Meta "This is the Monado's Power" - Metagame Discussion

[S.F.L.R_9]

@ Berserker. it varies based on the character's hurt-box. If you take a skinny character that doesnt have big feet, or a huge nose, D-tilt reaches farther than F-tilt.

Speaking of range, perhaps we should list off Shulk's moves in terms of range longest to shortest vertically & horizontally?

(I will edit this when I finished testing the ranges of the moves)

I can't do testing atm but I know off the top of my head that Air Slash is the longest vertically and fsmash might be the longest horizontally

 

[Zatchiel]

I feel like the second hit of Air Slash and b-air might rival f-smash in terms of horizontal reach (especially since b-air's range extends in front of and behind Shulk), that's just what comes to mind though.

Also, about Buster/low percent combos in general: I believe b-air -> f-smash at the ledge covers everything if they hit the ground and don't slide offstage. It does excellent damage (in Buster it's downright gross, not to mention if you charge f-smash and they roll in) and sets up a ledgeguard. The second hit might be blockable out of a tech (not a tech roll), by the smaller characters but the fatties get sweetspotted if they tech in place and take the second hit if they tech away.

 

[Masonomace]

*EDITED*

Spoiler: Don't worry about it

Here's my results. I created a flat & straight 20-block long Custom stage with the Volcano Background for its black & white tile square floor for measurements. I used Wii Fit Trainer for a stationary dummy, including the Sandbag for a second opinion.

Horizontal

1. Vision counter
2. Back Slash
3. Dash attack (tried my best inputting it from the starting point ASAP)
4. F-smash 2nd hit angled upward
5. Air Slash 2nd hit (hard testing this)
6. B-air from behind (very, very tip)
7. Full Jab combo
8. F-smash 2nd hit without angling
9. F-smash 2nd hit angled downward
10. Forwarded Vision counter
11. D-smash 3rd hit from the front (it's technically the 5th overall D-smash hit)
12. Air Slash grounded 1st hit
13. D-tilt
14. F-smash 1st hit angled upward
15. F-air from the front
16. F-smash 1st hit without angling
17. F-tilt
18. F-smash 1st hit angled downward
19. D-smash 2nd hit from the back (it's technically the 4th overall D-smash hit)
20. D-smash 1st hit from the back (it's technically the 2nd overall D-smash hit)
21. D-smash 1st hit from the front
22. D-smash 2nd hit from the front (it's technically the 3rd overall D-smash hit)
23. Jab-1 > Jab-2
24. N-air from the front
25. Jab-1
26. U-tilt
27. N-air from behind
28. U-smash front-facing hit
29. B-air front-facing hit
30. Standing Grab
31. U-smash back-facing hit
32. D-air
33. U-air

As far as Stationary movement goes, F-smash, B-air, & the 2nd hit of Air Slash are Shulk's top contending moves, although there are other good ones too. Remember that you can hold towards a direction while using Air Slash in midst of delaying the 1st slash so that your 2nd Air Slash hit can horizontally travel farther than rapidly pressing B or A twice to get a little bit of height.
════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════
Vertical
Instead of a numbers list going from the longest to shortest range, I'll only rate the following moves in their own star tiers accordingly.

★ = Not meant for vertical range
★★ = Poor
★★★ = Average
★★★★ = Great
★★★★★ = Fantastic

Jab = ★★
Dash attack = ★
F-tilt = ★
U-tilt = ★★★★★
D-tilt = ★
F-smash = ★★
U-smash = ★★★★
D-smash = ★
N-air = ★★★★
F-air = ★★★★
B-air = ★★
U-air = ★★★★
D-air = ★★★
Back Slash = ★★
Air Slash = ★★★★★
Vision = ★
F-throw = ★
B-throw = ★
U-throw = ★★★
D-throw = ★

 

[Berserker.]

The long awaited stage discussion thread has finally arrived after several "soon's" and "when I feel like it" from me, lol

http://smashboards.com/threads/good...ussion-current-discussion-battlefield.386902/

 

[erico9001]

Here's my results. I created a flat & straight 20-block long Custom stage with the Volcano Background for its black & white tile square floor for measurements. I used Wii Fit Trainer for a stationary dummy, including the Sandbag for a second opinion.

