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The Reason Why Sheik's Absence in Twilight Princess Means NOTHING

Brasil

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 12, 2007
Messages
45
Anything that describes events, real or fictional, is a narrative.

Whether they have little substance or not does not change this fact.

It describes events, albeit, with no depth or character development, but still, that's a narrative.

Again, narrative is just detailing of events, real or fictional.

What events? The chosen character fights the master hand, that's an event, it's presentation is a narrative or part of a narrative.

The lack of plot complications and other similar devices add to the narrative, but they are not required for one to exist.

Again, you are confusing a GOOD NARRATIVE with a NARRATIVE.

Again, confusing good narrative with narrative. There is a detailing of events, obviously with very little background information, but that means it's a bad narrative, not that it's inconsistent.

Again, you are being far too strict in your definition of narrative.

It establishes it's narrative through cutscenes and battles, and in part of establishing it's narrative it explained why the external narratives bear no relevance.
Where in Smash Bros have we ever seen the “narrative” “detail” events? The Master Hand fight? You’re stretching here. Nothing in Smash Bros “detailed” the Master Hand fight in any context. The selected character fighting the Master Hand was blank and vague and existed only for a final boss, nothing more. Those book-end cut-scenes did not detail anything in the game beyond giving you fun and flashy introduction and transitions. They did not start a narrative. There was no narrative.

Lack of substance doesn't prove inconsistency, inconsistency only exists when there is a direct contradiction, and consistency exists where there is nothing.
No, when you have nothing, you do not even have consistency, because even consistency is something. And explain, in detail, with examples, how there’s consistency with the non-existent internal narrative of Smash Bros, especially after you had already established how ignoring external narratives somehow bypasses a very important middle step and establishes internal consistency. Do explain it, please. In detail. Point by point. Each little internal construction by each little internal construction. Since you know it so well, it will be easy for you.

You seem to be redefining narrative to have some basis in quality...
Because a narrative actually says something. A cut-scene that just drops a random character on a sandy beach is a transition from Point A to Point B. That cut-scene is simply conveying the information that this is the next place you’re fighting. That is not a narrative, no matter how you want to dumb down the word.

You seem to be missing the point...

Internal inconsistency is based on CONTRADICTIONS. LACK THEREOF means that something is internally consistent.
No, I think I’m getting it quite well, actually. You’re avoiding an invitation to engage in a perfectly reasonable debate over inconsistency versus consistency, again clinging to this notion where the topic is automatically internally consistent, when in fact, if you were a true philosopher or at the very least, a true student of philosophy, you would know that nothing at the beginning of a discussion is ever certain, and that it’s illogical for you to claim Brawl is internally consistent, especially when the discussion is looking to arrive at one conclusion: consistency or inconsistency. Brawl is not inherently consistent, my friend. And so far, whenever pressed—not even pressed, just requested, you fall back on the same thing you’ve been saying the entire time, which is still just as empty and meaningless now as it was four pages ago because you refuse to go into any kind of revelatory details beyond “It’s based on CONTRADICTIONS.” What do you have against engaging in some good ole-fashioned brain-picking?

You seem dead-set on defining everything based on quality, but seem unwilling to grant any of the accepted attributes that define when something has quality. And then you've defined quality as "not fanfiction" since being fanfiction is the only criteria you've given for being bad.

What is wrong with this picture? How the hell do you analyze works? Do you toss them into little bins saying, "fan-fiction" and "not-fanfiction" and then cart off all of the former to be used in schools with the latter being sent to the dumpster.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think there's something more to literary analysis.
How the hell do I analyze works? I’ll make it easy for you: Anyone who doesn’t use their own creations and just shoves completely unrelated, copyright-protected characters into a story are hacks who do not deserve any respect until they learn something. I know that’s mean. I’m sure it makes me look like a bad guy. But it’s still the truth. And you’re right. There is more to literary analysis. But fan-fiction is not literature. And yes, that makes me sound like a lit-snob of the worst degree. But it’s still the truth. And any lit teacher/student worth anything will kill the urge to be sympathetic and tell you how it really is. Cause they’re not doing you any favors otherwise.

The fact that they were from ocarina of time doesn't make them externally consistent.

Would Link suddenly turning into Ganondorf be consistent with the source material, I mean, they're both from Ocarina of Time, right?

