If the ESRB was responsible for that, Nintendo would have sued their butts off.

Here's an analysis I found that runs through why it might be fake.

Spoiler

 

[Sobreviviente]

A remake of Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards on Wii U running on the Return to Dreamland engine with four or even five players at a time. Give the powers more than just one attack and improve the combined powers. Also change Waddle Dee to Bandana Dee

You are a monster

I think is good just how it is, maybe a bit faster and a new third level of combinations will be nice also, heavy lobster theme when you fight this guy.

 

[kirby_queen]

Oh god, I can see where you're coming from. Crystal Shards is really slow, mostly compared to other Kirby games. One of my biggest problems in some Kirby games is how momentum is carried over into actions such as inhaling, flying, and the air bullet. It handles similarly to Super Smash Bros. Brawl, where as none of your momentum from the ground can be carried over from a jump, but in this case, it's when flying. In Return to Dream Land, and I believe Crystal Shards, all of Kirby's momentum was canceled when trying to float out of a dash, and it really ruins the fun for me, honestly. While playing through my Bandana Dee run of Return to Dream Land, I would rarely jump more than once while in the air when going across a stage, and would rather use his dashing jump attack, even though it only gives slight momentum, just for the fact that I could carry my momentum from a dash for a little while. This is also why I find powers such as Beam more appealing, as the dashing jump attack gives a little float in the air, a boost of momentum, and still carries over the dash momentum. I also find Dream Land 3 to be insanely annoying, as you can't even move at all when you're using the air bullet. Kirby: Super Star (Ultra), and Kirby & The Amazing Mirror are the two games I'd say have the best physics for a Kirby game. I've replayed Super Star countless times just for the fact that the way physics work isn't annoying as heck.

This portion isn't directed at anybody, but in general:

I'll be honest, as much as I love Amazing Mirror, Triple Deluxe, Crystal Shards, etc. Super Star (Ultra) by far is the best Kirby game in terms of... everything. Even if you're a person who doesn't like Super Star, I don't think anybody can disagree that it handled everything in the Kirby universe the best. There were seven games to play, with the most notable ones, I'd say, being Dyna Blade, The Great Cave Offensive, and Revenge of Meta Knight. Several great features started in Super Star, such as:

- Helper System, which allows you to create a friend to fight with you. This also allowed for the first cooperative Kirby game, allowing the second player to take control of a helper. The AI for the helpers while a CPU is very detailed, especially for it's time, making it truly seem like people were fighting by your side.

Personal Experience: With the fact that cooperative gameplay was present, this game has some of my most favorite Kirby memories. Playing through the game with a friend or a sibling is especially fun, finding all the secrets, exploring areas, and just helping each other out. While it may be a bit weird, whenever I brought out Helper, I would always treasure them. I would actually get a bit sad when they died, so I always tried to protect them, and when they were low on health, I would search for items to help them out. I especially like Poppy Bros Jr. and Parasol Dee. I would love to see this feature come back to more recent titles.

- HP System, which was a continuous tracking of health for both the players and enemies. This feature allowed more depth to the game, as the familiar health bars weren't present. This allowed for actual power to be represented through enemies, with bosses doing more damage to you than regular enemies. The feature also allowed enemies to survive more than one hit, as they had also received health. This feature has been carried over into every modern Kirby game, including Squeak Squad, Return to Dream Land, and Triple Deluxe.

Personal Experience: I favor regular health systems much more over health bars, as it allows for more varying depth to the game. It allows stronger enemies and bosses to show how strong they truly are, such as how Dyna Blade can grab you and strangle you to take hit you multiple amounts of times. Stronger enemies can differentiate themselves from common, weak enemies such as Waddle Dee's, by actually doing more damage. This has been one of the features to carry over to recent Kirby games that would be truly missed if ever left out.