Horizontal

1. Vision counter
2. Back Slash
3. Dash attack (tried my best inputting it from the starting point ASAP)
4. F-smash 2nd hit angled upward
5. Air Slash 2nd hit (hard testing this)
6. B-air from behind (very, very tip)
7. Full Jab combo
8. F-smash 2nd hit without angling
9. F-smash 2nd hit angled downward
10. Forwarded Vision counter
11. D-smash 3rd hit from the front (it's technically the 5th overall D-smash hit)
12. Air Slash grounded 1st hit
13. D-tilt
14. F-smash 1st hit angled upward
15. F-air from the front
16. F-smash 1st hit without angling
17. F-tilt
18. F-smash 1st hit angled downward
19. D-smash 2nd hit from the back (it's technically the 4th overall D-smash hit)
20. D-smash 1st hit from the back (it's technically the 2nd overall D-smash hit)
21. D-smash 1st hit from the front
22. D-smash 2nd hit from the front (it's technically the 3rd overall D-smash hit)
23. Jab-1 > Jab-2
24. N-air from the front
25. Jab-1
26. U-tilt
27. N-air from behind
28. U-smash front-facing hit
29. B-air front-facing hit
30. Standing Grab
31. U-smash back-facing hit
32. D-air
33. U-air

As far as Stationary movement goes, F-smash, B-air, & the 2nd hit of Air Slash are Shulk's top contending moves, although there are other good ones too. Remember that you can hold towards a direction while using Air Slash in midst of delaying the 1st slash so that your 2nd Air Slash hit can horizontally travel farther than rapidly pressing B or A twice to get a little bit of height.
════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════
Vertical
Instead of a numbers list going from the longest to shortest range, I'll only rate the following moves in their own star tiers accordingly.

★ = Not meant for vertical range
★★ = Poor
★★★ = Average
★★★★ = Great
★★★★★ = Fantastic

Jab = ★★
Dash attack = ★
F-tilt = ★
U-tilt = ★★★★★
D-tilt = ★
F-smash = ★★
U-smash = ★★★★
D-smash = ★
N-air = ★★★★
F-air = ★★★★
B-air = ★★
U-air = ★★★★
D-air = ★★★
Back Slash = ★★
Air Slash = ★★★★★
Vision = ★
F-throw = ★
B-throw = ★
U-throw = ★★★
D-throw = ★

So yeah.

Wow, what surprising results! To think F-Smash angle upwards actually has the best range of the F-Smashes. Also, I'm surprised at D-smash's lack of range.

For vertical, I think Back Slash really ought to be a 3 star, considering it hits opponents who are on the first platform of battlefield. It's better than jab, F-smash, and seems a bit higher than Dair and U-throw to me.

 

[Zatchiel]

Time for some hypothetical discussion.

Spoiler

Shulk now can't just equip Monado Arts on the fly, he has to wait out the entire activation animation before he can do anything, basically. If he's currently performing a grounded normal the art activation interrupts it. You can however still interrupt the animation with special attacks (you have to wait for the animation to end before the art can be switched off though). Grabs/throws and aerials aren't interfered with by activation as usual.

How does this impact your playstyle/Shulk in general?

 

[Berserker.]

Animation can't be cancelled huh? If so, opponents are likely to take advantage of the activation animation and try to punish it. SINCE you can cancel it with a special, you can try gambling 50/50 and use vision counter at the right time. That, or you can use air slash when they're at range.

Then again, I usually switch to an art in mid-air (or while jumping) while doing an aerial to protect myself, so there's that.

 

[Berserker.]

Double post because here's another opinion I want from you guys and because this was discussed in another thread

Shulk moveset tier list time because this thread is also for whatever things about his moveset. Not arranged

God tier
F-air (All arts)
N-air (All arts)
F-tilt (Speed)
Pivot grab (Speed)

Amazing tier
B-air (All arts)
F-smash (Speed)
Pivot grab (All)
Air slash (All arts)
U-tilt (Smash)
F-tilt (Buster)
D-tilt (Buster)

Beautiful tier
U-tilt (All arts)
F-smash (All arts)
D-smash (Smash)
F-tilt (Smash)
B-throw (Buster/Smash)
F-throw (Buster)
D-throw (Buster/Speed/Jump)
U-throw (Jump)
U-smash (All arts)
Jab (All arts)

Cool tier
F-tilt (All arts)
Air slash (Buster)
D-smash (All arts)
D-tilt (All arts)
U-air (Jump/Smash)

Decent tier
U-throw (All arts)
U-air (All arts)
D-air (All arts)
Air slash (Shield)

 

[FOcast]

Time for some hypothetical discussion.