Sure, they're the same person (Link and Young Link), but that doesn't mean that you can keep something that's age specific as an eternal feature of the character? Do you still play with teething rings? No, I don't think so.

So those items were age specific, by allowing both to use one, they violated OoT's consistency.
I’m just going to write this off as a complete joke that doesn’t even get a chuckle.

It's inconsistent with the CHARACTER, not the item, the character.
Yeah, but it’s consistent with the template GAME.

*Possible Spoilers*

It's not incorrect attribution, unless you decided to skip dragging that gigantic bomb to the Temple you would've come across the silver arrows in A Link to the Past, they simply didn't debute there, and I never pretended they did, i simply mentioned that they were in Link to the Past.

*end possible spoilers*
Then say they’re from the Legend of Zelda on NES. Don’t say “No, same as pulling the Silver arrows from a Link to the Past isn't inconsistent.”

As for ad hominem... learn some basic rhetoric, Ad Hominem fallacies are distractions committed by one of the parties in the debate in order to win by making something irrelevant seem relevant. If you think that randomly throwing irrelevant topics out as if they had some meaning to the question at hand, then I guess there's not much of a point of discussing things with you.

And as I've noticed, you do LOVE your distractions.
Funny, because I had used the term correctly. And yes, I do love my distractions. But I throw a curveball in to keep myself amused before anything. Plus, given your record here, throwing around Straw Man Fallacy (which we both know was bull when you tossed it in my direction), you’ve been mis-using a few ideas, and so it was perfectly reasonable to expect your dickishness.

As for the silver hours [arrows?], how does that change things, we have already established that one attribute, the overall look of the character, was OoT, thus whatever the source material they should be harmonized in the interests of asthetics.
Then stop going on about them.

Genre classifications do not make something internally inconsistent.

The game does not establish as it's rules that it's following all the traditions of fighting games. In fact, from the very beginning smash was never a traditional fighting game.

Internal inconsistency is conflicts with it's own rules, not the rest of the games in it's category.
Smash’s character selection is traditional fighting game to the core. Always has been from the very beginning. It’s breaking its own rules now.

By lacking contradictions, it's that simple.

Anything that has no contradictions is consistent with it.
Examples, please.

In other words, not a fanfiction of that work or anything else which directly utilizes the source material. It wasn't lousy, it was intended so it could refer to a wide variety of different things.
Smash Bros is a bit more related than “not a fanfiction of that work or anything else which directly utilizes the source material.” Also, I don’t care if you left it intentionally vague to cover your ***. That doesn’t change the fact it was lousy.

"suspending" means to stop temporarily, inattention can cause one to stop doing something just as easily as an active effort. If one suspends pulling on a rope because they saw something shiny and wanted to pick it up, they did not intend to stop pulling on the rope, they intended to do something else, hence a suspension not directly willed. It still has an agent, but that doesn't mean it must be willing.
A kid with ADD being distracted by something shiny is nothing more than a kid with ADD who shouldn’t be allowed to work backstage. The “suspension” you describe was involuntary stupidity and general malaise when it comes to environmental awareness rather than the active decision-making process of “willing suspension of disbelief.”

Ah yes, so who decided this, because I know a fair number of academics who love the term.

You may have decided that the term means nothing, but to academia it means something, so, how about not?
Oh, “willing suspension of disbelief” means something. “Suspension of disbelief” is a joke.

When the observer reads a story that is very well-written and doesn't have to do it actively, it is still suspension of disbelief. That same person is still suspending disbelief, actions made through inattention (or in this case, a lack of an action) are still actions.
No. If the work is that good, then belief and disbelief never even were a factor, because that individual never had to evaluate what he or she was reading, and therefore never had to make that decision. Lack of action is not an action, by the way.

I'll bet you there are all of 26 people who believe the premise of Harry Potter, yet when reading the book, they do not question, they suspend their disbelief by inattention to the fact that this cannot happen in the real world.
No, they enjoy Harry Potter because they’ve all had lobotomies. Rowling is a terrible writer with a lousy ear for dialogue and an even worse feel for half-decent action.

That said, I will provide a source for my definition: http://www.mediacollege.com/glossary/s/suspension-of-disbelief.html
That site is a joke. Show me where you actually get your definitions.

Like with the Silver arrows you assumed that I didn't know something because I chose to present only the relevant information, instead of providing an examination of the entire thing.

