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Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

Skyblade12

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The idea of aerial smash attacks scares me. If they are activated by using the C stick in the air, I can't see characters with this trait to be very viable. This trait could apply to Ridley if he's aerial based. Hopefully they give you the choice of activating them with the C stick in the controller menu.
Um, given that the game is being built for a platform WITHOUT the C-Stick (namely, the 3DS), what makes you think that's how they would activate?

You can perform a regular smash input while in the air, y'know? Tap a direction and the attack button together? Some people never use the C-Stick.
 

Wise Multishine

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Um, given that the game is being built for a platform WITHOUT the C-Stick (namely, the 3DS), what makes you think that's how they would activate?

You can perform a regular smash input while in the air, y'know? Tap a direction and the attack button together? Some people never use the C-Stick.
I know that, but that's one of the reasons the 3ds falters, gameplay wise.

My point is, if you have to do directional inputs in the air for your attacks, it messes with your air game. If you try to do an aerial down smash or a Dair with the control stick, more often than not, you're going to fast fall to the ground. With the C stick, that doesn't happen.
 
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Phaazoid

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I don't think Robin has aerial smash attacks

I think Robin has multiple moves for each aerial, which can be used depending on whether you input a smash or not

that being said, this is still a new thing, which means aerial smash attacks in other newcomers are not farfetched

however I don't think Ridley would have aerial smashes idk I just personally don't like that idea
 

Skyblade12

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I know that, but that's one of the reasons the 3ds falters, gameplay wise.

My point is, if you have to do directional inputs in the air for your attacks, it messes with your air game. If you try to do an aerial down smash or a Dair with the control stick, more often than not, you're going to fast fall to the ground. With the C stick, that doesn't happen.
Okaaaay...

Why does that make the C-Stick "unviable"?
 

SonicLink125

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Things that support a playable Ridley in the next smash:
1. Ridley is at least one of the 5 most requested character.
2. Sakurai explicitly decomfirmed every characters that was at least a bit requested a few time after showing them.
3. Sakurai said multiple times that size doesn't matters in smash.
4. Sakurai doesn't like false hype
5. High requested characters (Little Mac, Megaman) made it as playable.
6. If you can find a good moveset to someone like Wii fit trainer, you can find one for Ridley.
7. Ridley is the most revelant character of the metroid series that has no confirmed role.
8. The shadow analysis (which seems pretty accurate in my opinion) show that the Ridley that we had seen was at a playable size.

Things that support a non-playable Ridley in the next Smash:
1. Sakurai could thinks that a boss Ridley is worth a so long tease.
2. A lot of people doesn't want a playable Ridley.
3. The shadow analysis could be wrong.

What do you thinks of this guys?
Don't know if this was already talked about before, but I was watching Little Mac's trailer reveal and I found an interesting tibit in the video. When Little Mac is revealed, who is the first character that appears next to him? Samus. And what does she do? She measures his size comparing to her. Now, why of all people, was Samus chosen for that moment? Enforcing the whole "size doesn't matter" debate, perhaps? They could have done it with other characters, but with just Samus? Coincidence? That should make you think. Thoughts?
 

Cutie Gwen

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Don't know if this was already talked about before, but I was watching Little Mac's trailer reveal and I found an interesting tibit in the video. When Little Mac is revealed, who is the first character that appears next to him? Samus. And what does she do? She measures his size comparing to her. Now, why of all people, was Samus chosen for that moment? Enforcing the whole "size doesn't matter" debate, perhaps? They could have done it with other characters, but with just Samus? Coincidence? That should make you think. Thoughts?
That's a reference to something similair they did in brawl's dev time.
 

lilt

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You do realize that we're currently more than 61 THOUSAND posts into this thread, right? I think you meant 2000 pages.
That is, exactly, what I meant. I need to sleep. :i6rkW:
Ridley will be revealed before this thread hits the page number 2000,
I bet. Yes, I know about the thread growing pages like rabbits breeding.
 
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Bananija

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Yeah... I could think of a number of different reasons but I will only talk about a few but I don't want to be here all day so here it goes, it's just not many people are going to like them.