- Improved Copy Ability System, which had made copy abilities have more than one, single attack. This allowed for more depth to copy abilities, and more unique fighting and platforming, as it had made both the player and enemies have several different attacks. Enemies such as Birdon can charge towards you with Condor Head, then use Feather Gun to attack you. This feature has been carried over to every modern Kirby game, allowing more depth, better platforming, and more fun.

Personal Experience: The fact that Kirby had received multiple attacks through one Copy Ability is, in my opinion, the best feature from Super Star. I loved trying out all of the new moves that I received when getting a Copy Ability, instead of one move that I'd know in a second. This had expanded the capabilities of Kirby by a ton, and had thrown in some unique quirks to the franchise. Copy Abilities could truly be recognized as what they are, allowing Kirby to take all of the abilities of an enemy. Unique features on Copy Abilities had been added, such as how Plasma could build up electricity for a shield, or how Wing allowed the player to fly faster. I couldn't even imagine going back to only one attack for each Copy Ability, and could never see this feature going away.

- Multiple Games in one, which had been the several different games to play in one. This included Spring Breeze, Dyna Blade, The Great Cave Offensive, Gourmet Race, Revenge of Meta Knight, and Milky Way Wishes. The game had included multiple stories, showing Kirby as he went through Dream Land, with multiple stories to be told. With several modes to play, the game was expansive, and allowed the player to truly understand Kirby, and what he does.

Personal Experience: This is one of the main features that make Kirby: Super Star feel unique to the other games, and I love it. Every game that was included was a blast, with my favorites definitely being The Great Cave Offensive and Milky Way Wishes. As a child, The Great Cave Offensive was a HUGE, and took be a significant amount of time to finish. It was a fun, challenging, and rewarding game mode, trying to find all of the treasure. Seeing all of the little references to other Nintendo games, such as finding a Triforce, was always fun to see. This was the mode I cared most for my helpers, and where my helpers cared most for me. Exploring the unknown with a Poppy Bros Jr. was an insane amount of fun, and probably my favorite part of Super Star as a Kirby game.

Hopefully this post was a nice read for anybody who finished it, as I'd rather not waste anybodies time, but I just felt like saying it. I do truly feel that Super Star made the most use of all of Kirby's abilities, and the franchise as a whole. The game expressed Kirby how he truly should be, a "jolly fellow" (cheers to anybody who gets that reference!).

Side Note:

I want the "Beginner's Show" to be re-created in 3D, or return in a Kirby game for the Wii U or 3DS. That was such a fun part of Super Star, I really loved it. Also, the music was fantastic. Here's the Air Ride version for anybody who wants to give it a listen (and you should!):

Yeah Kirby Super Star is my favorite for a lot of the same reasons. It really is a beloved Kirby game. Especially in Japan it's quite an important game. Placing Kirby in high regards in the same way Link and Megaman are. Which is a shame the game's influence and level of awesome were never quite as recognized here in the west.

As for the momentum being kind of tripped up in recent games.... I have seen hardcore Kirby fans master the air puffs when speed running and it's pretty impressive.

Kind of like the beginning of this TAS speed run for an idea of what I mean here.

(keeping in mind this is TAS video, but just showing an example of the movement)

I do agree that movement in KSS is the best. However I think that the reason Kirby hasn't returned to that speed and movement is because Kirby is now in 3D. He's three dimensional with an added sense of depth and weight. He can't just move like a sprite on screen. He has to land with weight and blow air with an animation with his detailed movement now. I don't think Kirby will ever go back to moving as he does in KSS with the way the games look now and part of that honestly comes from updating Kirby and the appearance of his games for a new generation. Which can't honestly be helped entirely. Still maybe they can find a good culmination of these preferences for all fans.

Also check out this awesome and super impressive Arena Run in KSS where the person has to keep a Kirby alive with only 1 hit left. No one is controlling the Kirby. More reason why people love KSS and it's design. So open for fans to replay in various ways that allow one to challenge themselves if they want. While still being a good entry level series.

 

[FangedSniper]

If KSS is supposedly the best of the series, then wouldn't KSSU be the absolute best? I mean, it took the concept and expanded on it, with nicer cutscenes and a few new game modes. What wasn't to love?