It's called jumping to conclusions, and that seems to be an exercise in this.
You didn’t present relevant information. If you really wanted to drive the Silver Arrows point home, you should have gone back to the NES. If you say anything about the plot of Slaughterhouse Five but leave out the big tidbit of the novel…in a discussion about literary analysis/theory…you’re utterly leaving out relevant information. PM me with what’s really going on in Slaughterhouse Five.

Again, not the point... You are continuing to confuse the quality of the work with it's existence.
Fan-fiction doesn’t exist. It’s a subculture of the socially inept who don’t know a god**** thing about writing.

Except I never said that fanfiction was no different from any other work of the medium, I said that it is poorer in quality in general, and pretty much stated that you pointed out why this is true.
“I'm sorry, but fan-fiction is no different from any other work of the medium with the exception that it's generally much poorer in quality and the person did not create the original work.” So do you just throw out these “I never said that” bits for fun or what?

Simply put, THERE IS A REASON WHY FANFICTION IS BAD.
Yeah, there is. The writers are ****ing hacks who never learned because nobody slapped them upside the head and told them to shape the hell up and stop writing that trash. Things aren’t getting better because nobody knows what good writing is anymore, and garbage like Harry Potter doesn’t help things, either, because it reads like a third-grader’s short story.

Translation: fan-fiction is bad because it’s fan-fiction.

As a final thought: As far as literary analysis goes, I don't think we disagree conceptually, as far as I can tell, this is an issue of defining terms, we're used to using different terms or applying more open or limited definitions to terms, as such, if we can agree on terms, I think the only substance of our disagreement will be the Sheik argument.
I don’t care all that much. My goal is to exploit the weak and dying. And if a few morons happen to get bumped off along the way, so be it.
 

EPX2

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 30, 2007
Messages
557
Of course it hurts her chances, Sakurai is never keen on hiding veteran characters, notice how he, himself leaked DK and Peach before they were even updated on the Dojo it would make sense for him to hide Samus's transformation cause it's something new but to hide a veteran like Sheik is absolutely pointless,
Even though you're banned...

Captain Falcon.
 

Stryks

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 8, 2006
Messages
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Location
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Oh ok, so im guessing The link in brawl at any given time can grab the four swords and WHAM we got four swords TP link? and WW link will transform into a wolf, and TP will have the ocarina of time... rite...

Its obvious that brawl aint a canon, but they have to stay true to the character, giving this zelda, who has her TP form transform into a character her ancestors transform to is NOT being true to the character, its like making sonic slow, its not being true to the character, and if shiek does return, for whatever reason, we might as well kill all logic and make pikachu de-evolve into pichu, JUST so shiek can return...
 

Brav3r

Smash Journeyman
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Messages
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Even though you're banned...

Captain Falcon.
Hit a man while he's down lol, oh well don't know much about him.

anyways, you can't forget about Luigi eighther he's a shoe -in.

Theres thin line between how off you can go with a character for Brawl and i think sheik stands midway to it. But Sheik is most likely in, it doesn't matter how much you sheik haters and others who beleive she shouldn't be in. besides you can't prove Zelda never could do if she wanted to they probably saw no cuase for a tranformation in story although it would have been nice to see sheik return. anyways Sakurai upgraded link oh well, so did every other brawl character get a design upgrade and sheik will too. There is nothing wrong with breaking a few gameplay rules. i mean kirby can suck in de de de and metaknight and sakurai worked with kirby, i know there are a few kirby fans that were hurt by this, so why not spread the suffering.

That four sword idea would work great for the WW link, final smash X4.
 

Clumber

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
40
I'm really tired of the Shiek supporters who all put the people who don't want shiek in under the category of "sheik haters". I can't really speak for anyone else, but I liked Shiek in Melee and played as him/her almost as much as I did Zelda, but I reall want Zelda to become her own character so that Zelda fans don't have to play as Shiek to have a complete character.
 

