Translated Sakurai Famitsu Interview

[Johnknight1]

@ Johnknight1
If the story the informant for Gematsu is giving holds merit, then Chrom wasn't a case of being outdated information.
It was a case of mistaken identity.

The informant claims that like how they saw "Pokémon from X/Y" they saw "Protagonist of Fire Emblem Awakening" and assumed it was referring to Chrom. They didn't think about Awakening's other protagonist, Robin.

It's a believable story, but it sounds quite a bit like backpeddling given the timing. Assuming the story is legit, the informant should have relayed the information exactly how they saw it. Not make assumptions that have a shot of being the wrong one.

EDIT: As for Lucina, she was just going to be an alt of Marth. Then for some reason, Sakurai gave her slightly different properties and made her a separate character later in development because of those different properties. There was no conscious choice to give Marth a new style and add Lucina as the "new Marth".

I agree this is possible, but I don't think this is what happen. Still, it is merely theory crafting and based on what we view as what the Smash dev team will do. The only way we'll 100% know the truth is if Sakurai or someone else tells us the whole story on or off the record.

Regardless, the "mistaken identity" could have been Lucina from Gematsu, yes. I doubt it was Robin, but it could have been. The female leaker who was one of about half a dozen people to leak the full Brawl roster said Rosalina was a NPC you could summon who uses a barrier when it was actually Gardevoir. Those 2 look nothing alike, but that mistake happened, and people crapped on her.

Heck, almost all of the leakers who revealed a ton of content past the roster pre-Brawl that were TRUE LEAKERS had 1 piece of information FLAT OUT WRONG or off a little.

However, what separates those leaks and this leak are a few things:
1. Those leaks had the full roster most of the time.
2. The rosters they leaked were much bigger.
3. They had information past the playable roster.
4. They had a ton of information, whereas the Sal/Gematsu leak is very basic.

 

[Deleted member]

I agree this is possible, but I don't think this is what happen. Still, it is merely theory crafting and based on what we view as what the Smash dev team will do. The only way we'll 100% know the truth is if Sakurai or someone else tells us the whole story on or off the record.

Regardless, the "mistaken identity" could have been Lucina from Gematsu, yes. I doubt it was Robin, but it could have been. The female leaker who was one of about half a dozen people to leak the full Brawl roster said Rosalina was a NPC you could summon who uses a barrier when it was actually Gardevoir. Those 2 look nothing alike, but that mistake happened, and people crapped on her.

Heck, almost all of the leakers who revealed a ton of content past the roster pre-Brawl that were TRUE LEAKERS had 1 piece of information FLAT OUT WRONG or off a little.

However, what separates those leaks and this leak are a few things:
1. Those leaks had the full roster most of the time.
2. The rosters they leaked were much bigger.
3. They had information past the playable roster.
4. They had a ton of information, whereas the Sal/Gematsu leak is very basic.

To be fair, the Gematsu pack stated more than just the characters, but not much.
-DLC is going to happen, and the informant personally feels it's rather greedy.
-E3 2014 is the last E3 before Smash's release. (Which is just common sense given that Smash is to be released towards the end of the year.)

 

[WwwWario]

Source: http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=121384840&postcount=8201

I'm really not sure if this has been posted here yet, so don't yell at me if it has.