 

[Sobreviviente]

I think is all about personal tastes.
I dont like the fact that you cant short jump in KSS, this ruined everything to me and the level design didnt help that much... but i love how the air puffs works.

I preffer D3 physics overall, they are very realistic and the slide is not a killing move anymore AM, EY (the ice floor... ) and Adventure were also pretty nice i guess.

 

[kirby_queen]

If KSS is supposedly the best of the series, then wouldn't KSSU be the absolute best? I mean, it took the concept and expanded on it, with nicer cutscenes and a few new game modes. What wasn't to love?

They're both the best. >:D There are elements I like more in original KSS like no pauses between attacks and more enemies but there are things I like more in KSSU like everything you listed and True Arenas now being a thing. So I say everyone should play both.

I think is all about personal tastes.
I dont like the fact that you cant short jump in KSS, this ruined everything to me and the level design didnt help that much... but i love how the air puffs works.

I preffer D3 physics overall, they are very realistic and the slide is not a killing move anymore AM, EY (the ice floor... ) and Adventure were also pretty nice i guess.

Eh some people like those Shinichi Shimomura games more. I guess they like a basic platformer more and that's fine. It's hard to compare preferences but I do prefer Sakurai's KSS to any of those games because the design is a lot more open to so many ways of play. I have to say of those Shinichi titles I think Dreamland 2 is better than Dreamland 3 personally. A little More challenging and quicker movement.

 

[Aunt Jemima]

Yeah Kirby Super Star is my favorite for a lot of the same reasons. It really is a beloved Kirby game. Especially in Japan it's quite an important game. Placing Kirby in high regards in the same way Link and Megaman are. Which is a shame the game's influence and level of awesome were never quite as recognized here in the west.

As for the momentum being kind of tripped up in recent games.... I have seen hardcore Kirby fans master the air puffs when speed running and it's pretty impressive.

Kind of like the beginning of this TAS speed run for an idea of what I mean here.

(keeping in mind this is TAS video, but just showing an example of the movement)

I do agree that movement in KSS is the best. However I think that the reason Kirby hasn't returned to that speed and movement is because Kirby is now in 3D. He's three dimensional with an added sense of depth and weight. He can't just move like a sprite on screen. He has to land with weight and blow air with an animation with his detailed movement now. I don't think Kirby will ever go back to moving as he does in KSS with the way the games look now and part of that honestly comes from updating Kirby and the appearance of his games for a new generation. Which can't honestly be helped entirely. Still maybe they can find a good culmination of these preferences for all fans.

Also check out this awesome and super impressive Arena Run in KSS where the person has to keep a Kirby alive with only 1 hit left. No one is controlling the Kirby. More reason why people love KSS and it's design. So open for fans to replay in various ways that allow one to challenge themselves if they want. While till being a good entry level series.

I wouldn't ever expect Kirby to become popular in the west, mainly because the demographic is completely different. I completely understand what you meant about Kirby now being 3D, as he has to move fluidly, and animations can't cut each other off like they can with sprites. I feel like Kirby moves better in Super Smash Bros. as he can still carry his momentum from his dash, so he still moves fluidly without looking odd. As you said, I'm sure he'll never move as fast, but hopefully they'll be able to combine the different preferences of the players into one. I wouldn't give up his newer incarnations just for fluid movement, however. Kirby seems to express himself a lot better, and is definitely cuter, haha. I replay Super Star a bunch, it's just such a good game. Also, that Arena run was fun to watch. It seems it'd be really hard to do, haha. Just goes to show that Helpers are always trying their best to save Kirby (even if they're human-controlled).

If KSS is supposedly the best of the series, then wouldn't KSSU be the absolute best? I mean, it took the concept and expanded on it, with nicer cutscenes and a few new game modes. What wasn't to love?

