Smashboards

I what? I was backing up my point with evidence. I didn't attack you anywhere.

You wanted to know why I thought Pac's grab was terrible? I elaborated and talked about every reason why it sucks. Nowhere did I say anything you said about Villager was wrong, I just disagree that his grab is the worst.

Like sure it's awful but I have plenty of reason to believe Pac Man's grab is undoubtedly the absolute bottom of the barrel. There is just....nothing redeeming about it at all, even down to the reward you get later.

I will however apologize if my tone did not convey this properly.

It's fine, I probably overreacted too. Your tone just seemed... hostile to me, IDK. Probably should have done this through PM too, so sorry about this.

Wanted to clarify something, though. When I said "cooldown" I meant the time after the grab box ends, in which case Villager's grabs are all worse than Pac's (but only barely for standing grab).

I see. I think my main point about Villager grab vs. Pac is that it randomly whiffs a whole lot less in my experience. Pac Man's grab is marred both with terrible active frames and also really janky hitboxes PLUS the aforementioned deadzones. We have hitbox visuals for stuff like Cloud so I can't wait to see the mess that is Pac's grab.

Are the hitbox visuals from a hitbox viewer or just from careful studying? Either way would be good to get that up for every character ASAP.

I probably wouldn't take Pac-Man's grab in all scenarios, but when it comes to grabbing people out of shield I definitely would (I'd keep the regular pivot grab though). Villager's grab animation is probably based on the net animation from Animal Crossing which is why it's so laggy.

I honestly don't know why there are frames when Pac-Man's grab isn't active. Making it active that whole time wouldn't be that big of a deal aside from trapping landings (which he does well anyway) and beating spotdodges. Similar problem to Wario's NAir except having a grab like that is much worse.