Spoiler

Shulk now can't just equip Monado Arts on the fly, he has to wait out the entire activation animation before he can do anything, basically. If he's currently performing a grounded normal the art activation interrupts it. You can however still interrupt the animation with special attacks (you have to wait for the animation to end before the art can be switched off though). Grabs/throws and aerials aren't interfered with by activation as usual.

How does this impact your playstyle/Shulk in general?

You definitely can cancel the activation animation - not just with specials, with just about anything. That's the point of the Monado Art Cancel getting rid of landing lag. See: http://www.twitch.tv/showdownsmash/v/3693783?t=45m30s

Actually, come to think of it, this is about canceling the activation BEFORE the animation plays. This can also be done with anything that takes you out of a neutral position: shield, airdodge, attack, run, grab, etc.

Edit: Not sure if that link's working - go to 45:30.

 

[Berserker.]

You definitely can cancel the activation animation - not just with specials, with just about anything. That's the point of the Monado Art Cancel getting rid of landing lag. See: http://www.twitch.tv/showdownsmash/v/3693783?t=45m30s

Actually, come to think of it, this is about canceling the activation BEFORE the animation plays. This can also be done with anything that takes you out of a neutral position: shield, airdodge, attack, run, grab, etc.

It's a hypothetical situation. He's asking what if you can't cancel it with anything but specials

 

[Zacko]

God tier
F-tilt (Speed)

Amazing tier
F-tilt (Buster)

What makes F-tilt in speed monado a god tier move?

 

[Berserker.]

What makes F-tilt in speed monado a god tier move?

Pivot f-tilt

Oh and I should put

God tier
Pivot grab (speed)

Amazing tier
Pivot grab (All arts)

 

[Zacko]

Pivot f-tilt

Oh and I should put

God tier
Pivot grab (speed)

Amazing tier
Pivot grab (All arts)

I see, thanks!
Pivot grab is indeed a godly move with speed monado.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Where's fsmash speed?

 

[Berserker.]

Where's fsmash speed?

Forgot about that. Thanks. That's probably god tier or amazing tier.

Edit: Not sure how u-smash ended up in C, so I moved it up. Pretty forgetful today >_>

 

[FOcast]

It's a hypothetical situation. He's asking what if you can't cancel it with anything but specials

Whoops. Reading comprehension fail. I'll blame lack of sleep for that one. =P

In that case, I'd be relying a lot more on using time after I hit an opponent to change arts, rather than trying to follow up. I'd also be more likely to cancel arts early, since safe switching windows would be harder to find. The change itself could lead to some nice counter-baiting opportunities, but mostly it would make doing speed followups and jump edgeguards much harder.

 

[DavemanCozy]

Time for some hypothetical discussion.

Spoiler

Shulk now can't just equip Monado Arts on the fly, he has to wait out the entire activation animation before he can do anything, basically. If he's currently performing a grounded normal the art activation interrupts it. You can however still interrupt the animation with special attacks (you have to wait for the animation to end before the art can be switched off though). Grabs/throws and aerials aren't interfered with by activation as usual.

How does this impact your playstyle/Shulk in general?

I'm onto you. You're helping with Project M.2, aren't you?

Jokes aside; Vision would be my obvious go-to if the opponent doesn't respect the space near me while I'm changing arts. Now, here's a question from me about this hypothecial: if I were to use vision, would the monado stance change cancel out the vision when it activates and let me act out? It would help in this hypothetical.

 

[Masonomace]

Double post because here's another opinion I want from you guys and because this was discussed in another thread

Shulk moveset tier list time because this thread is also for whatever things about his moveset. Not arranged

God tier
F-air (All arts)
N-air (All arts)
F-tilt (Speed)
Pivot grab (Speed)

Amazing tier
B-air (All arts)
F-smash (Speed)
Pivot grab (All)
Air slash (All arts)
U-tilt (Smash)
F-tilt (Buster)
D-tilt (Buster)

Beautiful tier
U-tilt (All arts)
F-smash (All arts)
D-smash (Smash)
F-tilt (Smash)
B-throw (Buster/Smash)
F-throw (Buster)
D-throw (Buster/Speed/Jump)
U-throw (Jump)
U-smash (All arts)
Jab (All arts)