We've just announced two new characters who will be joining the fray in the upcoming Super Smash Bros. for 3DS and Wii U. One is Robin, the avatar from Fire Emblem: Awakening, and the other is Lucina, a swordswoman who plays an important role in the same title. I'll skip over the details.
"What? Not Chrom!?" I suspect a lot of you will ask. Of course, Chrom is quite popular, being the protagonist of FE:A and all. However, I chose Robin and Lucina, and I will elaborate on my reasoning.
Robin appears in the game as a Tactician and functions much like a Mystic Knight (note: FF terminology, but equivalent to magic swordsman). I thought to utilize his all-around nature by assigning swordplay to his Smash attacks and magic tomes to his special attacks--that is, allow him to use magic.
His neutral special is thunder magic that grows stronger the larger you charge it. He uses fire magic for his side special, and wind magic for recovery as his up special. Although Robin doesn't use dark magic in FE:A, I decided to assign it as his down special. It isn't the first time I've given moves to a character that they don't use in their respective game in order to capture certain aspects of the original title.
I also implemented the system used in FE:A, in which tomes break after overuse. Likewise, I included a similar system for the Levin Sword, which breaks after a certain number of uses. However, both the tomes and the Levin Sword will quickly regenerate after a set period of time.
Lucina uses the same techniques as Marth, a fighter with whom I'm sure most of you are already familiar. I even went so far as to make their strength, speed, and special attacks almost identical.
However, what sets Lucina apart is the fact that the strength of her attacks is uniform along the blade. Marth's playstyle emulates the elegant swordplay of a fencer by dealing more damage when he strikes with the tip of his blade, but the damage Lucina deals is evened out. Thus, I think that Lucina will be much easier than Marth for novice players to play with.
I played all the way through FE:A and really wanted to include a character from that rich cast in Smash Bros. Naturally, I considered adding Chrom to the roster, but the decision wasn't easy by any means.
At the end of the day, Chrom would just end up being another plain-old sword-wielder like Marth and Ike. Compared with other characters, he lacks any unique characteristics.
Conversely, when the idea of including Robin came to mind, conceiving the character was so easy that I immediately saw how it would work. From standards to specials, grabs to throws, all aspects of his moveset just fell into place. Not only did he possess characteristics unlike other fighters, but he also captured the essence of the Fire Emblem series. It was perfect!
In the end, if a game isn't fun, then there's no point. Of course, it would be really easy to make a game by churning out a ton of similar characters, but that's not how I produce games.
Initially, I had considered including Lucina as one of Marth's alternate costumes.
After all, she has a close relationship with him in FE:A. In such cases, even if two characters' names and voices differ, as long as they function the same way, I assign them as alternate costumes. The Wii Fit Trainers, Villagers, and Robin are examples of this setup.
However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!

Still don't understand. If Chrom wasn't added because he wasn't "unique", why add Lucina that is as far from unique as it can get? She looks very like Marth, has the same attacks, and only has a FEW changes. I guess she isn't a "plain-old sword-weilder" like Chrom.... :/

 

[Johnknight1]

To be fair, the Gematsu pack stated more than just the characters, but not much.
-DLC is going to happen, and the informant personally feels it's rather greedy.
-E3 2014 is the last E3 before Smash's release. (Which is just common sense given that Smash is to be released towards the end of the year.)

Eh that's still relatively minor compared to what the Brawl leaks gave us.

The Brawl leaks gave us all but one stage (which I got via a leak) publicly, almost all the assist trophy characters, some SSE details (that was the one thing they tried to keep secret; namely that the SSE was trash lol!), loads of AT's and Pokéballs, and the entire roster dating roughly 4 months before the game launched.

But alas, it is quite a lot of useful information, although probably outdated.

I doubt the Lucas stuff still applies, lol.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Oh now i remember how this helps mewtwo

The interview prooves this


Not sure where but according to the interview, correct if im wrong but sakurai is saying he does not care how many characters are in for a franchise thats why he put in 4 fire emblem characters

A simpler term if he added the all of the mario characters as playable he wouldent care about haw many mario reps there were.

And plus lucina was never on the roster he made before development, he added lucina to the roster because he felt like it.


But mewtwo is not a lock yet though.

 

[Johnknight1]

All of this is speculation though. Right now, Lucina is still just Marth without a tipper. Marth himself may not be slow in the final game either, as we know the E3 build was an early enough build.

She has a clearly new forward tilt or neutral A move, as well as probably a new dash attack.

Also, I think Marth players at that high a level have an "eye" for things better than a lot of us do. That's why I find myself trusting their judgment that Lucina is the "real" Marth from Melee and Brawl.

After all, they said Marth in Smash 4 was nothing like Melee and Brawl Marth, and if you used it like that, he was trash, and they were 100% right on that.

Many Marth players I know, including my own brother were heavily disappointed by playing Smash 4 Marth, who instead of being acrobatic, poke heavy, and very offensive was very defensive, counter reliant, and a lot more strength-based.

I imagine the Smash 4 development team saw this coming, kept the Marth changes, and added Lucina as her own playable character to appease those people.

More like Mario to Dr. Mario. As things currently stand, she's the most similar to her counterpart than any other clone in the history of Smash Bros.

She has a new side tilt, probably a new dash attack (as shown in the CGI part of the trailer), and maybe a new forward tilt.

She "feels" more in lieu for gameplay reasons like Falco.