I mainly refer to Super Star, as it's where all of the great features originated. I'm sure it's because of nostalgia, but I prefer Super Star over Ultra mainly because of the SNES design and how it feels in general. I feel like it's a bit more fluid than Ultra. I still love Ultra, though. Mostly the Dyna Blade cutscenes, haha.

 

[SS-bros14]

According to some detractors:
-Bandana Dee can't come because the last time he came was years ago. (Guess he's never played Triple Deluxe )
-He's rarely appeared in any games. (Um, RTDL, Triple Deluxe, and other games as bosses and helpers )
-Waddle Dee is a Smash Run enemy. (Um, R.O.B. )
Do detractors even do research sometimes?

 

[Aunt Jemima]

According to some detractors:
-Bandana Dee can't come because the last time he came was years ago. (Guess he's never played Triple Deluxe )
-He's rarely appeared in any games. (Um, RTDL, Triple Deluxe, and other games as bosses and helpers )
-Waddle Dee is a Smash Run enemy. (Yeah, it's not like people get confused when Mario slaps on that Luigi alt )
Do detractors even do research sometimes?

There's not much detractors that are actually educated on what they're talking about. Most of them say bad things towards characters just due to the fact that they think their favorite character won't get in. I honestly think that every character still has a reason to be in the game, some just aren't as relevant as others.

 

[CodeBlue_]

They're both the best. >:D There are elements I like more in original KSS like no pauses between attacks and more enemies but there are things I like more in KSSU like everything you listed and True Arenas now being a thing. So I say everyone should play both.



Eh some people like those Shinichi Shimomura games more. I guess they like a basic platformer more and that's fine. It's hard to compare preferences but I do prefer Sakurai's KSS to any of those games because the design is a lot more open to so many ways of play. I have to say of those Shinichi titles I think Dreamland 2 is better than Dreamland 3 personally. A little More challenging and quicker movement.

Hold on what games did Shimomura develop? I have never heard of this developer before.

 

[IronFish]

There's not much detractors that are actually educated on what they're talking about. Most of them say bad things towards characters just due to the fact that they think their favorite character won't get in. I honestly think that every character still has a reason to be in the game, some just aren't as relevant as others.

Really the only detractors that really had good points, and were educated, were Chrom detractors like me who actually had good points, and in the end were right.

 

[SS-bros14]

There's not much detractors that are actually educated on what they're talking about. Most of them say bad things towards characters just due to the fact that they think their favorite character won't get in. I honestly think that every character still has a reason to be in the game, some just aren't as relevant as others.

Yeah, because that guy also said:
1. Ridley and Bandana Dee are Gag characters. (Characters with great powers and abilities are just trolls? )
2. Ridley and Badana Dee have no moveset potiential (A space dragon and weapon wielded have no moveset potiential? )
3. Ridley would make 3DS crash. (Even though we have other characters as big as he could be in smash. )
4. Snake, a third-party has a better chance. (Despite how Sakurai feels about 3rd parties and Bandana Dee is his own creation. )
5. They can't be revealed soon. (Why? )

 

[Sobreviviente]

Eh some people like those Shinichi Shimomura games more. I guess they like a basic platformer more and that's fine. It's hard to compare preferences but I do prefer Sakurai's KSS to any of those games because the design is a lot more open to so many ways of play. I have to say of those Shinichi titles I think Dreamland 2 is better than Dreamland 3 personally. A little More challenging and quicker movement.

The thing i love more about kirby is the puzzles (something to do) and the way you handle the enemies (because kirby is a badass ).

KSS didnt really maked me feel that im actually doing something, the enemies were just too pointless considering how many attacks you have, and outside The Great Cave Offensive (best of the game by far ) the puzzles were just... yeah, no thanks.

I dont think is coincidence that the Arena and now Kirby Fighters has become more popular and relevant as time goes, it really is all about fights and nothing else, is not something bad but it needs more complexity and deep personally.