Why did they not show Ridley during the direct during the boss discussion? First of all, it could be very possible that Sakurai and his team wanted to show off the boss concept but for whatever reason decided not that they didn't want to actually show the bosses entirely so they went with Ridley which would be the easiest to recognize without showing him directly. Second it's possible it was mere dramatics and nothing else, the scene is an obvious play on the horrible monsters in the shadow display by tailing the other character, I admit the execution isn't particular great do to the upbeat nature of the direct but there you go. Another possibility is technical reasons and not for the 'isn't finished' reason you were talking about before. It could be very possible there were other kinds of issues with the Pyrosphere stage or even Ridley himself as it is something that happens because weird things do happen in programming a lot of the time, sometimes things that can happen last minute in a new implementation or alternative build. That doesn't make the team incompetent, it's just one of the more frustrating aspects of program development of any kind.

As far as since then, since Sakurai has mentioned almost nothing about the bosses outside of the Yellow Devil and the Emperor, Sakurai is simply not talking about them for whatever reason, prehaps he simply doesn't want to reveal them before the game is released. Same thing happened in Brawl if I recall right, Ridley's bosses appearance weren't known till after Brawls release. There is one other possibility I can think of but it's the possibility that no one here is going to like. It may just simply be that Sakurai and his team simply don't consider Ridley important enough to spent a time and detail to talk about in general, that they may simply not care enough to bother. For all of our luster and devotion for the character may mean jack squat beyond the role they chose for him to those actually making the game.

I don't want you to misunderstand, I do want Ridley in the game, but it's very hard for me to accept this notion that based on speculation that Sakurai was either lying or trolling without any actual evidence that he was and until something comes from the development team or Nintendo to suggest otherwise, I can't accept the speculation as some kind of fact or believe he's playable strictly from those notions..
Why would Sakurai and his team not consider the main antagonist of the Metroid serie and one of the most requested character not important enough while they listen to their fanbase and admited that they had visited this site during Brawl development, which means that they probably made another visit during SSB4 one's?
 

•Col•

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Really? I think "these moves" is less ambiguous. If he said "You can even activate this sword in midair", it would be ambiguous. But "these moves" specifically refers to the moves he was talking about, which are smash attacks.
I think it's ambiguous only because, as far as I know, no one went and looked at the original Japanese miiverse post. I feel the 'these attacks can be activated in midair' bit seems like it might be.. not necessarily a mistranslation, but a little vague than what we'd like.

I have my doubts about Robin having aerial smash attacks. If he did, I get the feeling that they would have worded that as 'Robin can even use smash attacks while in midair!', or something along those lines.

It isn't viable because if the C-stick is used to do aerial smash attacks, it can't be used to do regular air attacks. Smash attacks are generally slower and much less viable.
Also, if c-stick was required to do air smash attack, how would you do them on the 3DS version?
 

ddd87

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Don't know if this was already talked about before, but I was watching Little Mac's trailer reveal and I found an interesting tibit in the video. When Little Mac is revealed, who is the first character that appears next to him? Samus. And what does she do? She measures his size comparing to her. Now, why of all people, was Samus chosen for that moment? Enforcing the whole "size doesn't matter" debate, perhaps? They could have done it with other characters, but with just Samus? Coincidence? That should make you think. Thoughts?
Its a joke that started in Brawl when he was revealed as an AT, he was compared to Samus revealing he was quite small. So it was referenced for his reveal in SSB4.
 

DraginHikari

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Why would Sakurai and his team not consider the main antagonist of the Metroid serie and one of the most requested character not important enough while they listen to their fanbase and admited that they had visited this site during Brawl development, which means that they probably made another visit during SSB4 one's?
Being aware of a situation and acting on what you see are two completely different things.
 

Skyblade12

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I think it's ambiguous only because, as far as I know, no one went and looked at the original Japanese miiverse post. I feel the 'these attacks can be activated in midair' bit seems like it might be.. not necessarily a mistranslation, but a little vague than what we'd like.