 

[ChikoLad]

She has a clearly new forward tilt or neutral A move, as well as probably a new dash attack.

Also, I think Marth players at that high a level have an "eye" for things better than a lot of us do. That's why I find myself trusting their judgment that Lucina is the "real" Marth from Melee and Brawl.

After all, they said Marth in Smash 4 was nothing like Melee and Brawl Marth, and if you used it like that, he was trash, and they were 100% right on that.

Many Marth players I know, including my own brother were heavily disappointed by playing Smash 4 Marth, who instead of being acrobatic, poke heavy, and very offensive was very defensive, counter reliant, and a lot more strength-based.

I imagine the Smash 4 development team saw this coming, kept the Marth changes, and added Lucina as her own playable character to appease those people.

She has a new side tilt, probably a new dash attack (as shown in the CGI part of the trailer), and maybe a new forward tilt.

She "feels" more in lieu for gameplay reasons like Falco.

Uh, we haven't seen any new moves from Lucina. You can't tout the CGI parts as evidence, they aren't indicative of actual gameplay.

And professional Marth players having an eye for things does not change the fact that the game isn't finished and that Sakurai and numerous Treehouse employees have re-iterated that point time and time again.

 

[Pyra]

Uh, we haven't seen any new moves from Lucina. You can't tout the CGI parts as evidence, they aren't indicative of actual gameplay.

If they were, that would mean Captain Falcon could parry swords

 

[PixelPasta]

So, no Chrom because he 'lacks any unique characteristics when compared with other characters'.
But Lucina can be in with no differences from Marth besides no sword tipper?
I am very confused by this logic. Chrom could have been in with entirely different sword-based moves from Marth or Ike. Yes, he is still another infamous 'blue-haired swordsman', but that would still be a heck of a lot more unique than Lucina is at this point. Plus, Chrom is more popular and arguably more deserving.

I mean, what on earth is Sakurai thinking? He is totally contradicting himself:
"[...]it would be really easy to make a game by churning out a ton of similar characters, but that's not how I produce games."
"Lucina uses the same techniques as Marth[...] I even went so far as to make their strength, speed, and special attacks almost identical."
I'm calling rubbish on this one. Sorry Sakurai, I love what you have done with the other newcomers so far, but this just isn't a good choice, IMO.

 

[Johnknight1]

Uh, we haven't seen any new moves from Lucina. You can't tout the CGI parts as evidence, they aren't indicative of actual gameplay.

Why would have they have a new running attack for just the CGI trailer=??? That requires more animation work.

As for the potentially new side tilt or neutral tilt (or maybe it's a part of the Side B), it was in those Famitsu scans that came out yesterday (bottom right).

Yeah that's probably the Side B, lol.

But alas, her up B, side B, and neutral air function a lot differently from Marth's.

Edit: This also might be a new forward air. It may just be a new neutral air animation that Marth doesn't have.

And professional Marth players having an eye for things does not change the fact that the game isn't finished and that Sakurai and numerous Treehouse employees have re-iterated that point time and time again.

How much can you change a game in roughly 3-6 weeks when the game goes gold=???

 

[BADGRAPHICS]

So, no Chrom because he 'lacks any unique characteristics when compared with other characters'.
But Lucina can be in with no differences from Marth besides no sword tipper?
I am very confused by this logic. Chrom could have been in with entirely different sword-based moves from Marth or Ike. Yes, he is still another infamous 'blue-haired swordsman', but that would still be a heck of a lot more unique than Lucina is at this point. Plus, Chrom is more popular and arguably more deserving.

I mean, what on earth is Sakurai thinking? He is totally contradicting himself:
"[...]it would be really easy to make a game by churning out a ton of similar characters, but that's not how I produce games."
"Lucina uses the same techniques as Marth[...] I even went so far as to make their strength, speed, and special attacks almost identical."
I'm calling rubbish on this one. Sorry Sakurai, I love what you have done with the other newcomers so far, but this just isn't a good choice, IMO.

I think it's because Chrom was initially realised as a fully-fledged character, not a clone, but there was nothing that distinguished him from other characters. I suspect Robin's sword moves belonged to an old Chrom build, but he just had some generic special attacks. Also, Robin looks a lot different, so there's that.

Lucina, being a clone, was probably added recently because they had extra time to squeeze a few more characters out (like with Dr. Mario, Roy and Pichu, etc. in Melee).