Cool tier
F-tilt (All arts)
Air slash (Buster)
D-smash (All arts)
D-tilt (All arts)
U-air (Jump/Smash)

Decent tier
U-throw (All arts)
U-air (All arts)
D-air (All arts)
Air slash (Shield)

My suggestions:

Amazing tier
Vision / Forwarded Vision - (Smash)

Beautiful tier
Jump Canceled Item Throw - (Speed)
Bubble Shield - (Shield)

Cool tier
Dash Attack - (Shield)
Front / Back Floor attack - (Buster)
Pummel - (Buster)

 

[Zatchiel]

I'm onto you. You're helping with Project M.2, aren't you?

Jokes aside; Vision would be my obvious go-to if the opponent doesn't respect the space near me while I'm changing arts. Now, here's a question from me about this hypothecial: if I were to use vision, would the monado stance change cancel out the vision when it activates and let me act out? It would help in this hypothetical.

Ha, I wouldn't tell.

No, vision (and his other specials) would remain exactly the same. If you tried using them before the art activated it would just cause you to switch to the next art as normal. You still have to wait until the art is equipped after you start the art switch before you can use specials.

For my own response: Air Slash and Counter would be great enough for me otherwise, since I already use aerials to cover my art switches in tight situations. It probably wouldn't affect my play too drastically, but I would miss it.

Beautiful tier
Jump Canceled Item Throw - (Speed)
Bubble Shield - (Shield)

 

[Berserker.]

There's a certain space between you and the opponent throwing out a projectile. When you're at range and they throw out a projectile, counter and perform forward vision. They'll get hit. I noticed this in some videos. Like when Ally countered Pacman's hydrant at a certain distance and when Treluh (Name search dodging) countered Greninja's shurikens

 

[Zatchiel]

There's a certain space between you and the opponent throwing out a projectile. When you're at range and they throw out a projectile, counter and perform forward vision. They'll get hit. I noticed this in some videos. Like when Ally countered Pacman's hydrant at a certain distance and when Treluh (Name search dodging) countered Greninja's shurikens

I like to do this with characters that tend to approach from behind their projectile (like Zero Suit or Mario) once I get close enough to them. If it misses it's easy to punish, so I wouldn't recommend doing it at every opening you see. It is unblockable though.

Something I like to do in the Megaman MU is use forward vision on a snagged crash bomber at the right time, which can feasibly kill him at higher percents.

 

[Masonomace]

Something I like to do in the Megaman MU is use forward vision on a snagged crash bomber at the right time, which can feasibly kill him at higher percents.

This ^, I always explore a possible opening vs Mega Man anytime Crash Bomber is used against me. I like Short Hopping & using Vision a split moment before it detonates, so that I drift a slight amount of distance forward & be in time to still be fully grounded so that a Forwarded Vision takes place & connects.

EDIT: (Also to anyone, I added some more damages in the tables, especially for the Hyper Monado Arts)

 

[Berserker.]

This ^, I always explore a possible opening vs Mega Man anytime Crash Bomber is used against me. I like Short Hopping & using Vision a split moment before it detonates, so that I drift a slight amount of distance forward & be in time to still be fully grounded so that a Forwarded Vision takes place & connects.

EDIT: (Also to anyone, I added some more damages in the tables, especially for the Hyper Monado Arts)

Put it in decimals also for maximum accuracy

 

[Masonomace]

Put it in decimals also for maximum accuracy

Indeed, the problem with inputting Hyper Speed values as decimals is something I held back from doing because the current multiplier for HSpeed (0.63x) isn't exact, & it's lame because of one distinct pattern I've noticed with HSpeed's damages: 11%.

Any move that deals a flat damage of 11% or would result with dealing 11% after calculations with the HSpeed 0.63x multiplier becomes inconsistent, since the Training Mode flat damage you would get with the math for a Dash Attack would be 6.93, yet testing it personally for reassurance I get 7% as the result, so the multiplier is something around 0.637 (11 x 0.637 = 7.007) or something close. It's only off by an estimate amount of 0.077, but I would imagine it would alter the tenth of the decimal placement (but at this point that may not be that important)

 

[DavemanCozy]

That hypothetical would be unfortunate then, I can think of much more things if I could cancel the vision animation (baits).

