Data The Complete Samus Combo and String List

[DungeonMaster]

@ Afro Smash Yep, confirmed - it's weird though it's a purely aerial combo, I can't hit the ranges (~ +10 above magic) within any of the grounded starters. Maybe if they get clipped at a weird angle with an up-air but I could manage it first pass attempt.
I repeatedly tried aerial b-air-> rev CS in and around that range and no dice, it's just a very tight string (at my level of execution).

@ Scream if that's true, jab1 -> f-smash, that makes my day. Can you please provide the range of % you were testing at? Kill %s..?!

 

[Afro Smash]

Fair can combo in to Fair for some very early kills off the side

Things to note:
Not exactly sure who this works on but I know it doesn't work on Falcon as he falls too quickly and if you up the percent enough to where he doesnt hes knocked too far away by the first Fair

Range i could find was 30%-45%, could be slightly bigger either way, window is very tight

For higher end of the range you need to make sure you're fairly deep in them when you start the Fair to ensure it combos, regardless its a verrry tight string

 

[Xygonn]

Fair can combo in to Fair for some very early kills off the side

I think I've made this comment before, but "we ness now".

 

[Afro Smash]

Also Fair to Zair is a true combo on Falcon at 60%, for some reason it registers:

D Throw > Fair > Zair 1 as a true combo, but not Zair 1 > Zair 2, so it will have total damage as 18 for a split second then change to 3 when Zair 2 lands. Regardless Im certain it will be inescapable

Oh and too tired to find the range for it, i goin sleep

 

[DungeonMaster]

I keep thinking "we've found them all" but no.... very nice. I'll add these in later tonight. If they tweaked her frame data just a little bit to make these less tight, man, I would not complain...
F-air -> z-air is so obvious I'm not sure why I didn't think of it before...

 

[Scream]

@ Afro Smash Yep, confirmed - it's weird though it's a purely aerial combo, I can't hit the ranges (~ +10 above magic) within any of the grounded starters. Maybe if they get clipped at a weird angle with an up-air but I could manage it first pass attempt.
I repeatedly tried aerial b-air-> rev CS in and around that range and no dice, it's just a very tight string (at my level of execution).

@ Scream if that's true, jab1 -> f-smash, that makes my day. Can you please provide the range of % you were testing at? Kill %s..?!

Done more testing:

I do not know exactly where it starts to be inescapebale for sure since my friend could not come but with ROB i estimate it to be around ~80% and falls off depending on spacing from 120% onwards.

Now on to the Big news: The whole Combo was registered as true by the game at about 100% on ROB!

Details on how to do it:

• You need at least 4 hits from the Up-Air to connect, while the one with the Knockback must never. That is required to put the opponent at the right hight to follow up perfectly. I do like 5 Hits for lower percents and 5 for higher percents
• Jab1 immediately after, best buffered. The Combo should connect if you connect with the close hitbox of the Jab1.
• Crouch cancel the Jab1 as soon as possible. Timing is key here. If you get to higher percents you need to Dash cancel the jab1.
• Fsmash as soon as possible. If the opponent is high enough or very low or has a tiny body you may adjust the angle. If you Dash canceled the Jab1 then you perform a stutter step Fsmash to gain additional distance
  
  

Additional Notes:

• If you land slightly behind the opponent the jab can still hit if you face away from the opponent. From that you should be able to Upsmash after the cancel or similar things. UNTESTED
• One needs at least 4 hits from the upair for it to be consistent, therefore you can not perform this out of SH -> AD ->Upair (Maybe someone finds a way though)
• This has only been tested on ROB and Captain Falcon ( I tested him bacause he is light, so he gets pushed out sooner(BAD), and he is a fastfaller, so he stay less time in the air(BAD). His percents start at ~90% and ends at 110% i think. Here it is always adviseable to get all 5 hits to launch)
• Note on Captain Falcon: As i tested with him i think just UpAir -> Fsmash could popentialy work from 110% onwards. Needs testing

 

[DungeonMaster]

A tipper f-smash kill combo! A holy grail combo! From everyone's favourite and much maligned move, jab. Timing is a bit strict, but I confirm it's very real.
It registers. Die sheik, DIE. I can't let you do that, starfox.
You can't get it out of SH-AD, but you can out of full jump FF AD -> up-air. Timing isn't that bad to set up.

 

[Xygonn]

A tipper f-smash kill combo! A holy grail combo! From everyone's favourite and much maligned move, jab. Timing is a bit strict, but I confirm it's very real.
It registers. Die sheik, DIE. I can't let you do that, starfox.
You can't get it out of SH-AD, but you can out of full jump FF AD -> up-air. Timing isn't that bad to set up.

Almost everything awesome for Samus involves uair.

 

[MegaRiff]

Ok so bear with me here. How do I up-air without getting the kickback hit? Is it just practicing my spacing? Also what do you mean by buffering an attack and crouch canceling a jab? I thought crouch canceling was when you crouch before you get hit, not after you deal a hit. Do you just press down after jabbing and then fsmash? How can you tell if you crouch cancelled successfully?