 

[Deleted member]

Still don't understand. If Chrom wasn't added because he wasn't "unique", why add Lucina that is as far from unique as it can get? She looks very like Marth, has the same attacks, and only has a FEW changes. I guess she isn't a "plain-old sword-weilder" like Chrom.... :/

Lucina was meant to just be a Marth alt.
Somewhere along the line, she was given unique properties (i.e. sword strength equal throughout the blade instead of having a sweetspot at the tip) and that made Sakurai give her her own slot to avoid battle record discrepancies between her and Marth.
Essentially a last-minute addition.

 

[Johnknight1]

If fire emblem can have 4 reps

Fire Emblem has "0 reps" just like every other series.

Sakurai and all past and present smash developers have never mentioned "reps" being in Smash. Instead, they mention playable characters being in Smash. Sakurai and company specifically always mention gameplay, because they love gameplay. Everything about Smash revolves around gameplay. The totality of the Chrom, Robin, and Lucina decision is all about gameplay.

 

[ChikoLad]

Yes we have seen the forward tilt or neutral tilt.

It was in those Famitsu scans that came out yesterday.

How much can you change a game in roughly 4-6 weeks when the game goes gold=???

The E3 build pre-dates the build shown off in the Smash Direct, many people have already pointed this out. By how much is uncertain. The game did crash on the Nintendo Treehouse stream, and a serious camera glitch happened.

And there is no such thing as a neutral tilt. :I

And that move is not different, Marth has that as part of Dancing Blade too. Note the red streak (which indicates that it's part of that move.

 

[Johnknight1]

The E3 build pre-dates the build shown off in the Smash Direct, many people have already pointed this out. By how much is uncertain. The game did crash on the Nintendo Treehouse stream, and a serious camera glitch happened.

The E3 build is still what=??? From March or some time around then=??? That's only 4 months ago.

4 months + maybe 1 more month = 5 months. That's not a lot of time to add a lot of stuff this late in development.

Marth hasn't been indicated to have any changes going forward (specifically in pictures of Marth with Robin and Lucina, as well as in the trailer), whereas the footage from Lucina is probably from a very recent build of the game.

The only "changes" we saw were for Ike, who had basically got MIA well before E3 and who is still one of those characters that probably still has a few visual cues being worked out (hence the new blue flames FINALLY arriving in Smash Bros).

And there is no such thing as a neutral tilt. :I

Technically there is; it's when the control stick is tilted in the base position. Regardless, you are right in that the correct terminology is just the default A attack.

 

[Arcadenik]

This isn't about Tiers. This is about players who like Marth's moveset, but hate the "Tip of the Blade" Mechanic that comes with Marth.

Maybe Sakurai should start making clones of everyone for people who like the characters' movesets but hate their properties/mechanics.

 

[ChikoLad]

The E3 build is still what=??? From March or some time around then=??? That's only 4 months ago.

4 months + maybe 1 more month = 5 months. That's not a lot of time to add a lot of stuff this late in development.

Marth hasn't been indicated to have any changes going forward (specifically in pictures of Marth with Robin and Lucina, as well as in the trailer), whereas the footage from Lucina is probably from a very recent build of the game.

The only "changes" we saw were for Ike, who had basically got MIA well before E3 and who is still one of those characters that probably still has a few visual cues being worked out (hence the new blue flames FINALLY arriving in Smash Bros).

Technically there is; it's when the control stick is tilted in the base position. Regardless, you are right in that the correct terminology is just the default A attack.

They could easily change Marth's variables (speed, power, jump height, etc) a million times over in that amount of time, and thus, rectify the problems people were having with him.

They also specifically said they were taking feedback from people at E3.

No specific character has been indicated to have changes going forward, but Sakurai did say Samus was the strongest character in the build they had at E3 (and one of the Treehouse employees later re-iterated this), which implies he intends to fix that. The cast is clearly not fully balanced yet, and they are still working on that aspect, and they may even work on that aspect after the game releases, through patches.

 

[spader13]

Another thing:



...So this couldn't have been done to diversify Chrom?

I always thought Chrom could have been implemented as an all-round weapon master, similar to Firion in Dissidia: Final Fantasy.

While Robin can't use Nosferatu/Dark Magic while using a sword (in the Tactician class), he is capable of class changing and using Dark Magic, so it's not as far out of character as Sakurai makes it sound. That said, it's very true that he easily could have shaken up Chrom's moveset more by making up moves or even using a lance which he's capable of using upon promotion. However, I think Sakurai made the right choice in Robin as Tomes are even more different than a Lance in terms of gameplay and even flash animations.