I have my doubts about Robin having aerial smash attacks. If he did, I get the feeling that they would have worded that as 'Robin can even use smash attacks while in midair!', or something along those lines.


Actually, @ Smash_Handle69 Smash_Handle69 took a look at the Japanese version. The Google Translate came out:

One piece today. Mage manual and Thunder Sword, the lifeblood of Reflet. I can use in Smash input Thunder Sword. Smash aerial input is OK what. And there is a number of uses as the original, it is broken and use too much, it takes a little time to replenish. If there is no Thunder Sword, I will fight with the sword of bronze.
Also, if c-stick was required to do air smash attack, how would you do them on the 3DS version?
He's worried about how the character will be viable on the Wii U if the player can't use C-Sticks for normal aerials.
 
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Mansana

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No, they made them from scratch. We will be getting five completely new characters in Project M.
5 New characters? What do you mean by new? Where did this come from?

Edit:
Dang. I asked @ChronoBound a serious question and he has not answered. This is pretty serious in regards to what Project M is doing. I find it impossible for PM to input new characters without having something to work off of such as Mewtwo and Roy from Melee. Adding new characters that are already appearing in the new sequel could lead to legal trouble since it will lead to some sale decline of the new game. Nintendo will have none of that. If PM does plan on releasing new characters like you have stated they better be smart on their approach. For not clarifying, I am pretty salty.
 
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Smash_Handle69

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Actually, @ Smash_Handle69 Smash_Handle69 took a look at the Japanese version. The Google Translate came out:

One piece today. Mage manual and Thunder Sword, the lifeblood of Reflet. I can use in Smash input Thunder Sword. Smash aerial input is OK what. And there is a number of uses as the original, it is broken and use too much, it takes a little time to replenish. If there is no Thunder Sword, I will fight with the sword of bronze.

He's worried about how the character will be viable on the Wii U if the player can't use C-Sticks for normal aerials.
And the "Smash" part is completely unambiguous in the Japanese version. The romanji form of the post reads:
Kyō no ichi-mai. Sandāsōdo to madō-sho wa, rufure no seimei-sen. Sandāsōdo wa sumasshu nyūryoku de tsukaemasu. Nanto kūchū sumasshu nyūryoku mo OK. So****e gensaku no yō ni shiyō kaisū ga ari, tsukai sugiru to koware, sai hojū ni shōshō no jikan o yōshimasu. Sandāsōdo ga nai toki wa, seidōnoken de tatakaimasu.
The two sentences "Sandāsōdo wa sumasshu nyūryoku de tsukaemasu. Nanto kūchū sumasshu nyūryoku mo OK." Google translate to "I can use in Smash input Thunder Sword. Smash aerial input is OK what." The "smasshu" portions directly translate to "smash" in english, because they are loan words from english. Therefore, we can say with near certainty that the Japanese post does say that Robin can use Aerial Smashes.

EDIT: Lol, the romanji "So****e" had to be censored because it contained the word "s***".

Also, with regard to the Japanese version of the shadow tease, I can't really get the audio portion of it, only the text portion. Does anyone know how to speak Japanese on this thread?
 
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Bananija

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Being aware of a situation and acting on what you see are two completely different things.
They already put highly requested characters like Megaman, Little Mac and Palutena.
Why not Zoidberg Ridley? After all, fans wanted him since a long time ago and they are smart people.
 
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Skyblade12

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They already put highly requested characters like Megaman, Little Mac and Palutena.
Why not Zoidberg Ridley? After all, fans wanted him since a long time ago.
In a Galaxy Far, Far Away...


Sorry, couldn't resist.

Gah, these days are going so slowly. Can't you just release a demo on E-Shop, Nintendo?
 

Nietona

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So....in the event that Ridley isn't playable, you want Sakurai replaced, but not because Ridley isn't playable?