Luthien

Smash Ace
Joined
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Messages
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But Sheik is most likely in, it doesn't matter how much you sheik haters and others who beleive she shouldn't be in.
Of course she's in no matter how much we believe Sheik shouldn't be in. But that doesn't change the fact that Sheik shouldn't be in. Key word: Should. What did you mean by that: "can't" or "shouldn't"? If it's the first, I can understand you're logic. Anyone saying Sheik "can't" be in is an idiot and in denial. If you meant the latter, YOU are the idiot.

besides you can't prove Zelda never could do if she wanted to they probably saw no cuase for a tranformation in story although it would have been nice to see sheik return.
A stupid argument. PM me and I'll tell you why; I'm not filling yet ANOTHER thread with an argument that's already happened countless times. Nothing you have just said has not been said before.

anyways Sakurai upgraded link oh well, so did every other brawl character get a design upgrade and sheik will too. There is nothing wrong with breaking a few gameplay rules. i mean kirby can suck in de de de and metaknight and sakurai worked with kirby, i know there are a few kirby fans that were hurt by this, so why not spread the suffering.
Sheik WILL? Wow, you seem confident. State opinion as opinion, please.

Anyway, don't use the term "Sheik haters". Very few (if any) such people exist in this forum, and you're insulting all of the reasonable people who don't want Sheik in while saying that. Frankly, lose your bias. I used to think like you, but it's time for you to grow up and face facts:

By all logic: Sheik SHOULD not be in Brawl. Sheik has no REASON to be in Brawl.

That is not saying that Sheik CANNOT be in Brawl. Sheik probably will be in Brawl, despite the lack of reason for him/her/it/potatoe to be in it. I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times:

"It's not that Sheik has anything going FOR him/her. It's just that Sakurai doesn't have to pay attention to the stuff that's going AGAINST him/her. So, Sheik's absence in Twilight Princess effects why s/he SHOULD be in Brawl, but not why s/he CAN."

If you can't wrap your mind around that, like I said, PM me.
 

Circus

Rhymes with Jerkus
BRoomer
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Messages
5,164
That's about the 10th time Luthien has won this thread. How many times need he do it before the message finally sinks in?
 

Brav3r

Smash Journeyman
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Dec 9, 2007
Messages
453
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Theory Brawl, CA
Idk until sheik is actually decomfiirmed. Beside sheik has only has one noticable reason to why she sould be in brawl and its the reason of melee supporting sheik. But the whole "not all characters returning" is trying to screw that one over.
Oh well, its not like sheik was the only zelda transformation.*remembers tetra*
anyways i say forget TP to brawl consitansty , i want to play sheik. (we need more fighters there are so many swords being suggested)
 

The_Corax_King

Smash Lord
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Messages
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Last time I checked... Sakurai was the one making the game...

Last time I checked... Sakurai was the one who gets to decide who's in and who's out...

When did he ever say that in order to make it in his game, you have to from the most current game from a franchise...?

When did he say, "Brawl Zelda is taken directly from TP and I'm only going to give her attacks that relate to that game"?


Sheik shouldn't be in brawl?? -- you're basing that belief off observations about a game HE created... in the end it's all up to him... NOT YOU...

So stop acting like your beliefs make more sense than sakurai's... the guy from whose game(s) you base this opinion...
 

blueriku

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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Messages
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Riverside, CA
Anyway, don't use the term "Sheik haters". Very few (if any) such people exist in this forum, and you're insulting all of the reasonable people who don't want Sheik in while saying that. Frankly, lose your bias. I used to think like you, but it's time for you to grow up and face facts:

By all logic: Sheik SHOULD not be in Brawl. Sheik has no REASON to be in Brawl.

That is not saying that Sheik CANNOT be in Brawl. Sheik probably will be in Brawl, despite the lack of reason for him/her/it/potatoe to be in it. I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times:

"It's not that Sheik has anything going FOR him/her. It's just that Sakurai doesn't have to pay attention to the stuff that's going AGAINST him/her. So, Sheik's absence in Twilight Princess effects why s/he SHOULD be in Brawl, but not why s/he CAN."

If you can't wrap your mind around that, like I said, PM me.


ok first off i havent really been in the forums for awhile so please elaborate these things for me, first what logic is there for sheik should not to be in brawl? why does sheiks absence in twilight princess matter for sheik to be in brawl? oh and how can you lose your bias? everyones opinions are biased unless u mean to try to be less bias. so ill understand you don't hate sheik but you don't want her in brawl but look can look at an alternative... and before i say this i want to let you know in not aiming this souly on you but every one that has make argument against sheik in sheik forums 1; why must every find every single sheik forum and create and arguement you know there are the zelda forums or are you guys that board. 2; this may come to a shock to you guy but ill let you in on a secret...you dont have to use sheik there its that simple. sheik still has things going for her just because she was not in the latest zelda does not mean that she should not be in brawl that is the most common reason that is supposedly valid to exclude sheik from brawl. however im obviously missing some fact so please elaborate for will you?
 