 

[ChikoLad]

While Robin can't use Nosferatu/Dark Magic while using a sword (in the Tactician class), he is capable of class changing and using Dark Magic, so it's not as far out of character as Sakurai makes it sound. That said, it's very true that he easily could have shaken up Chrom's moveset more by making up moves or even using a lance which he's capable of using upon promotion. However, I think Sakurai made the right choice in Robin as Tomes are even more different than a Lance in terms of gameplay and even flash animations.

Yeah, I'm fine with Robin being in the game and I don't have any say regarding FE reps in terms of personal preference, but there are a lot of holes in this recent interview and I think Sakurai didn't think a lot of his statements through. And there was no need to dismiss Chrom as a generic swordfighter as if to say that's all the character can do.

 

[Johnknight1]

Well, now I'm really hoping the leak is false, because losing Lucas after hearing his reasoning for Lucina just seems hypocritical.

The Lucas news probably isn't true, but if it is, Lucas is 100% happening as DLC.

So regardless, Lucas will be playable in SOME official way. I think Lucas fans should rest easy, but still rally together. I know that's what I plan on doing.

 

[Rich Homie Quan]

Why would have they have a new running attack for just the CGI trailer=??? That requires more animation work.

As for the potentially new side tilt or neutral tilt (or maybe it's a part of the Side B), it was in those Famitsu scans that came out yesterday (bottom right).

Yeah that's probably the Side B, lol.

But alas, her up B, side B, and neutral air function a lot differently from Marth's.

Edit: This also might be a new forward air. It may just be a new neutral air animation that Marth doesn't have.

How much can you change a game in roughly 3-6 weeks when the game goes gold=???

Bro, every single move showcased in the gameplay of her trailer and in the scans are a move that Marth has.

And the CGI argument isn't very good. The animation was clearly there just to please fans and introduce a conflict between Lucina and Falcon so Robin could jump in. As a sword user, the CGI is pretty irrelevant because it showed Lucina doing what she's supposed to do: use a sword. It didn't showcase any specific moves.

Finally, Sakurai has made it a point to make sure we realize that she is just going to be only slightly different than marth. I think it's safe to say that we shouldn't expect changes like new moves, or new properties (with exception to the new sword mechanic, which is rather basic).

 

[Johnknight1]

They could easily change Marth's variables (speed, power, jump height, etc) a million times over in that amount of time, and thus, rectify the problems people were having with him.

Yes, but they would have to COMPLETELY CHANGE an established character they showed off.

It would be a lot easier to just keep him mostly the same and change Lucina IMO.

It also would be a good way to make people hyped to play as Lucina, which is why I think they're doing it.

They also specifically said they were taking feedback from people at E3.

That feedback could go to Lucina though, and it appears to given her speed advantages.

No specific character has been indicated to have changes going forward, but Sakurai did say Samus was the strongest character in the build they had at E3 (and one of the Treehouse employees later re-iterated this), which implies he intends to fix that. The cast is clearly not fully balanced yet, and they are still working on that aspect, and they may even work on that aspect after the game releases, through patches.

That was an indication that Samus will be changed (I know a top Brawl player I ran into at the Best Buy demo who found a TRUE COMBO of 0-80% via buffering and pillar combos that's like a mix of 64 and Brawl combos that works on most of the cast and often ends in a KO). Also, Villager got feedback he'd change, as well as Bowser from what I hear.

 

[Igneous42]

Kinda surprised he didn't consider Chrom as an alt skin as well. Honestly I would have been content getting to play him even if he was an Ike alt skin or something. As much as people hate it an Ike clone would actually work pretty well too. Ike is a super strong powerhouse but he's also super slow because of it. I could see the appeal to a weaker but faster version of Ike's move set being used by Chrom. Lucina will be fun to play for me though. I've never disliked Marth's style but never liked it enough to be really into playing it to get real good with it. I'd prefer a more original moveset but playing a more noob friendly Marth won't be bad.

I'm disappointed he never even mentioned the team-up character concept. Where Chrom and Lucina are essentially two characters in one. I think that was the most obvious way to make both characters more unique and it'd still be the same amount of Fire Emblem slots that we got.