Kind of a poor attempt at trying to mask what you really want to say.
Trying to mask what? What is it that I'm "really trying to say"? I believe it was simple enough to tell what I was implying. "What I'm really trying to say" is that any developer that "can't make something work" because it's "too big" like that isn't a director worth their salt. Do they do a good job of other characters? Yes. Does that mean I would pass up on the opportunity to instead have a director that could do what Sakurai has done and more, potentially even one with a more open mind? No. Ridley isn't the entire game to me, but I'll be damned if I wouldn't question Sakurai if Sakurai thought he was too big for him and his dev team to get in.
 

Smash_Handle69

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Here's the written text at the bottom of the screen for the Japanese version of Ridley's shadow tease:
他にもボスキャラ牙系の仕掛けが登場
Translated with Google Translate, it reads:
Gimmick boss character Fang system also appeared in other
If anyone can help out with translating the Japanese shadow tease, that'd be great. If you can help translate any of the other versions of the shadow tease that are in different languages, that'd be helpful too. We need as much info on this space dragon as possible.
 
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Wise Multishine

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Also, if c-stick was required to do air smash attack, how would you do them on the 3DS version?
I'm obviously not referring to the 3DS version.

The C stick is never required. My point is, if the C-stick is used for aerial smashes rather than regular aerials, it won't be viable.

On the 3ds version. You'd have to activate them the same way you activate them on the ground.

It doesn't, because C-Stick isn't really needed to play Smash Bros.
Yes it does falter in that sense. Of course it's not needed, :GCY: and :GCX:aren't needed either. My point is, it WILL be less viable.
 
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Arcanir

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Here's the written text at the bottom of the screen for the Japanese version of Ridley's shadow tease:


Translated with Google Translate, it reads:


If anyone can help out with translating the Japanese shadow tease, that'd be great. If you can help translate any of the other versions of the shadow tease that are in different languages, that'd be helpful too. We need as much info on this space dragon as possible.
IIRC, it's basically "Other Boss Gimmicks will also appear" or something along those lines.
 

AbioFlesh

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Here's the written text at the bottom of the screen for the Japanese version of Ridley's shadow tease:


Translated with Google Translate, it reads:


If anyone can help out with translating the Japanese shadow tease, that'd be great. If you can help translate any of the other versions of the shadow tease that are in different languages, that'd be helpful too. We need as much info on this space dragon as possible.

It's basically what it means in the English translation.


Spanish: "Bosses also appear in other scenarios, not just this one."
 
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hotcrumpets

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not even that... no, that is what the NEXT entry in smash bros. would be for... why add any new characters in the current game, thus limiting the choices for the NEXT game, if there is one?

damn it, people...

arguing with DLC lovers is like arguing with detractors.

i need some aspirin.

i might leave this forum until the 20th... save myself some frustration.
Waiting a year for a character from a popular, recent game> waiting 6-8 years, when said characters popularity has probably died off. There is more than enough characters for the next smash bros.
 

Smash_Handle69

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IIRC, it's basically "Other Boss Gimmicks will also appear" or something along those lines.
It's basically what it means in the English translation.
I figured as such.

Does anyone know what Sakurai is saying in Japanese, though? It's probably nothing, but it might hold some info.

EDIT: It looks like I mis-transcribed the written text, and it had one unnecessary character. The actual text reads:
他にもボスキャラ系の仕掛けが登場
Translated:
Gimmick boss character system also appeared in other.
 
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Wise Multishine

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Maybe it seems that way because you're so used to c-sticking.
I started using the C stick for aerials fairly recently, it's more viable in every way possible. You can play however you want. Either way, if Aerial Smash attacks are activated using the C-stick, characters that don't have them will have an advantage. That's the point I'm trying to make here.
 

The Pizza Guy

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I started using the C stick for aerials fairly recently, it's more viable in every way possible. You can play however you want. Either way, if Aerial Smash attacks are activated using the C-stick, characters that don't have them will have an advantage. That's the point I'm trying to make here.
Makes sense, but Robin will make up for it by having more aerial options.
 

•Col•

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I'm obviously not referring to the 3DS version. The C stick is never required. My point is, if the C-stick is used for aerial smashes rather than regular aerials, it won't be viable.

On the 3ds version. You'd have to activate them the same way you activate them on the ground.
I meant that the c-stick can't be required to use aerial smash, since there isn't a cstick for the 3DS version. That was my point. It wouldn't be viable.
 

