ATTN Ganondorf MAINS: PLEASE HELP ME IN MY RESEARCH PROJECT

[Vayseth]

Hello everyone! I am currently doing a research project on Brawl for members of the smash lab. They have a couple ideas going around in there and I wanted to test a few of them out for myself. Therefore if you guys would not mind, I would appreciate it if you would help me out.

I would like you, since you know your characters better than I do (probably), to tell me in quick bullet points what the most annoying things for you to play against. I am talking about aspects of match ups that change how the match up plays out. Examples of this would be King Dedede’s standing infinite on Bowser, DK, Mario, Luigi, Samus and himself or grab releases like Marth on Ness/Lucas or Wario’s grab release shenanigans. Basically, anything match up specific where one character has a great advantage over the other character simply because of that move/moves. There’s plenty out there but I want to make sure I have them all! Please list them for me!

Thank you!

(I'm looking for chaingrabs, locks, anything like that character specific).

Problems:
-Falco's Chaingrab
-Sheik Tilt Lock
-Lucario's side B chain grab
-Pikachu's CG

 

[Koskinator]

DDD Chaingrab, Falco CG, Ice Climber CG, Sheik Tilt Lock, Marths spacing and pokes, Peachs aerials and turnips, Lucarios aerials and chain palming, Falcos Lasers, Wolfs Lasers, Pikas CG, and Metaknight in general.

 

[SaltyKracka]

Any point at which a character may be attacked and then attacked again with no way to escape from the attacks by thier own power. That's a start.

 

[Vayseth]

DDD Chaingrab, Falco CG, Ice Climber CG, Sheik Tilt Lock, Marths spacing and pokes, Peachs aerials and turnips, Lucarios aerials and chain palming, Falcos Lasers, Wolfs Lasers, Pikas CG, and Metaknight in general.

Great list! Thank you! These are the things I could probably fix:

-Falco's Chaingrab
-Sheik F-Tilt Lock
-Lucario's side B chain grab
-Pikachu's CG

Please tell me at what percents they work at and what percent until they do not work. Also, I'm assuming you meant Sheik's forward tilt lock, does she have any others?

 

[stRIP]

I have not seen the Release Chaingrab from Yoshi in Koskinators "List"

Grab=death

 

[Sgt. Baker]

Basically projectiles

Ivysaur's Bullet Seed can get on my nerves as well.

 

[Dr. Hyde]

Basically what Koskinator said.
Pit's that stay on the edge and shoot arrows and pretty much we (mostly me) can't do anything about it since everything we could do is really telegraphed. Same with R.O.B. that do that.
nothing much more can be added to stuff like chain grabs, and tilt locks. Oh yeah Zelda's Down Tilt is pretty stupid

 

[SaltyKracka]

Basically what Koskinator said.
Pit's that stay on the edge and shoot arrows and pretty much we (mostly me) can't do anything about it since everything we could do is really telegraphed. Same with R.O.B. that do that.
nothing much more can be added to stuff like chain grabs, and tilt locks. Oh yeah Zelda's Down Tilt is pretty stupid

Nah, she can combo with that, but it's no infinite.

If you're fixing things, dude, I'd like to suggest that you make it so that DDD's dthrow has no fixed knockback. That would totally balance out some of his gayness. Or you could just decrease his grab range by a lot.

 

[ZenJestr]

yea...maybe Ganon and D3 could trade grab ranges...

 

[Dr. Hyde]

yea...maybe Ganon and D3 could trade grab ranges...

I support this!!

 

[SaltyKracka]

I support this!!

That would be the best nerf/buff ever.

 

[Shadow Nataku]

Basically what Koskinator said.
Pit's that stay on the edge and shoot arrows and pretty much we (mostly me) can't do anything about it since everything we could do is really telegraphed. Same with R.O.B. that do that.

Actually Ganon has one defense against arrow spam, NAir. Oddly Ganon's NAir completely outprioritizes the arrows without losing momentum and the hitbox staying out. Its not even some utterly stupidly small hitbox or timing either, I've seen even reverse NAir manage to beat out the arrow it seems the hitbox for NAir is actually quite large. So I tend to buffer NAir's alot when up against a Pit for this reason.

Anyway two more stupidly annoying things I think of.

-Lucario FAir chase, if first hit is done right Ganon actually has nothing to react to this with. Lucario will insta-kill him off the edge of the screen because of the aura flames. This tends to work at almost all percentages under or around 60% ish.
-Also I believe Bowser has a grab release chaingrab on Dorf as well that leads into an FAir this works at pretty much any percentage.

One more thing about the Yoshi chaingrab, at the end of the chaingrab there is actually a small moment where a ^+B from Ganondorf can actually go through Yoshi's spike which he usually follows through with.