 

[ChikoLad]

Yes, but they would have to COMPLETELY CHANGE an established character they showed off.

It would be a lot easier to just keep him mostly the same and change Lucina IMO.

It also would be a good way to make people hyped to play as Lucina, which is why I think they're doing it.

That feedback could go to Lucina though, and it appears to given her speed advantages.

That was an indication that Samus will be changed (I know a top Brawl player I ran into at the Best Buy demo who found a TRUE COMBO of 0-80% via buffering and pillar combos that's like a mix of 64 and Brawl combos that works on most of the cast and often ends in a KO). Also, Villager got feedback he'd change, as well as Bowser from what I hear.

Again, you're speculating.

Right now, Lucina is a Marth clone and is the cloniest clone since Dr. Mario. Sakurai has specifically said that she plays the same as Marth, without the tipper mechanic. He has not mentioned a difference in speed between the two. She was originally a costume for Marth, and was only made playable because they found a way to make her slightly different.

Marth was unusually slow in the E3 build, but that build was early and the game is very subject to change. It's entirely possible that his speed has been tweaked a bunch of times since.

Those are the known facts of the Marth/Lucina comparison.

 

[Johnknight1]

Maybe Sakurai should start making clones of everyone for people who like the characters' movesets but hate their properties/mechanics.

I think doing this for the best designed characters is actually a good idea, as long as each clone has a set in stone direction that is totally different (which I think inevitably leads to clones becoming semi-clones, and semi-clones becoming original characters).

Mario and Luigi works (Luigi is extremely different now and totally feels like a newcomer).
Fox and Falco works (Falco is a semi-clone).
Fox and Wolf works (Wolf has like 2 borrowed moves [the down and neutral B's... and the final smash if that counts]).
Captain Falcon and Ganondorf work (although I want Ganondorf replaced as the clone, with Ganondorf becoming essentially a newcomer).
Ness and Lucas work (although Lucas AT WORST is a semi-clone).
Marth and Lucina work.

Clones, semi-clones, or characters with similar properties of characters that "worked" in past smash games that didn't receive major overhauls are clones and semi-clones I don't mind seeing.

These characters (excluding 3rd party characters) IMO are:
-Peach: I see Daisy as still a recolor of Peach. Maybe she could be an alternate appearance.
-Diddy: Dixie as a semi-clone/character with similar properties could borrow some tilts and aerials could work.
-Sheik: Impa could work as an alternate appearance or a straight up clone.
-Fox: There are so many ways you can take the spacie build with unique skillsets and playstyles. Krystal works perfectly.
-Pikachu: Pichu DONE RIGHT and build or a Plsule and Minun take on Pikachu could definitely work.
-Ness/Lucas: The Masked Man as a semi-clone definitely could work.
-The Ice Climbers: I can't think of anyone but the Baby Mario Bros.
-Mr. Game & Watch: Mrs. Sexually Ambiguous Game & Watch! (okay, I can't think of anything)
-Wario: I have no idea who would "work" as a clone or semi-clone of Wario.

 

[SoaringDive]

Still don't understand. If Chrom wasn't added because he wasn't "unique", why add Lucina that is as far from unique as it can get? She looks very like Marth, has the same attacks, and only has a FEW changes. I guess she isn't a "plain-old sword-weilder" like Chrom.... :/

It's not that Chrom wasn't added because he wasn't unique, it's that Chrom wasn't added because he wasn't unique enough to be worth the time and money of a newcomer. Lucina is a clone, that started as an alt. costume but they spent an hour or two adjusting some things to give her a separate slot.

They can't whip up a brand new character out of sheer will, if Chrom was going to be his own newcomer (not clone), something else (characters, stages, etc.) would have been shafted out of the game. Chrom didn't bring enough to the table to justify what would have been shafted.

 

[ChikoLad]

Hold on...you guys are forgetting somethings about this game, that are making clones more time consuming for this iteration of Smash:

-Custom moves and how/where to unlock them for that character
-Different levels of custom moves
-Differing model for two different systems
-AMIIBO PRODUCTION AND IMPLEMENTATION

While it's cool that Lucina fans will at least get a figurine out of this, the workload put into clones being worth it is much more debatable this time around.

 

[Johnknight1]

Working on clones isn't that hard sonicbrawler.

