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What do you think would make Smash 4 a perfect game

Discussion in 'Super Smash Bros. for Wii U General Discussion' started by Mew2King, Jun 3, 2013.

  1. Mew2King

    Mew2King King of the Mews

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    Tell me everything you guys think would make smash 4 the best game possible

    examples include better online, more hitstun, no tripping, possibly wavedashing, etc.
  2. kiw1

    kiw1 Smash Apprentice

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    fast gameplay + more hitstun than in brawl

    character patches

    stagedesign

    + good character design (not like metaknight lol)
  3. DaiRDev1L

    DaiRDev1L Hero of Hyrule

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    Of course I would prefer no tripping and a better online experience. Re-instituting Melee's airdodge system would also be a plus.
  4. Insom

    Insom Smash Apprentice

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    Dark Phazon likes this.
  5. #HBC | Bunzy

    #HBC | Bunzy SUPER SEXY HOT CAT

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    Completely revamped ledge mechanics, more moves designed purely to safely poke shields, increase game speed by 20%, universal up-B recovery nerfs, reduce the momentum many characters retain when using projectiles, no tripping, change throw knockbacks so chaingrabs aren't an option, -slightly- more hitstun, add more super armor moves, give characters more mobility options (largely through move cancels such as canceling Ike's side-B into a jump).
    BlueXenon, buirac and KrIsP! like this.
  6. FalKoopa

    FalKoopa Blue and Green Magician

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    No tripping, slightly faster gameplay, better balance, more characters, better online... Did I miss anything?
    Dark Phazon likes this.
  7. _Kailex_

    _Kailex_ PMS| Greato Daze

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    Keep ganondorf, more balancing, more variety of characters + keeping snake and sonic if no more 3rd party characters are joining. Gc controller :(
  8. RATED

    RATED Smash Lord

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    Better ledge mechanics, no tripping and a bit of a speed up.

    Better online. Please.
  9. SaixXIsaVII

    SaixXIsaVII Smash Rookie

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    A Costume for Falcon with shiny Gold Nippel.
    Dark Phazon, Samovar and Twinkie like this.
  10. trahhSTEEZY

    trahhSTEEZY Smash Champion

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    I think Viable online play is one of the most important things outside of solid gameplay, obviously solid gameplay is a really wide field of things so;

    -More hitstun than brawl
    -no tripping
    -wide variety of non-moving levels with different platform placings.
    -a patch like 8 months after release or something
    -of course every melee player would LOVE wavedashing/lcancelling; it provides deeper skill gap, isn't required by beginner players and those beginner players will hardly notice it anyway so i doubt complaints would happen. It's like a win for everyone.
    -faster than brawl. Equal or close to melee would be great
    -recovering was far too easy in brawl; make living more risky!

    Lol as I wanna list more things i'm just basically saying make melee again with more characters/stages. Then you will have another great game for another 10 years.
  11. Vintage Creep

    Vintage Creep Smash Master

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  12. _Kailex_

    _Kailex_ PMS| Greato Daze

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    Oh and no tripping, super better online, and DLC... Better cinematics and story would be nice
  13. DarkDragoon

    DarkDragoon Smash Champion

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    gamecube controller support.
  14. G3TL05T

    G3TL05T Smash Cadet

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    No tripping, since it affects tournaments, wavedashing, L-cancelling, higher hitstun, better gravity and knockback... in general Melee like physics.
    Better animations, since I hate how a side smash in Brawl causes someone to stay in place vibrating before they're knocked back. In melee, they just flew off immediately and didn't look stupid. Brawl is beyond cartoonish.
    Melee like item rigidness would be good too.
    Nerfed recoveries so that going off stage was actually dangerous like in Melee.
    Keep stage builder and music from Brawl.
    Project M menu style.
    Ledge should be like Melee, where you had to face the ledge.
    Restore Melee Marth, because he's awesome.
    Restore Melee Jigglypuff so she can rest.
    Bring Mewtwo back because he's fun.
    Dash dancing.
    Way better online, but Nintendo is bad at that anyway.
    Better adventure mode.
    More target smash options... perhaps a "Break the Targets Builder"!
    Four players for Multi Man and target smash ("Break the Targets Builder"! would let you have more targets.)
    Melee air dodge.
    Balance the characters.
    Better game intro (not stupid Subspace clips). Commentator has to scream, "Super Smash Brothers...!
    Bring back spikes, so it's not just meteor smashes.
    Nerf Meta Knight's priority
    V-K, Morph in Sandbox and mooki like this.
  15. pudGG

    pudGG Smash Rookie

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    Better online! Would be really really cool to be able to play smash online. Like a dream come true, please make this happen!
    Also controller remapping (like in brawl)
  16. Insom