And yeah, D2 is better :B

 

[Aunt Jemima]

For those who don't know (I didn't write this):

Sakurai Kirby is more action-oriented, with emphasis on variety of attacking abilities and (generally) more bosses. Ability Caps are usually associated with this style. Games in this style would be Kirby's Adventure, Kirby Super Star, The Amazing Mirror and Squeak Squad (though he wasn't involved in the last one).

Shimomura Kirby is a different style. There are less abilities and (usually) less bosses, but the focus is spent more on puzzles and the creative things you can do with the abilities you get, and the standard enemies seem to be more imaginative. This style is characterized by alternative art styles and a larger cast of unique friends. Games in this style would be Kirby's Dream Land 2, Kirby's Dream Land 3, Kirby 64: The Crystal Shard and Kirby Canvas Curse (though again, I don't think he [or she?] was involved in that last one).

--------------

I personally prefer Sakurai Kirby a lot more. However, I do enjoy Crystal Shard.

 

[kirby_queen]

Yeah, because that guy also said:
1. Ridley and Bandana Dee are Gag characters. (Characters with great powers and abilities are just trolls? )
2. Ridley and Badana Dee have no moveset potiential (A space dragon and weapon wielded have no moveset potiential? )
3. Ridley would make 3DS crash. (Even though we have other characters as big as he could be in smash. )
4. Snake, a third-party has a better chance. (Despite how Sakurai feels about 3rd parties and Bandana Dee is his own creation. )
5. They can't be revealed soon. (Why? )

I don't even bother with someone who responds like this. They don't like or give a crap about the Kirby franchise and they just don't want Bandana Dee in because they want someone else from a franchise they like in. They're not interested in good reasons as to why they are wrong (because they don't care. Bandana Dee already has a moveset Smash team can work with and has been in all recent games) . Facts don't matter. They have a vague idea of the enemy in the franchise and that's it. Whatever.

 

[Sobreviviente]

There are less abilities

There are more abilities actually they are just more basic because of the combinations.

Wouldnt add Kirbys Adventure, AM or SS on the "sakurai style" but yeah, thats the idea.

 

[kirby_queen]

The thing i love more about kirby is the puzzles (something to do) and the way you handle the enemies (because kirby is a badass ).

KSS didnt really maked me feel that im actually doing something, the enemies were just too pointless considering how many attacks you have, and outside The Great Cave Offensive (best of the game by far ) the puzzles were just... yeah, no thanks.

I dont think is coincidence that the Arena and now Kirby Fighters has become more popular and relevant as time goes, it really is all about fights and nothing else, is not something bad but it needs more complexity and deep personally.

And yeah, D2 is better :B

Meh, if you're interested in puzzle platformers than there are many many many other franchises that fill this gap and better, but KSS style games are of the few entry level action games whose design is open enough for players of all levels to enjoy. The platforming itself I think is fun with the powers because it gives you new ways to run a level and navigate it as you please. Just look at different runs for Gourmet Race, Track 3, with the various powers. Using each power and it's particular moves yields a different experience.

I think recent games try to do both things. Combine a more puzzle oriented straight forward platforming experience with the movesets still in place. If you haven't played Triple Deluxe than check it out.

For those who don't know (I didn't write this):

Sakurai Kirby is more action-oriented, with emphasis on variety of attacking abilities and (generally) more bosses. Ability Caps are usually associated with this style. Games in this style would be Kirby's Adventure, Kirby Super Star, The Amazing Mirror and Squeak Squad (though he wasn't involved in the last one).

Shimomura Kirby is a different style. There are less abilities and (usually) less bosses, but the focus is spent more on puzzles and the creative things you can do with the abilities you get, and the standard enemies seem to be more imaginative. This style is characterized by alternative art styles and a larger cast of unique friends. Games in this style would be Kirby's Dream Land 2, Kirby's Dream Land 3, Kirby 64: The Crystal Shard and Kirby Canvas Curse (though again, I don't think he [or she?] was involved in that last one).