 

[Xygonn]

Ok so bear with me here. How do I up-air without getting the kickback hit? Is it just practicing my spacing? Also what do you mean by buffering an attack and crouch canceling a jab? I thought crouch canceling was when you crouch before you get hit, not after you deal a hit. Do you just press down after jabbing and then fsmash? How can you tell if you crouch cancelled successfully?

You avoid the knockback hit with timing and spacing, that's right. You do it so when you land it hasn't come out yet.

Because smash people are bad at nomenclature crouch canceling (in smash 4 anyway) is the same as "jab canceling" or a "jab fake" in addition to referring to the reduced knockback from crouching. You simply push down to allow more options out of jab1 than just jab2. Jab1 -> dtilt is automatically going to "crouch cancel". Jab1->ftilt will not, you'll throw out jab2 instead. I don't know how A+B smashes interact with the jab sequence stuff. You can tell you crouch cancelled because you'll start the crouching animation. It ends up just being a timing thing, knowing when you have jab canceled.

Buffering an attack means hitting the button before you can actually take the action. You will do it as soon as you are able to. So if you do uair and buffer a jab (by hitting a) you'll jab when you can. You can buffer moves up to ten frames before they occur. Melee doesn't have this feature so you have to be frame perfect with your timing in that game.

 

[DungeonMaster]

@ MegaRiff Xygonn beat me to it but yes it's all about spacing and timing, and character height for grounded targets. There is a 10 frame buffer in Smash4, that means at 60 FPS 1/6 of a second. Many of the combos will ONLY work if you buffer and know that buffer well. There is a priority to move input with the buffer which is: Special > Shield > Attack > Jump. No mashing! You need to be on point for the aerial combos.

 

[Afro Smash]

That would explain why I'm always doing homing Missiles when I break out of jabs from mashing

 

[Xygonn]

I checked it out A+B smash throws out jab2 if you don't cancel the jab.

 

[ShinkiPrime]

I was experimenting with this combo and you can also do this with a bomb placed behind them.

To test, I used Lucina since she's right in the middle as far as targets go, size-wise.

Full hop, drop bomb behind target. Land in front, jab 1, crouch cancel, bomb hits, fsmash. Registered as a 4-hit combo.

Using bombs to throw off rush-down characters I've gotten a lot of jab 1-bomb-jab2 combos but this opens up some neat possibilities.

 

[DungeonMaster]

Hmm... yeah I had in the thread that bomb combos into any move, but this is a bit different, kind of like the custom megabomb combos where you push them into the bomb and they get pushed back into your attack.
I'll add it in @ S ShinkiPrime so that people are of getting the extra jab damage is possible to link into f-smash. D-tilt, f-tilt and d-smash should all also connect. F-tilt may also be able to start instead of jab and d-smash may even double hit.

 

[KayJay]

Double jump -> drop bomb -> fast fall u-air -> bomb hits -> up B
is one of the most practical bomb set ups (true combos) because of the air movement down b gives to avoid incoming approaches and when your u-air hitbox is ready to hit then that's the time where you move back into your almost detonationg bomb.

 

[Xygonn]

Double jump -> drop bomb -> fast fall u-air -> bomb hits -> up B
is one of the most practical bomb set ups (true combos) because of the air movement down b gives to avoid incoming approaches and when your u-air hitbox is ready to hit then that's the time where you move back into your almost detonationg bomb.

Does it work with utilt?

 

[KayJay]

Does it work with utilt?

It does, but U-tilt won't spike.
With Up B it's a ~15 Hit combo.

 

[ShinkiPrime]

Hmm... yeah I had in the thread that bomb combos into any move, but this is a bit different, kind of like the custom megabomb combos where you push them into the bomb and they get pushed back into your attack.
I'll add it in @ S ShinkiPrime so that people are of getting the extra jab damage is possible to link into f-smash. D-tilt, f-tilt and d-smash should all also connect. F-tilt may also be able to start instead of jab and d-smash may even double hit.

I thought it may be worth mentioning specifically for those of us that pepper in bombs while recovering, or to deter rush ins. I've gotten lots of jab1-bomb 2 hit-jab2 combos on rush happy characters like Little Mac or the spacies so I wanted to see if I could make it something better.

 

[Afro Smash]

Yo @ DungeonMaster do you think you could make your 2nd post here its own thread like 'Master Resource Thread' or 'Knowledge Compendium' as it is now? Not only would it make it easier to access (Your OP is huge and full of info, so scrolling down especially on mobile can take a while) it would also make it easier for newcomers to see because tbh it took me a while to realise it was there as I thought 'knowledge compendium' was linked to the combos

 

[DungeonMaster]

@ Afro Smash Yep agreed, sounds good. Do we want to re-organize into stickies?
I think it would help a lot of the new players with questions.
@ shinhed-echi you are the forum mod - what do you think?

 

[Afro Smash]

Yeah sticky the new thread and this one and unsticky the old Match up thread and both the custom threads, maybe keep the evo one but defo unsticky the other

 

[shinhed-echi]

@ Afro Smash Yep agreed, sounds good. Do we want to re-organize into stickies?
I think it would help a lot of the new players with questions.
@ shinhed-echi you are the forum mod - what do you think?