    Insom Smash Apprentice

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    You realize this would make the knee last like 5 years, right?
    Dark Phazon likes this.
  17. spudzalot

    spudzalot Smash Journeyman

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    Varied costumes, similar to how Wario got two different outfits along with a set of color changes for each.
    Less characters that have cloned movesets.
    More unique moves. Example would be a move that can actually hit threw an opponents airdodge, but has few uses besides that.

    Can't think of much else that people haven't already said.
    buirac likes this.
  18. ZLF Aurora

    ZLF Aurora Smash Journeyman

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    Something hilariously stupid to one-up tripping and piss off the community, like tripping, but now your character has a 1 in 10 chance to break their ankle when they trip, meaning they can't be used for 48 hours.

    Keep on trolling, Sakurai.
    Morph in Sandbox likes this.
  19. KankerSore

    KankerSore Smashmouth

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    - Better online
    - Tripping gone
    - Fan nerfed
    - A bit more speed
    - Nobody having an S+ tier rank or -4 match-up
    - Patching (I.E: If a chaingrab is discovered)
    - Custom outfit colors
    xzx likes this.
  20. KrIsP!

    KrIsP! Smash Champion

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    I want more mechanics, not less. Sakurai says melee was too hard but no one had any issues with it at a casual level before brawl came out. Going back between the two it takes some getting used to both ways because they're so starkly different.

    Besides the obvious stuff I'd like to see an actual change. I was thinking of a mahvel-esque tag team battle where you pick two characters and pull off awesome hand offs with any two characters the way ice climbers work. Not controlling both characters but switching between them as well as calling on them while in shield or when you grab someone

    And no patching. Unless something is absolutely game breaking, crying for patches is what ruins games.

    Edit: also, better stage editor and gamecube controllers
  21. Anth0ny

    Anth0ny Smash Master

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    If there was a Smash Bros spectrum that went like this:

    64----------------Melee----------------Brawl

    I'd want Smash 4 to be more towards the center and left. In other words, hitstun, combos, and all that good stuff.
  22. Wariofan1

    Wariofan1 Smash Hero

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    Proper balancing, a tad less floaty, better online, no tripping, and add Ridley as a character.

    That's all I need, Brawl was so close to being perfect for me already.

    In terms of speed I think it'd be best to hit a middle ground between Melee and Brawl. Melee often goes too fast for everybody to follow, and it certainly wouldn't create for a pleasant online experience for the people who aren't wave-dashing pros etc. Brawl can get too floaty and pokey at times, which doesn't catter so much to the ones who want some fast-paced action. Hitting the in-between there would be the closest we could get to satisfy the majority I think.

    The roster is already near damn perfect in my opinion, Ridley is the only must-have character that's missing for me, while K. Rool, Mewtwo and Mega Man are more than welcome additions too. The keywords being "in my opinion."

    I don't really crave much, so on the good side of that I think it's gonna be hard for the game to dissapoint me.
    RomanceDawn likes this.
  23. Erodote

    Erodote Smash Rookie

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    To my mind : No more tripping, BETTER ONLINE, more balanced game and I would be happy
    xzx likes this.
  24. JV5Chris

    JV5Chris Smash Journeyman

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    Not that there's already lots of opinions out there about this, but I'll be watching this thread as well. :)
  25. CT ZeRo

    CT ZeRo CHOICE SCARF

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    I agree with most of this. This would allow for a more balanced and rewarding experience to the players.

    ALSO, PLEASE, a GREAT (Lagless/with global rankings/match making system/casual and ranked doubles and singles) Online mode.
    And DLC/Balance patches where they hear feedback of important players (or community at least).
  26. SCC_Cone

    SCC_Cone Smash Rookie

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    Someone out there I know is going to invent a way to plug your gamecube controller into your wii remote and just map the buttons like the classic controller... whoever does can make a PayPal/eBay FORTUNE
  27. Shadic

    Shadic Alakadoof?