So I went to CECC2 last Saturday, found out that Shiek is more manageable than I thought. She can get Faired in the face if she gets greedy with her chases, which is nice to punish her and space her out too. Jump and Speed also give a means of approach and combo escapes against her. Definitely not good for us, but I think it's more do-able than Sonic, Fox and Pikachu.

 

[Masonomace]

Some Monado Art findings I finally practiced with to get more of a grasp of their usages: Jump Speed & Shield.

Two things I added to the OP:

1. Shield regeneration into the Increased / Decreased stats table to Shield mode.
2. A tip about using the deactivation of the mobile Arts Jump Speed & Shield to help improve or mix up your recovery

1.

Monado Art | Increased stats | Decreased stats 盾(Shield) | Defense / Weight / Shield health / Shield regeneration | Damage dealt / Jump height / Movement speed / Air speed

So about #1, I was continuing my little project for Shield mode but I thought I'd announce a tiny tip that greatly helps your defensive play-style in hopes of players mastering Shield's bubble shield. And while I was testing Shield, I learned that not only is the shield strength / health increased, but so is the regeneration too. I'm not exactly sure if rolling around helps your bubble shield recover / regenerate faster, but if that's to be the case it would be beneficial anyhow considering Shield's heavily decreased ground speed. Anyways sorry for derailing.

2.

--Despite that a MArt's stat effects don't carry over to your new MArt, a mobile MArt such as Jump Speed or Shield that's deactivated airborne or on the ground can still carry over their air speed or ground speed movement to Vanilla Shulk. However, canceling a mobile MArt grounded is more limiting than canceling a MArt airborne. The inputs you can press to cancel-slash-remove the increased or decreased movement speed that carries over are:

• Doublejump (air) | Short Hop or Full Hop (ground)
• Airdodge (air) | bubble shield (ground) OR grab (ground)
• Any of the 5 aerials (air) | Dash attack (ground) OR U-smash (ground)
• A new MArt activated (air)
• Back Slash (both)
• Air Slash (both)
• Vision (both)

So about #2, this applies to either rapidly pressing B to deactivate the Art or by holding down the B button in the given situations, whether you're being launched or when you're by yourself recovering towards the stage. Also if you're holding down the B button to deactivate the current Art, you have to be holding just that button & wait for the Art to deactivate before you input anything else. If you don't strictly hold B for 1 whole second waiting for the Art to be deactivated, & then you try recovering normally how you would while holding B, the current Art won't deactivate & then you could potentially ruin your own recovery chances, espcially if we're talking about Shield. If we're alking about Jump or Speed, you can utilize the after-effect of their carried over air speed and/or falling speed to avoid the Decreased stats that may ruin your recovery efforts, such as Jump's weakened Defense & Speed's reduced Jump height to your Doublejump. You can do the same thing with rapidly pressing B to cancel the Art which is faster if you can mash B faster than holding B for 1 second, & in case you forget you can mash B to deactivate your current Art right as you're hit & launched by an opposing move, you can replace this with holding B. Unless you're in a tight spot getting combo'd & you NEED to get out of your current Art, mash B in case you might die.

Thoughts? Again sorry for derailing.

 

[Plain Yogurt]

Question that's probably been answered before: what are shield's effects on blockstun and pushback?

 

[erico9001]

Some Monado Art findings I finally practiced with to get more of a grasp of their usages: Jump Speed & Shield.

Two things I added to the OP:

1. Shield regeneration into the Increased / Decreased stats table to Shield mode.
2. A tip about using the deactivation of the mobile Arts Jump Speed & Shield to help improve or mix up your recovery

1.

So about #1, I was continuing my little project for Shield mode but I thought I'd announce a tiny tip that greatly helps your defensive play-style in hopes of players mastering Shield's bubble shield. And while I was testing Shield, I learned that not only is the shield strength / health increased, but so is the regeneration too. I'm not exactly sure if rolling around helps your bubble shield recover / regenerate faster, but if that's to be the case it would be beneficial anyhow considering Shield's heavily decreased ground speed. Anyways sorry for derailing.

2.