--------------

I personally prefer Sakurai Kirby a lot more. However, I do enjoy Crystal Shard.

eh I wouldn't put Canvas Curse into the Shimomura category. It has a different director and it's gameplay is entirely different. This is where a third category for Kirby games comes in and I'd call this category Nontraditional Kirby games.

I'd put Mass Attack, Tilt n Tumble, Epic Yarn and Canvas Curse here.
Maybe Air Ride too

 

[Aunt Jemima]

There are more abilities actually they are just more basic because of the combinations.

Wouldnt add Kirbys Adventure, AM or SS on the "sakurai style" but yeah, thats the idea.

May I ask where you're sourcing this from? Sakurai's Kirby games have always had more copy abilities. Dream Land 2 and 3 doesn't actually change what Copy Ability you have when using Animal Friends, as they just change the functionality, and I personally wouldn't count Crystal Shard as having 35 actual Copy Abilities, as they're one-attack moves. Sakurai basically has more copy abilities as there's generally more moves. If you're counting the one-move Copy Abilities as seperate Copy Abilities, then we could split up every single move from every single Copy Ability to credit Sakurai's work. Also, what do you mean you wouldn't add Kirby's Adventure, Amazing Mirror, or Super Star to Sakurai's style? They all fit the criteria correctly.

eh I wouldn't put Canvas Curse into the Shimomura category. It has a different director and it's gameplay is entirely different. This is where a third category for Kirby games comes in and I'd call this category Nontraditional Kirby games.

I'd put Mass Attack, Tilt n Tumble, Epic Yarn and Canvas Curse here.
Maybe Air Ride too

Yeah, I would count spin-offs/non-canon Kirby games to not be apart of it. I didn't write it, but I also don't want to change the wording of somebody else's post. I would consider Air Ride to be apart of the spin-offs, although I wouldn't want to if I had a choice just because it was such a fun game, although I don't know if that even makes sense.

 

[kirby_queen]

May I ask where you're sourcing this from? Sakurai's Kirby games have always had more copy abilities. Dream Land 2 and 3 doesn't actually change what Copy Ability you have when using Animal Friends, as they just change the functionality, and I personally wouldn't count Crystal Shard as having 35 actual Copy Abilities, as they're one-attack moves. Sakurai basically has more copy abilities as there's generally more moves. If you're counting the one-move Copy Abilities as seperate Copy Abilities, then we could split up every single move from every single Copy Ability to credit Sakurai's work. Also, what do you mean you wouldn't add Kirby's Adventure, Amazing Mirror, or Super Star to Sakurai's style? They all fit the criteria correctly.

I'd say Adventure, Squeak Squad, and Amazing Mirror are fine in that category if more primitive examples of the style. (lol even though Squeak Squad and Amazing Mirror come after. Only cause they take a step back with some of the powers.)

The puzzling isn't as important as general exploration. A lot of the fun comes from the power varieties. They're not HIGHLY required in most of the gaming for collection to the extent the powers are required in games like Dreamland 2 and 3. Probably more so in Amazing Mirror because it's an metriodvania game? However that game did have movesets so. I'd say it's fine. Kind of like an expanded Great Cave Offensive.

Anyway everyone's got their favorite Kirby style. Some like all new gameplay like Canvas Curse, some like a classic platforming experience where they can just use the powers to get to a collectable in the level, some folks like action in their game and arena fun challenge.

Either way this flow chart should help you find the Kirby game for you...

 

[Aunt Jemima]

The puzzling isn't as important as general exploration. A lot of the fun comes from the power varieties. They're not HIGHLY required in most of the gaming for collection to the extent the powers are required in games like Dreamland 2 and 3. Probably more so in Amazing Mirror because it's an metriodvania game? However that game did have movesets so. I'd say it's fine. Kind of like an expanded Great Cave Offensive.