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    Hitstun, not Hitlag.
    whitmorethetoadpirate likes this.
  28. DAlegendarysamus

    DAlegendarysamus Smash Lord

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    A lot if not all of these comments seem to generic-based not fundamentally sound. We need to 1st talk about the fundamentals of smash and how they need to be fixed before we even talk about what characters, what stages, online play movesets, etc.
  29. P D

    P D Smash Ace

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  30. Vintage Creep

    Vintage Creep Smash Master

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    First Banjo-Kazooie.
    Then the rest.
    Dark Phazon likes this.
  31. Someguy13

    Someguy13 Smash Cadet

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    I agree with most of what has been said already. Faster gameplay, more hitstun, a balanced cast, much better online, and all that good stuff. But don't bring back L-canceling. Just speed up all the landing animations. It's pointless to have it as a separate input that you just do all the time. Unless I'm wrong, there's no reason not to L-cancel. Maybe I'm just bad at the game and don't see a reason not to, but I just L-cancel all my air moves. If there was a reason not to L-cancel, I would change my opinion of it and happily welcome it back.
    Snakeyes likes this.
  32. Toebex

    Toebex Smash Cadet

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    Well, for starters, easier short hopping. Brawl did that well but in melee you can still miss it a few times and its a pain. Also a much wider selection of cast would make it much more fun for party stuff and competitively as well. Wavedashing should return for sure along with easier and more forgiving L-Cancels. Fast gameplay, just as fast as melee. An actually usable online mode would be incredible and finally just heavier characters, as in make the falling speed that of Link from SSBM or something, all the characters in Brawl are just too floaty. Ive probably missed a tonne, but i just wanna play as Shadow with the moveset from sonic battle gba :shades:
  33. JakeOfAllTrades

    JakeOfAllTrades Smash Rookie

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    Realizing that:
    Potentially high technical gameplay =/= casually unfriendliness
    High risk/high reward = Allows for both analytic and creative playstyles
    64, Melee, and Brawl have their good sides and weak sides

    Personally:
    • I believe the best smash game would involve being able to have a very high depth (technical depth) which would include Wavedashing and L-canceling. I would also like to see things such as B-reversals and Turnaround-B's in Brawl. All of these technics allow for greater movements and options either offensively and defensively.
    • I'd also like characters moves have depth to them as well. For example: I'd always thought that in Brawl, Mario's F.L.U.D.D would have some intense usage if, when you charge the move it slightly increases the fall speed of Mario depending on how much you charge the move (Fully charged = Most fall speed). Something like this would allow for strategic usage of the move because fall speed is not synonymous with weight in Smash (which is always a good thing to have regardless). Sometimes a low fall speed is good because it prevents certain characters from being comboed, however other times a character with a fast fall speed is better to have because it allows you to reach a neutral stance rather than having to be in the air longer. Weight on the other hand is ALWAYS good the higher it is. I digress, when a character has depth to it, the player is constricted only by the mentality of usage of that character. The "limitations" can actually be used positively for more creative and unique playstyles.
    • I like how in Brawl you have to be constantly aware of your and the opponents options. Edgeguarding is harder and punishing is harder because of certain mechanics (ledge magnet, multiple air dodges, low hit stun). It puts an emphasis on hard reads and constant awareness. However, I enjoy the fast pased high risk/high reward where one mistake can seriously cost you the game. A game that can focus on punishing mistakes hard because a person make a really bad mistake is better than being able to punish a person hard for a little mistake (and certainly better than having to punish softly for a player's huge mistake.)
    • ISAAC FROM GOLDEN SUN! I want to see this character in the game. If he isn't, that is a major disappointment and I'll probably cry.
    • A more stable online mode. This allows a tighter community and better casual AND competitive scene.
    • RANDOM movement tripping is bad, tripping in general (when forced by a move) is neat and adds another mechanic/choice to the game. I'd like to see tripping still in when forced by a move.
    • Footstooling is another neat mechanic and I'd like to see it still implemented, but more refined such as having a soft footstool and a hard footstool. The soft footstool would allow you to jump off a person as another jump, but doesn't cause the footstooled character to tumble (this would be done by "shorthopping" on top of another character". A hard footstool would offer NO extra jump, but cause the other character to tumble (This would be done by "full hopping" on top of another character.)
    • Take away move damage/hitstun degeneration. It slows down the game and imposes some really stupid restrictions to characters.
    • DLC for stages and skin colors for characters. I would not suggest this for adding new characters because it would separate some people from fully enjoying the core of the game.
    • A reliable way to Mod and adjust the game.
  34. Frostwraith

    Frostwraith Blue Exorcist

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    My answer to the thread's question: nothing.