So about #2, this applies to either rapidly pressing B to deactivate the Art or by holding down the B button in the given situations, whether you're being launched or when you're by yourself recovering towards the stage. Also if you're holding down the B button to deactivate the current Art, you have to be holding just that button & wait for the Art to deactivate before you input anything else. If you don't strictly hold B for 1 whole second waiting for the Art to be deactivated, & then you try recovering normally how you would while holding B, the current Art won't deactivate & then you could potentially ruin your own recovery chances, espcially if we're talking about Shield. If we're alking about Jump or Speed, you can utilize the after-effect of their carried over air speed and/or falling speed to avoid the Decreased stats that may ruin your recovery efforts, such as Jump's weakened Defense & Speed's reduced Jump height to your Doublejump. You can do the same thing with rapidly pressing B to cancel the Art which is faster if you can mash B faster than holding B for 1 second, & in case you forget you can mash B to deactivate your current Art right as you're hit & launched by an opposing move, you can replace this with holding B. Unless you're in a tight spot getting combo'd & you NEED to get out of your current Art, mash B in case you might die.

Thoughts? Again sorry for derailing.

I've taken into spamming B while I'm grabbed.

For mashing B while being combo'd in order to get out of the Monado Art, realize you can't DI and cancel the art at the same time -- you would just be inputting any of the directional special attacks.

Also, I've been realizing more and more how much I need to stop using B for my second hit with Air Slash. I've been back slashing a lot due to things like Charizard's fire hitting me.

 

[Masonomace]

I've taken into spamming B while I'm grabbed.

For mashing B while being combo'd in order to get out of the Monado Art, realize you can't DI and cancel the art at the same time -- you would just be inputting any of the directional special attacks.

Also, I've been realizing more and more how much I need to stop using B for my second hit with Air Slash. I've been back slashing a lot due to things like Charizard's fire hitting me.

Not exactly at the same time no, but between DI'ing & deactivating our current MArt, we do our best if we DI first & then mash the B button after. This is the best way I feel.

When I go up against a character who has a tool used for edge-guarding me such as Zard's flamethrower or better yet Lucario's ticking Aura Sphere Charge (the ticking hit-box behind Lucario), I throw out the punishable Air Slash that gets hit by these said edge-guarding tools & I DI away & hope that I Air Slash toward them while setting my thumb back to hold up so that in case my second Air Slash attempt will make me go straight up while hitting them in the process, instead of holding forward to mis-input it for the unfortunate Back Slash SD. The situation you're talking about is different though, since I can imagine Zard being as close to the ledge & spewing flamethrower & angling it downward in time for Shulk using Air Slash. Our recovery is kind of telegraphed once you know how Shulk works. . . =(

 

[erico9001]

Not exactly at the same time no, but between DI'ing & deactivating our current MArt, we do our best if we DI first & then mash the B button after. This is the best way I feel.

When I go up against a character who has a tool used for edge-guarding me such as Zard's flamethrower or better yet Lucario's ticking Aura Sphere Charge (the ticking hit-box behind Lucario), I throw out the punishable Air Slash that gets hit by these said edge-guarding tools & I DI away & hope that I Air Slash toward them while setting my thumb back to hold up so that in case my second Air Slash attempt will make me go straight up while hitting them in the process, instead of holding forward to mis-input it for the unfortunate Back Slash SD. The situation you're talking about is different though, since I can imagine Zard being as close to the ledge & spewing flamethrower & angling it downward in time for Shulk using Air Slash. Our recovery is kind of telegraphed once you know how Shulk works. . . =(

Eh, I'm not actually too sure which direction to DI all the time so maybe I should just cancel the MArt first then try to figure that out. DI first then cancel MArt seems better if you actually know which way you should DI beforehand though. The worst thing to do is both at the same time though.

Yeah, that's the situation I was in. The flamethrower wouldn't be bad if I just took the small damage, got out of the move, and used air slash low enough so that I grab onto the edge without going over. However, I just back slash to my doom. It's been happening more and more, so I think I just need to go grind in Training Mode to change my muscle memory.

 

[Masonomace]

Question that's probably been answered before: what are shield's effects on blockstun and pushback?

Shield doesn't reduce pushback as far as I've tested just today in Training Mode with my Custom Stage created for testing distances of any sort. I can explore more into this tomorrow though.

Is blockstun when the opposing fighter is pushed back from using a move on a bubble shield? Because if that is so, I'll explore that tomorrow as well unless someone beats me to it.

 

[erico9001]

I was curious, so I tested the speeds of Shulk's movements. I measured how long it takes for each form of movement to get across Final destination, one end to the other. I checked each multiple times to make sure the results are consistent.