-Amiibos aren't made by the Smash Bros. development team. It's work for an external source, sure, but no one cares about them.
-The 8 added Customized specials attacks will be ported (you aren't going to have to unlock them).

Again, you're speculating.

Right now, Lucina is a Marth clone and is the cloniest clone since Dr. Mario. Sakurai has specifically said that she plays the same as Marth, without the tipper mechanic. He has not mentioned a difference in speed between the two. She was originally a costume for Marth, and was only made playable because they found a way to make her slightly different.

How do you follow up "you're speculating" with "Lucina is... the cloniest clone since Dr. Mario"=???

As far as we know, her gameplay direction is very akin to Falco vs. Fox in Melee, especially since she has unique properties and animations to cloned moves, as seen by her side B, up B, up tilt, up air, and neutral air.

Saying "Lucina is... the cloniest clone since Dr. Mario" is "speculating."

 

[AfricanManBeast]

More like Mario to Dr. Mario. As things currently stand, she's the most similar to her counterpart than any other clone in the history of Smash Bros.

Was thinking that in my head lol

 

[ChikoLad]

Working on clones isn't that hard sonicbrawler.

-Amiibos aren't made by the Smash Bros. development team. It's work for an external source, sure, but no one cares about them.
-The 8 added Customized specials attacks will be ported (you aren't going to have to unlock them).

How do you follow up "you're speculating" with "Lucina is... the cloniest clone since Dr. Mario"=???

As far as we know, her gameplay direction is very akin to Falco vs. Fox in Melee, especially since she has unique properties and animations to cloned moves, as seen by her side B, up B, up tilt, up air, and neutral air.

Saying "Lucina is... the cloniest clone since Dr. Mario" is "speculating."

But they still have to implement all of the customisation tied to each Amiibo, and all that jazz. And it's been confirmed that custom moves are unlockable, or at least, upgrades and variants to them are (seen in Smash Run footage).

AND AGAIN, any "difference" you are claiming beyond the tipper mechanic is you speculating! Sakurai has not mentioned any differences as of now, and has said that her physical abilities are the same as Marth's.

Me saying she is as bad as Dr.Mario as far as clones go is not speculation, it's based off of what we definitively know.

 

[AfricanManBeast]

She also appears to be more aerial based.

Mike Haze (the top Brawl Marth in the world for the longest time), PewPewU (the top West coast Melee Marth), M2K (all-time Melee Marth who was the best Marth from about 2007/8-2013), PPMD (best Melee Marth in the world right now), and Ken (the highest profile Melee Marth ever who was the best Melee Marth from 2002-2006/7) all hated Marth in Smash 4 (with the exception of M2K, who preferred Melee Marth to current Marth, and wanted both), and they aren't alone.

Thus, if Lucina is like a simplified Marth without a hitbox and more focus on speed and landing attacks rather than precision landing with the tipper, it will make sense.

It also helps that all of those players I just mentioned expressed a lot of interest in Lucina, with a few of them even supporting the lack of a tipper.

The tipper, quite frankly, fits the Smash 4 Marth's design better than Melee or Brawl Marth. This is because Smash 4 Marth is more defensive, is stronger, doesn't have as many combos, focuses more on countering, and is especially more ground based. With less attacks and less aerial reads from Smash 4 Marth, having a tipper to reward careful aiming is a smart mechanic to have, and finally, truly, 100% fits Marth.

When Marth didn't land the tipper in Melee, especially with the forward smash, it had what we call the "wet noodle effect", which is generally a term for Roy's weak sword in Melee.

Yes but modified. Falco was a lot more advanced than 64 Fox, while Lucina will be a lot simpler (but probably more technical) than Marth in Melee and Brawl.

Lucina seems more interesting to me than Marth will be in Smash 4

REIGN OF MARTH COMES TO AN END

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Maybe Sakurai should start making clones of everyone for people who like the characters' movesets but hate their properties/mechanics.

Or let those be part of the customizable components that the game would contain.

 

[κomıc]

This interview irritates me because he sounds so contradictory. I can already picture an original moveset for Chrom and although I do prefer Lucina, making that cop out of "Chrom would be too similar to Marth and Ike" when he blatantly made Lucina a copy of Marth and very slight differences bothers me. Hell, after playing FE:A, I know they could have made a totally original moveset for Lucina but instead chose to make her a more accessible fighter than Marth.

It's sad but w/e. More females and Robin (a spellcaster/tactician) is good enough for me from Fire Emblem.