    There's no such thing as a perfect game.
    Dark Phazon and Oblivion like this.
  35. Toebex

    Toebex Smash Cadet

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    Oh and somehow they need to remake the Gamecube controller to work with the Wii U. That would be brilliant.
    Dark Phazon likes this.
  36. thethirdkoopa

    thethirdkoopa Smash Master

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    I'd be okay if some of this didn't happen

    -Best roster so far, with DLC that also makes sense or of veterans maybe.
    -A GOOD 3DS Version
    -Subspace Emissary with more story
    -Faster gameplay (Not Melee fast but just a bit faster after playing Project M would be nice)
    -GOOD Mario RPG Representation
    -More Speed
    -More Controller Support methods
    -Better additions to multiplayer modes - Not only should stuff like SSE be four players but some like Boss Battles shouldn't be an instant death if one person is killed
    -Stuff to make the game feel fresh instead of "Here's Brawl but you'll spend 2k more hours on it"
    -Masked Man and Isaac at least.

    I think that's most of what I want. Might be forgetting stuff.
  37. Rood

    Rood Smash Apprentice

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    Character balance (patches for character balance too), more of an online ranked system like UMVC3, NO MORE TRIPPING, and faster paced gameplay (increased hitstun and/or shieldstun would be nice but not required).
  38. Praxis

    Praxis BRoomer

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    Tongue in cheek: Make Peach top tier.

    In seriousness, I consider myself a student of game design. Obviously, stuff like random tripping has to go, but the issues with Brawl are actually very subtle.

    They stem from one fact: Brawl rewards defensive play too much.

    This reward on defensive play drives Brawl gameplay to be a slower hit-position-react gameplay. It's actually still a very deep game, but it's so much less watchable because there is so little reason to approach. It's like how chess is a very deep game, but there is no audience for chess games because it is super boring for non chess players to watch.

    Football by comparison can be watched by people who don't play the game or even fully understand the strategy.

    For example of defensive issues:

    * Shields are extremely powerful in Brawl. You still have most of your options available out of shield, and the things that threaten you when you are in your shield are fairly minor. Grabs generally give the opponent a positioning advantage and minor damage, excepting Dedede and Ice Climbers.

    Shields in Melee, meanwhile, are much weaker: shield stun reduces your shielding options, and hitstun makes grabs a much greater threat. Brawl doesn't need to nerf shields totally, but either making grabs better (via hitstun combos) or shields worse (via shieldstun) would dramatically increase the perceived value in aggressive play.

    * Ledge play is simply broken. The time gap between how fast a character can regrab the ledge and when their invincibility ends is minuscule. Characters with sufficient maneuverability and certain hitbox types (Metaknight, G&W, Pit, ROB) simply cannot be given valid reason to get off the ledge.

    You get thrown off the ledge when you are losing. Ledge play needs to be adjusted so as to become a disadvantaged position. Simplest way to do it is to say "no invincibility after three consecutive ledge grabs". Other alternatives include making it harder to grab the ledge (like previous games) or nerfing recoveries to reduce ledge play options. These are probably better. The key is, ledges should disadvantage the player holding them. He is barely holding on and should feel pressured to get off the ledge.

    * Speed needs to be improved, either through mechanics that encourage it (hitstun!) or faster gravity that forces players back in to each other.




    These tweaks should make Smash a much better competitive game.

    Also, it is critical that there is a WIRED USB CONTROLLER OPTION. If not Nintendo developed, the game has to allow for third party USB controllers. I cannot stress this enough- large tournaments cannot be run with all Bluetooth wireless controllers. If wired options aren't available...big tournaments like Evo and MLG cannot host Smash Bros, period.



    Also, better online would be nice, and give the game a patching function!
  39. Sveet

    Sveet The player formerly known as Sveet

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    Program hitstun and knockdown so that it is independent of the percent the move does. I think this would solve some of the problems low tiers have with being ultra CC'd and moves not linking into each other without making them also do more damage.
  40. KrIsP!

    KrIsP! Smash Champion

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    Why do I get the feeling that M2K is secretly looking for ideas to balance his Air Dash Online game? You sly dog you :p


    Do you mean adding the percent of the move before applying knock back or the ability to crouch cancel being dependent on the power of the move? If the latter that sounds great but might not completely solve the problem if they still have a move than can be CCd at high percents.

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