Rolling (same for all modes (tested just to be sure)) - 2.35s

Monado Shield running - 3.16s
Shield walking - 4.6s

Jump/Buster/Smash/Vanilla (neutral) running - 1.90s
Jump/Buster/Smash/Vanilla (neutral) walking - 2.77s

Speed running - 1.2s
Speed walking - 1.7s

Monado Jump jumping (short hop then aerial jump) - 1.91s

Interesting findings:
-The speed difference between Monado Jump jumping and Neutral running is insignificant.
-Rolling is much slower than speed running/walking, much faster than monado shield running, and a little slower than neutral running.
-Speed walking is faster than neutral running (though also keep in mind it has lower acceleration)

 

[DavemanCozy]

Did you take into account fastfalling with Jump, or just jumping to the other side? Having C. Falcon falling speed is quite the boost in vertical mobility.

Jump's falling speed is amazing for capitalising on baits too. Shulk can take advantage of conditioning his opponents with tomahawk jumps (empty jump/short hop to fastfall). I find the threat of Nair is enough to scare opponents into shielding near Shulk in the air if they respect its range, a tomahawk lets us land fast next to them and grab them.

Are there any air moves that have more shieldstun than others? I'm wondering about crossing up opponents...

 

[Berserker.]

N-air (Preferably tipped)
B-air

Those are probably your best cross up options that have a notable amount of shield stun (Compared to his other aerials). Buster increases shield stun while any art that decreases damage output decreases the said attack's shield stun

 

[Plain Yogurt]

Shield doesn't reduce pushback as far as I've tested just today in Training Mode with my Custom Stage created for testing distances of any sort. I can explore more into this tomorrow though.

Is blockstun when the opposing fighter is pushed back from using a move on a bubble shield? Because if that is so, I'll explore that tomorrow as well unless someone beats me to it.

By blockstun I meant the time Shulk has to wait while blocking an attack before he can drop the shield. Basically, can he act faster after blocking an attack in shield then he can normally?

 

[erico9001]

Did you take into account fastfalling with Jump, or just jumping to the other side? Having C. Falcon falling speed is quite the boost in vertical mobility.

Jump's falling speed is amazing for capitalising on baits too. Shulk can take advantage of conditioning his opponents with tomahawk jumps (empty jump/short hop to fastfall). I find the threat of Nair is enough to scare opponents into shielding near Shulk in the air if they respect its range, a tomahawk lets us land fast next to them and grab them.

Are there any air moves that have more shieldstun than others? I'm wondering about crossing up opponents...

I just jumped and then double jumped. I would not think fastfalling decreases your horizontal speed, rather the increase in vertical speed makes your time in the air last shorter. Therefore, you travel less distance even though going the same speed.

By blockstun I meant the time Shulk has to wait while blocking an attack before he can drop the shield. Basically, can he act faster after blocking an attack in shield then he can normally?

I tried this out in 1/4 (hold L) traning mode using the designs on Skyloft Omega form as reference. Looks to be exactly the same.

 

[Masonomace]

By blockstun I meant the time Shulk has to wait while blocking an attack before he can drop the shield. Basically, can he act faster after blocking an attack in shield then he can normally?

I tried this out in 1/4 (hold L) traning mode using the designs on Skyloft Omega form as reference. Looks to be exactly the same.

I too tried this out on my move range testing Custom stage. The blockstun between Vanilla & Shield are the same, unfortunately.

EDIT: Just in case, I tested the distance from an opposing smash attack that's pushed back from a perfect shield. The distances between Vanilla & Shield are the same as well.

 

[Plain Yogurt]

Aww. Woulda been a nice utility for Shield's more turtling playstyle. Thanks for testing though!

 

[Masonomace]

Aww. Woulda been a nice utility for Shield's more turtling playstyle. Thanks for testing though!

It would of been nice for sure, but Shield mode grants enough utility for me to love it. Stronger shield that regenerates faster while being even heavier than Bowser, & taking less damage? Sign me up please!

And to top it off, while I'm working on this project with Shield mode, Shield also reduces these negative effects:
-paralysis
-sleep
-flower DoT
-freezing
-being buried into the ground

Hallelujah

 

[Virum]

In addition, Monado Shield also reduces the time you spend trapped in Yoshi's Neutral B egg. Some Yoshis like to try to catch you near the edge with it and cause you to fall to your death but in Shield you can prevent this.