Brav3r

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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Messages
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well looking at the first and the thread topic sakurai breaks rules to the piont where cetain tidbits of facts and info mean almost nothing. a game that is diverse, balanced and competitive.

Diverse/variety: Olimar(great example), Zelda/Sheik, IC(there starting to be a variety of 2one maybe that need to end) look at the list.

Balanced: this is hard to judge without the full roster,but the game is probably intended to be

competitive: when characters are balanced and there is variety the gameplay start to depend on skill and not wich character is better.

no limited character relationship will stand in Sakurai's way of achieving this.

Maybe SSE makes use of this some but i'm not that in dept today.
Should is nothing compared to what sakurai can do, but he does at least try listen to his fans.
 

Luthien

Smash Ace
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Messages
792
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Victoria, British Columbia
ok first off i havent really been in the forums for awhile so please elaborate these things for me, first what logic is there for sheik should not to be in brawl? why does sheiks absence in twilight princess matter for sheik to be in brawl?
Post 184, I think. That's summarised, though. If you want the full (it's big) answer, PM me.

oh and how can you lose your bias? everyones opinions are biased unless u mean to try to be less bias. so ill understand you don't hate sheik but you don't want her in brawl but look can look at an alternative... and before i say this i want to let you know in not aiming this souly on you but every one that has make argument against sheik in sheik forums
I wasn't reffering to Sheik. I was reffering to his "Sheik hater" comment: not everybody is like that.

1; why must every find every single sheik forum and create and arguement you know there are the zelda forums or are you guys that board.
Did you mean "bored"? No. Believe it or not, I'm a Sheik person. I just happen to agree with the "Sheik haters" (I HATE that label).

2; this may come to a shock to you guy but ill let you in on a secret...you dont have to use sheik there its that simple. sheik still has things going for her just because she was not in the latest zelda does not mean that she should not be in brawl that is the most common reason that is supposedly valid to exclude sheik from brawl. however im obviously missing some fact so please elaborate for will you?
They know they don't have to use Sheik... go to the Zelda boards. The problem is: the two are connected. Not only does Sheik get in Zelda's way, Zelda get's in Sheik's way. The concept of the down-b move was broken. I'll elaborate if you PM me. And, that's not the most common reason Sheik shouldn't be in Brawl. The fact that Sheik wasn't in Twilight Princess isn't the reason. It's the fact Sheik hasn't been in ANY. OTHER. ZELDA. GAME. Not just TP. WW, MM, PH, you name it, Sheik hasn't been in it. Why does this matter? Post 184 (or around there). PM me if you still want some stuff cleared up or want to debate; I'm can be convinced. ;)
 

paralasalud

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 30, 2007
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628
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Lombard, IL
i actually think shiek will be in, after much doubt.
however shiek won't be as good. and most peeps will probably switch to whoever is high tier.
i doubt the game will be completely balanced.

even so, i want to pick up zelda some time.
 

Johnknight1

Upward and Forward, Positive and Persistent
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If Shiek was a seperate character, it could add up in the story. Zelda would need to transform and fight in that form, however. But-that's debateable.

Other then that, good read! :)
 

adumbrodeus

Smash Legend
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Where in Smash Bros have we ever seen the “narrative” “detail” events? The Master Hand fight? You’re stretching here. Nothing in Smash Bros “detailed” the Master Hand fight in any context. The selected character fighting the Master Hand was blank and vague and existed only for a final boss, nothing more. Those book-end cut-scenes did not detail anything in the game beyond giving you fun and flashy introduction and transitions. They did not start a narrative. There was no narrative.



No, when you have nothing, you do not even have consistency, because even consistency is something. And explain, in detail, with examples, how there’s consistency with the non-existent internal narrative of Smash Bros, especially after you had already established how ignoring external narratives somehow bypasses a very important middle step and establishes internal consistency. Do explain it, please. In detail. Point by point. Each little internal construction by each little internal construction. Since you know it so well, it will be easy for you.