Smash_Handle69

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From what I can infer, the verbal portion of the Japanese shadow tease pretty much says the same thing as the English version. Looks like there's no new info there at all.

Are there any other pics of the day that you guys want a Japanese version translated from? I can do a decent job at that, at least.

I started using the C stick for aerials fairly recently, it's more viable in every way possible. You can play however you want. Either way, if Aerial Smash attacks are activated using the C-stick, characters that don't have them will have an advantage. That's the point I'm trying to make here.
Hey, what if they just give you the ability to change your control scheme, like they did in Brawl? Wouldn't that solve this issue? Like, completely?
 
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D

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Trying to mask what? What is it that I'm "really trying to say"? I believe it was simple enough to tell what I was implying. "What I'm really trying to say" is that any developer that "can't make something work" because it's "too big" like that isn't a director worth their salt. Do they do a good job of other characters? Yes. Does that mean I would pass up on the opportunity to instead have a director that could do what Sakurai has done and more, potentially even one with a more open mind? No. Ridley isn't the entire game to me, but I'll be damned if I wouldn't question Sakurai if Sakurai thought he was too big for him and his dev team to get in.
In other words, yes, you would want him replaced because of not including Ridley.
Don't try to mask it under statements like "and not because Ridley didn't get in"; it's not convincing in the slightest.
 

Wise Multishine

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Hey, what if they just give you the ability to change your control scheme, like they did in Brawl? Wouldn't that solve this issue? Like, completely?
Yes, indeed. I mentioned that on an earlier post. Hopefully they give you the option of using (or not using) the C stick for aerial smashes in the controller menu.
 
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Smash_Handle69

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Yes. I mentioned that on an earlier post. "Hopefully they give you the option of using (or not using) the C stick for aerial smashes in the controller menu."
Okay, yeah. I didn't read any of those posts, lol. I was too busy focusing on the translations.
 
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Bedoop

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5 New characters? What do you mean by new? Where did this come from?

Edit:
Dang. I asked @ChronoBound a serious question and he has not answered. This is pretty serious in regards to what Project M is doing. I find it impossible for PM to input new characters without having something to work off of such as Mewtwo and Roy from Melee. Adding new characters that are already appearing in the new sequel could lead to legal trouble since it will lead to some sale decline of the new game. Nintendo will have none of that. If PM does plan on releasing new characters like you have stated they better be smart on their approach. For not clarifying, I am pretty salty.
Wait, Five?
...:144:....:145:....:146:...
But there's only :younglinkmelee: and :pichumelee: left for Melee, :mewtwomelee: and :roymelee: are already in and :drmario: is an Alt. Costume.
So if both :younglinkmelee: AND :pichumelee: join as seperate Characters, there's still one more Character left. :mewtwomelee::roymelee::pichumelee::younglinkmelee::drmario: - :drmario: (Alt. Costume, not new character) = 4/5.
I think we may have a dilema on our hands.
 

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So I finally started Other M. Got to the point where the killer starts killing off the crew, and I beat the giant fork lift.

It's a decent game so far, but it... it doesn't feel very Metroid. It feels like they tried to cross the Prime series with Fusion or something and it came out alright but a lot of it didn't translate well. Some of the controls are awkward, and having to not move to be in first person is dumb in theory and practice. I don't know how that got past the drawing board.

The extensive cut scenes started out alright. I liked the exposition, the Metroid universe always felt a little sparse. But... they just drone on. However, they are giving Ridley some needed spotlight, so I won't complain.

I've gotten through little birdie and onto mysterious creature. Can't wait for the full on fight which I'm sure comes later.

Over all enjoying the game, but not loving it like I loved the prime series. I really miss scanning everything. And seeing Samus run everywhere feels weird, but the walk scenes are even worse...
 

Con0rrrr

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He just needs to be confirmed so I can stop wasting my life arguing with uneducated morons on the internet.

I'm not even 100% on his inclusion, I just know that people are stubborn morons.

World needs less stubborn morons.
 
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