And again, like I've been saying, this adds a lot of weight to the Gematsu leak, just like Sakurai's comments about referring Greninja as "Pokemon from X/Y" last month @ E3. I wonder what he has done with Chorus Men and instead opted for Marshal as an independent fighter now or even an alternate skin for G&W and Shulk.. Well, he's just Shulk.

 

[QJD1381]

" Eh, Chrom has no unique characteristics. Let's add Robin instead. Ooh, I know! And let's make Lucina a complete Marth Clone while we're at it!"

You're killing me here, Sakurai.

 

[zombieRabbidz]

Sakurai's reasoning for doing what he did is completely fair. It is not a matter of Chrom being cut for Lucina's sake; if it was, then I would be able to sympathise more with Chrom supporters (of which I considered myself a part), but it just isn't. I'll assume that no-one would be complaining if she had been introduced as a costume that shared Marth's slot, so I have to ask... what is wrong with her having her own slot? There is no negative impact on the rest of the game and a very positive impact for fans of Lucina.

Also, a little OT, but my question now is: now that Robin and Lucina have been solidified as characters that will remain relevant throughout the lifetime of Smash 4, will they remain relevant in future Fire Emblem games throughout this period as well?


He didn't add Lucina because she was unique and Chrom wasn't. She was a costume that was put in to introduce a highly popular (moreso than Chrom) and female Fire Emblem representative. She was designed to be just like Marth - but not Marth. Sakurai never said she was more unique than Chrom in terms of potential movesets.

Yes and we needed a female fire emblem representitive and they all have blue hair except robin XD

 

[DraginHikari]

I don't know if I really find it contradictory unless it was part of the original plan which as far as I've seen doesn't seem to be the case. It doesn't seem like to me like to me that it was ever his intention to make Chrom or Lucina an indepentant character at the start. To me it seems more like the situation that they stumbled upon on option based on something they had already been working with anyway (Given the Lucina alt had probably been done awhile prior to the decision) and decided to go with it on the fly. Either indicating they had enough time to build her as a slightly modified clone but not give her an entirely unique set or just simply that it was an addition that would take little effort to bloster the roster just a little bit more.

Now you can debate whether that's a good thing or bad. That's just how I see it.

 

[Deleted member]

"Cloniest clone since Dr. Mario"?
That's frigging insulting. Lucina's much worse than Dr. Mario ever was clone-wise.

 

[JayJay584]

It feels like over half the people in this thread are not reading the article correctly or any thread replies, and are just assuming Lucina took the place of Chrom when it was Robin who took Chrom's place. How many times does it have to be said that Lucina started out as an alt for Marth mid development and was then changed into her own character? Then there are the claims of Sakurai being lazy. Is all the other work the man put into the game going to be ignored JUST because of Lucina's situation? Do the 30+ characters with completely unique movesets not matter anymore because of Lucina? I'm pretty sure it would have been much easier to just keep her as an alt than to take the extra time to give her a slot with minor differences.

 

[ChikoLad]

"Cloniest clone since Dr. Mario"?
That's frigging insulting. Lucina's much worse than Dr. Mario ever was clone-wise.

I honestly think they are just as bad, especially since Dr. Mario is literally Mario beyond just being a clone moveset wise (and was therefore should have been an alt costume for Mario). Not to mention that the game tells you his speed is slower than Mario's, even though he isn't.

It feels like over half the people in this thread are not reading the article correctly or any thread replies, and are just assuming Lucina took the place of Chrom when it was Robin who took Chrom's place. How many times does it have to be said that Lucina started out as an alt for Marth mid development and was then changed into her own character? Then there are the claims of Sakurai being lazy. Is all the other work the man put into the game going to be ignored JUST because of Lucina's situation? Do the 30+ characters with completely unique movesets not matter anymore because of Lucina? I'm pretty sure it would have been much easier to just keep her as an alt than to take the extra time to give her a slot with minor differences.

People are aware of that, it's just that a lot of Sakurai's claims regarding the two are contradictory.

Regardless of who took the place of who, saying "Chrom would just be a generic swordfighter", when Lucina is just that, is bull.

 

[ScottyWK]

This may be unlikely (and not an acceptable excuse or reason), but it's possible that some of the sword move ideas that Sakurai implemented into the Mii Fighter moveset took away from Chrom's ability to be unique.

Just food for thought.