Because a narrative actually says something. A cut-scene that just drops a random character on a sandy beach is a transition from Point A to Point B. That cut-scene is simply conveying the information that this is the next place you’re fighting. That is not a narrative, no matter how you want to dumb down the word.



No, I think I’m getting it quite well, actually. You’re avoiding an invitation to engage in a perfectly reasonable debate over inconsistency versus consistency, again clinging to this notion where the topic is automatically internally consistent, when in fact, if you were a true philosopher or at the very least, a true student of philosophy, you would know that nothing at the beginning of a discussion is ever certain, and that it’s illogical for you to claim Brawl is internally consistent, especially when the discussion is looking to arrive at one conclusion: consistency or inconsistency. Brawl is not inherently consistent, my friend. And so far, whenever pressed—not even pressed, just requested, you fall back on the same thing you’ve been saying the entire time, which is still just as empty and meaningless now as it was four pages ago because you refuse to go into any kind of revelatory details beyond “It’s based on CONTRADICTIONS.” What do you have against engaging in some good ole-fashioned brain-picking?



How the hell do I analyze works? I’ll make it easy for you: Anyone who doesn’t use their own creations and just shoves completely unrelated, copyright-protected characters into a story are hacks who do not deserve any respect until they learn something. I know that’s mean. I’m sure it makes me look like a bad guy. But it’s still the truth. And you’re right. There is more to literary analysis. But fan-fiction is not literature. And yes, that makes me sound like a lit-snob of the worst degree. But it’s still the truth. And any lit teacher/student worth anything will kill the urge to be sympathetic and tell you how it really is. Cause they’re not doing you any favors otherwise.



I’m just going to write this off as a complete joke that doesn’t even get a chuckle.



Yeah, but it’s consistent with the template GAME.



Then say they’re from the Legend of Zelda on NES. Don’t say “No, same as pulling the Silver arrows from a Link to the Past isn't inconsistent.”



Funny, because I had used the term correctly. And yes, I do love my distractions. But I throw a curveball in to keep myself amused before anything. Plus, given your record here, throwing around Straw Man Fallacy (which we both know was bull when you tossed it in my direction), you’ve been mis-using a few ideas, and so it was perfectly reasonable to expect your dickishness.



Then stop going on about them.



Smash’s character selection is traditional fighting game to the core. Always has been from the very beginning. It’s breaking its own rules now.



Examples, please.



Smash Bros is a bit more related than “not a fanfiction of that work or anything else which directly utilizes the source material.” Also, I don’t care if you left it intentionally vague to cover your ***. That doesn’t change the fact it was lousy.



A kid with ADD being distracted by something shiny is nothing more than a kid with ADD who shouldn’t be allowed to work backstage. The “suspension” you describe was involuntary stupidity and general malaise when it comes to environmental awareness rather than the active decision-making process of “willing suspension of disbelief.”



Oh, “willing suspension of disbelief” means something. “Suspension of disbelief” is a joke.



No. If the work is that good, then belief and disbelief never even were a factor, because that individual never had to evaluate what he or she was reading, and therefore never had to make that decision. Lack of action is not an action, by the way.



No, they enjoy Harry Potter because they’ve all had lobotomies. Rowling is a terrible writer with a lousy ear for dialogue and an even worse feel for half-decent action.



That site is a joke. Show me where you actually get your definitions.



You didn’t present relevant information. If you really wanted to drive the Silver Arrows point home, you should have gone back to the NES. If you say anything about the plot of Slaughterhouse Five but leave out the big tidbit of the novel…in a discussion about literary analysis/theory…you’re utterly leaving out relevant information. PM me with what’s really going on in Slaughterhouse Five.



Fan-fiction doesn’t exist. It’s a subculture of the socially inept who don’t know a god**** thing about writing.



“I'm sorry, but fan-fiction is no different from any other work of the medium with the exception that it's generally much poorer in quality and the person did not create the original work.” So do you just throw out these “I never said that” bits for fun or what?



Yeah, there is. The writers are ****ing hacks who never learned because nobody slapped them upside the head and told them to shape the hell up and stop writing that trash. Things aren’t getting better because nobody knows what good writing is anymore, and garbage like Harry Potter doesn’t help things, either, because it reads like a third-grader’s short story.

Translation: fan-fiction is bad because it’s fan-fiction.



