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Yeah, Collarbone Breaker is apparently now inescapable from first hit to second hit. Fun!
Based on these blockstun numbers for Link gathered by @LordWilliam1234 and the new formula listed for blockstun in the patch thread [(damage / 1.8)+3], no, it's not the same for normal hitboxes!... but it doesn't follow the old formula either, and blockstun for projectiles is still higher than it used to be, apparently.
Haha. So true.
When people ask me how to play ROB, my response is "be as quick as you can."
The year is 20XX. DK doesn't have weaknesses or bad matchups but Luigi does.
Close quarters combat.
Close Quarters Combat
I can't test atm but I bet DAir strings on shield is now a thing. That, and Dair > Nair on shield would be safe pressure.
I don't know if I would be calling Ike a winner in this patch. Its hard to tell at this point.
It actually is higher than Melee's if that formula is correct.
This only really affects when an opponent can't DI. Plus, in a competitive level, this won't be used very much because the opponent now knows of it and can (and will) beat it out with something even more stupid.
Sounds like a knee-jerk to me tbh. A lack of offensive capabilities isn't what makes her losing matchups losing matchups. Higher shieldstun makes her better at something she's already good at so it may polarize winning match even more in her favor. But I don't see how it allows her to even up matchups like Villager or Fox - whom both possibly benefit from the increased shieldstun quite a bit themselves.
"Alright guys, it's been 5 hours. Wrap up the interesting conversation so we can go back to ripping on random tier lists."
It's been the same "X got better. No, Y got better!" for the past hour... Outside of the fringe cases like Collarbone breaker or Aura Sphere it's not interesting.
Better start contributing something interesting then.
I actually can as soon as I get home. Pit and Dark Pit probably got some major stuff from the shieldstun changes.
This is actually a buff to offensive options, namely high damage ones. But the nature of the forumla (the +3 part) means it does infact benefit everyone.
#HBC | Red Ryu
said, the values are actually higher than Melee, and this is the first time any offensive engine value has ever been tweaked ABOVE what Melee's was.
Agreed. For characters who already had good shield pressure (Peach, Sheik, maybe Fox) this isn't a major change. It's the characters who cross the line from "sorta safe on block" to "safe on block" that are more interesting.Sounds like a knee-jerk to me tbh. A lack of offensive capabilities isn't what makes her losing matchups losing matchups. Higher shieldstun makes her better at something she's already good at so it may polarize winning match even more in her favor. But I don't see how it allows her to even up matchups like Villager or Fox - whom both possibly benefit from the increased shieldstun quite a bit themselves.
hey bro I need some help with raiden's level 1 kill confirm
Yeah, from what i'm hearing, it's pretty significant. Zelda in particular has gotten far more dangerous just by nature of her attacks. If Bowser/Kirby/Yoshi catches you in shield with his Down-B, you are FORCED to eat a shieldbreak.
One should also keep in mind that if you were already safe on block, the increased shield stun can possibly give you legit block strings, which gives increased shield pressure. Some characters were just a few frames off of having this, but now it's looking to be a common practice.
In fairness, zoning will also be harder to overcome. You'll be stuck in your shield for longer every time you get hit by a projectile and will struggle more to approach.
On the contrary. If moves universally become safer on shield, then shield becomes a less powerful approaching tool and camping becomes a necessary "evil" in many scenarios as a result. Especially weaker characters that don't really have a lot of approach options other than moving in -> shield will have to resort to camping and stalling out of necessity.
Yes but some character that used to lack approaching tools gained some.On the contrary. If moves universally become safer on shield, then shield becomes a less powerful approaching tool and camping becomes a necessary "evil" in many scenarios as a result. Especially weaker characters that don't really have a lot of approach options other than moving in -> shield will have to resort to camping and stalling out of necessity.