I'm replaying Dream Land 3 right now, and I'll be completely honest - the way Copy Abilities are forced on you ruins a bit of the fun. I enjoy going through the game with abilities I prefer, not being forced to give up my ability to go and switch to Clean. As much as I love Dream Land 3, I'm also not a fan of the "puzzles" that every level is attributed with. I mean, it's a nice touch, but it really breaks the Kirby formula and forces you do to things. Games such as Return to Dream Land and Triple Deluxe handle the way Copy Abilities are needed nicely, with a good balance. Collectibles and things of that sort are hidden and can be accessed by using Copy Abilities, but it's not forced on you, and you're not required to collect them to complete the main game. Also, the fact that Copy Abilities have such variety with their different moves allows most copy abilities to still fit the requirements, such as cutting a rope or string can be done by a multitude of Copy Abilities.

Ooh, I love that chart you posted, haha. The part about Crystal Shard to Return to Dream Land was funny.

Also, on another note - I may be re-creating the first level of Kirby's Adventure in Return to Dream Land. Would anybody be interested in this? I would be using the Return to Dream Land assets and textures, so any blocks or enemies or objects that aren't available in Return to Dream Land will be replaced with the most similar thing I can find.

Ooh, and I may be going through Return to Dream Land as King DeDeDe or Meta Knight. Not sure which one would be more fun though.

 

[SS-bros14]

I'd say Adventure, Squeak Squad, and Amazing Mirror are fine in that category if more primitive examples of the style. (lol even though Squeak Squad and Amazing Mirror come after. Only cause they take a step back with some of the powers.)

The puzzling isn't as important as general exploration. A lot of the fun comes from the power varieties. They're not HIGHLY required in most of the gaming for collection to the extent the powers are required in games like Dreamland 2 and 3. Probably more so in Amazing Mirror because it's an metriodvania game? However that game did have movesets so. I'd say it's fine. Kind of like an expanded Great Cave Offensive.

Anyway everyone's got their favorite Kirby style. Some like all new gameplay like Canvas Curse, some like a classic platforming experience where they can just use the powers to get to a collectable in the level, some folks like action in their game and arena fun challenge.

Either way this flow chart should help you find the Kirby game for you...

That chart needs to be updated, half of those games you can't get unless you want to spend like $100.

 

[Aunt Jemima]

That chart needs to be updated, half of those games you can't get unless you want to spend like $100.

This is one of those moments you're happy you own all of them. I don't think I can let a Kirby game leave store shelves without it being in my possession.

 

[kirby_queen]

That chart needs to be updated, half of those games you can't get unless you want to spend like $100.

download?? :D

I'm replaying Dream Land 3 right now, and I'll be completely honest - the way Copy Abilities are forced on you ruins a bit of the fun. I enjoy going through the game with abilities I prefer, not being forced to give up my ability to go and switch to Clean. As much as I love Dream Land 3, I'm also not a fan of the "puzzles" that every level is attributed with. I mean, it's a nice touch, but it really breaks the Kirby formula and forces you do to things. Games such as Return to Dream Land and Triple Deluxe handle the way Copy Abilities are needed nicely, with a good balance. Collectibles and things of that sort are hidden and can be accessed by using Copy Abilities, but it's not forced on you, and you're not required to collect them to complete the main game. Also, the fact that Copy Abilities have such variety with their different moves allows most copy abilities to still fit the requirements, such as cutting a rope or string can be done by a multitude of Copy Abilities.

Yeah there are instances in level design where the power doesn't help you at all either and you end up ditching it. I remember there's a part where the platform is bumpy like hills... and enemies were coming up the hill to hit me and my animal friend. The power we had from a combination caused our attack to just aim up. So it was literally worthless in that instance. Had I had a moveset I could have used a different move rather than try and hit it, miss, and instead take damage. It's not a BIG deal but I guess it makes a difference if you played KSS first and so you feel hindered. I HATE those mini games too required to get the collectable. The ones where you had to guess a gordo shape or sound. If you messed up you had to do the level ALL OVER again. It was annoying.