I don’t care all that much. My goal is to exploit the weak and dying. And if a few morons happen to get bumped off along the way, so be it.
This is sort of irrelevant since Sheik was confirmed.

If you want we can continue this over pm or a different thread if you'd like.

But Sheik's confirmation sort of proves that the rule they're working under "any move from any Zelda or Link but matching the appearance theme in style", which was sort of what we're both getting at I think.
 

PsychoIncarnate

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I told you all...they designed Sheik to be in TP

So technically, TP Zelda had the ability to turn into Sheik...just never did in game...
 

Shuma

Smash Hero
Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
5,407
Glad to say.. told you so, in some thread. Sheik with a Tp appareance, nothing more nothing less.
 

SuperLink9

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Messages
1,513
Location
England
NNID
SuperLink9
Finally people can see that continuity means nothing, of course Zelda could have changed into Tetra, but a TP designed Tetra would have been unrecognisable, plus Tetra couldn't swat a fly to save herself. ;) Not to mention Zelda can't even transform between Zelda and Tetra as freely as Sheik/Zelda can

Also, if TP Link put on the Fierce Deity mask I wouldn't object at all, it's not TP Link, it's just Link.

Either that, or Zelda could transform into Sheik in TP behind the scenes, which we'll never know, but as far as I'm concerned, continuity=/=Smash Bros.

Who knows, their synthetic relationship may have improved in Brawl.
 

0211

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 1, 2007
Messages
78
Sorry, I never meant to come off that way. I appoligize if I've angered anyone else as well.
It's okay.

No matter how offended someone might have gotten by what you said, it can't be as bad as being as horribly and miserably wrong as you were.
 

Pluvius

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 5, 2007
Messages
364
Location
Pennsylvania
Sheik is a cool character, & I like her... Outside of Smash Bros. & the Internet. In Smash Bros., I never really could get used to how she controlled. On the Internet, she spawned this awful group of people who only liked her because she was a ninja. A lot of them didn't know she was a girl, even though it was blatantly obvious. She was overplayed & quickly became cheap, just like Fox in Smash Bros.

I loved Sheik in Ocarina of Time, though, & her Twilight Princess design looks like it could've been really cool, had it fit into the storyline. I'm very disappointed, however, that instead of a good 4th B move, Zelda once again gets an ugly weeaboo tumor.
 

PrettyGoodYear

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 1, 2007
Messages
1,792
Location
Panama, Panama, Central America...
I loved Sheik in OoT too. I always like the "girl dressing as a guy" twist. Mulan is my favorite Disney movie... anyway, what I didn't like was her army of followers on the internet. I hope she's super nerfed so they move on to another character... if she is, I might use her with Zelda.
 

2007

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
752
Location
84604
Sheik confirmed. w00t.
the more characters we get back from Melee, the better.

=2007=
 

The Adder

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 15, 2007
Messages
114
Haha. If you want to see me throwing around my large vocabulary, I totally could. If you want me to really crank out some insanely long dissertation on plot structure, I totally could. In that initial post, I neither was trying to make myself look more intelligent, nor was I throwing around any large vocabulary.

On the contrary, there really were no complex terms used in that post. If you're going to get on my arse for "internal logical consistency," "Quixotic," "farcical," and "literary analysis proper," then you need to take a step back and re-consider what it is you're learning, because those terms sure as hell aren't remotely abstract or complicated. And they most certainly weren't uncalled for in this thread. Know why?

Because I called the thread like it was. Nothing more.
Who uses those terms in the common vernacular? They were highly uncalled for because they were totally uneccissary, I'm specifically referring to "quixotic" and "farcical". Honestly, have you ever walked down a hallway and overheard those words, ever? And why did you feel the need to point out that you're an English major?

As I said, you simply felt the need to point out exactly how smart you are (or at least are able to effectively get away with claiming to be on the internet). You wanted a quick increase in the size of your e-*****.
 

adumbrodeus

Smash Legend
Joined
Aug 21, 2007
Messages
11,321
Location
Tri-state area
I agree, but what about Marth and Roy? I think they added Ike as a combination of them.
Erm....

Marth is the most-appearing Fire Emblem lord and the Icon of the series , he's even the most current owing to his upcoming DS appearance (which was obviously known throughout smash's development). It'd be like leaving out Mario but putting in Luigi.


That and Ike doesn't even play remotely like Marth or Roy according to the E for All reports.
 
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