Game is gorgeous though. Great music, solid platformer, cool final boss, beautiful aesthetic so I understand why people like it and why,

 

[Sobreviviente]

Meh, if you're interested in puzzle platformers than there are many many many other franchises that fill this gap and better
This is where a third category for Kirby games comes in and I'd call this category Nontraditional Kirby games.

I'd put Mass Attack, Tilt n Tumble, Epic Yarn and Canvas Curse here.
Maybe Air Ride too

I dont think so, kirby is the absolute king when comes to puzzles >:L
Havent played Triple Deluxe yet, but from what i saw, is not really what im looking for.

Nontraditional? the original kirbys dreamland enters here?

May I ask where you're sourcing this from? Sakurai's Kirby games have always had more copy abilities. Dream Land 2 and 3 doesn't actually change what Copy Ability you have when using Animal Friends, as they just change the functionality, and I personally wouldn't count Crystal Shard as having 35 actual Copy Abilities, as they're one-attack moves. Sakurai basically has more copy abilities as there's generally more moves. If you're counting the one-move Copy Abilities as seperate Copy Abilities, then we could split up every single move from every single Copy Ability to credit Sakurai's work. Also, what do you mean you wouldn't add Kirby's Adventure, Amazing Mirror, or Super Star to Sakurai's style? They all fit the criteria correctly.

- Yes im counting them, you dont have acces to all the fire moves unless you combine, here is where the strategy begins.
KSS magic is that most of Adventures abbilities are now combined, leaving the strategy out in favor of comfort.

- Kirbys Adventure is not action oriented, is all about level design and use the first abbility you see. In fact, the dreamland series used Adventure as the base of its whole gameplay mechanics.
AM has many action but the real feature of the game is solve puzzles and find the exit of the maze, even more, i remember playing it for hours making no progress at all x'D if you dont think, you lose, and if you lose you still had many fun, i love that game.
uhm i mean Squake Squad, sorry about that :B reasons are pretty much the same as adventure but with more action than AM, so THIS is pretty much my definition of balance in kirby, maybe with a bit more of atmosphere though...

It should also be noticed that i enjoy kirby more without using any abbility at all, so yeah

 

[SS-bros14]

This is one of those moments you're happy you own all of them. I don't think I can let a Kirby game leave store shelves without it being in my possession.

Well:
Confession time: I only own one Kirby game. (Kirby Triple Deluxe)

 

[kirby_queen]

I dont think so, kirby is the absolute king when comes to puzzles >:L
Havent played Triple Deluxe yet, but from what i saw, is not really what im looking for.

Nontraditional? the original kirbys dreamland enters here?


- Yes im counting them, you dont have acces to all the fire moves unless you combine, here is where the strategy begins.
KSS magic is that most of Adventures abbilities are now combined, leaving the strategy out in favor of comfort.

- Kirbys Adventure is not action oriented, is all about level design and use the first abbility you see. In fact, the dreamland series used Adventure as the base of its whole gameplay mechanics.
AM has many action but the real feature of the game is solve puzzles and find the exit of the maze, even more, i remember playing it for hours making no progress at all x'D if you dont think, you lose, and if you lose you still had many fun, i love that game.
uhm i mean Squake Squad, sorry about that :B reasons are pretty much the same as adventure but with more action than AM, so THIS is pretty much my definition of balance in kirby, maybe with a bit more of atmosphere though...

It should also be noticed that i enjoy kirby more without using any abbility at all... so yeah

Wow abilities are big part of Kirby. I find it odd to be a fan and not like that defining aspect of him. I enjoy no power runs in arena and in levels but I still do greatly enjoy the powers.

Maybe you should just play the first game a lot because no powers lol

 

[IronFish]

My first Kirby game was KSSU got it when I first got a DS

 

[Aunt Jemima]

Well:
Confession time: I only own one Kirby game. (Kirby Triple Deluxe)

You... You're kidding, right?

...

On a completely unrelated note, I'll be ordering this soon:

http://society6.com/torkirby/kirbys-20th-anniversary_print#1=2