Roger that, I'll get on it when I get home or tomorrow at most.
I too think a separate thread is required, especially since I'm seeing first hand how long it takes to get to the 2nd post from a mobile device.

 

[DungeonMaster]

Thanks! I have a lot of links to add to the compendium and I finally have time tomorrow.
And some updating of the combos with the recent additions.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Alright, I've unstickied some threads that haven't been updated since 2014.
This thread is now stickied.

But I'm a bit on the fence regarding the Custom Moveset Project thread, because it is informative, and I'm not really too up to date with the general idea of the CMP in the tournament scene. It is a guide to what custom move combinations are allowed/are reccommended, so I'm going to leave it there for a little while longer.
I'm going to do a little digging, and if I find it isn't essential for it to be stickied, I'll unsticky it. But for now, it sounds kind of essential for the tourney scene that allows customs.

edit: Unstickied Custom Moveset Project. Doesn't seem too relevant, and it hasn't been active in like a month and a half.

 

[DungeonMaster]

Thanks @ shinhed-echi ! Do you want me to create a separate thread for the compendium as Afro-Smash suggested? Or do you have the forum modification ability to just extract the 2nd post and make it into a second one? I'll update/post shortly after I hear back.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Thanks @ shinhed-echi ! Do you want me to create a separate thread for the compendium as Afro-Smash suggested?

You're welcome.
You should do it.
I think I can also move the posts relevant here to the new thread as well.

 

[DungeonMaster]

Great, I spent the evening updating the OP, so likely tomorrow for compendium.

Added:
up-air sour jab cancel combos
f-air into f-air/zair aerial combos and ranges
b-air into b-air aerial ranges
up-air into CS and d-air spike aerial ranges
push into bomb combos

Still missing are some of the interactions with f-air into f-air/z-air. Up-tilt can offstage combo into SH f-air -> f-air which at the edge can actually kill very early, kinda cute. Like Xygonn says, "we ness now" except with 35 damage. The grab version (say pivot grab from the edge) is totally realistic to pull off and wrecks little mac something fierce.

 

[DungeonMaster]

Ok, added in all the interactions with f-air -> f-air and f-air -> z-air with all the other combos. F-air -> z-air circa 50+% is actually not that bad actually, if it's iffy that you'll get an up-air->f-air, f-air->z-air it surprises people quite a bit. It's very easy to string but to actually true combo is a bit more tight than it looks. You can test this by try to combo a training mode target over the edge (say, up-tilt -> f-air -> z-air). The computer will jump when it's over the edge and so you'll see if it's a true combo or not (since the combo counter is screwed up with z-air).

In other good news I found some cool kill combos, completely by accident. They are actually old combos, which get promoted to "kill" status because of an interesting interaction.
I was fooling around against some weaker opponents trying to use more d-air instead of f-air and up-air out of my aerial combo chains. This guy recovered directly at the edge with get-up recovery, I up-tilt to try and catch his 1-frame window and I then immediately jump into the d-air and he dies meteored over the edge. At first I just laugh, "what a newb" he DI-ed to his death. But then I watched the replay and it was a straight vertical meteor, no angle, he did nothing.

So here's the deal: when a character is right on the edge and you jump directly into them your character model interacts with them "pushes" them in a light collision, the same way you can push characters when running/walking into them. So even with the pure vertical up-tilt and d-air you can in fact up-tilt -> d-air and d-air -> d-air an opponent to their death because the light model collision pushes them over the edge. It's very easy to see in training mode as well.
I'm wondering if we can get a guaranteed out of shielding a get-up attack (doubtful, perfect shield for sure).

 

[Afro Smash]

We could probably include D-Tilt > Fair and D-Tilt > Up Smash as strings, they are fairly common to get

 

[DungeonMaster]

Agreed, they can be fairly tight as well. I'll include them in a bit.
Who knows, maybe Sakurai will give us a few frames in the future to actually combo off of them (yeah right).

@ shinhed-echi Compendium post sticky?

 

[E.Lopez]

(I took the combo table and made a nice little print out to make it easy to reference while I actually play in training mode!)

I want to see if I understand the way you laid out the OP. The combo table at the top has been verified to work for all characters given their magic number (with the asterik characters being the exception for certain combos due to their short hitstun animations).

Then you proceed to go into great detail by listing all discovered combos given all the combo starters, using ROB for the appropriate percentages.

In short, the table and the detailed list of combos that follows it compliment one another, right?

RAGE is by far the most important factor. Take Samus' % divide by 10 and that is the number you subtract.
Example: Samus at 0% damage Mario at 35%. Mario's magic number is 35. Samus can up-tilt him and launch a CS for a guaranteed hit. Samus at 100% damage Mario at 35%. Samus now needs to short-hop the CS for the guaranteed hit.

Do you mean that is the number you add, not subtract? Mario's magic number is 35, and if Samus is at 100%, you would add 10 which means you move one column to the right in the combo table and use SH-CS instead of CS.

The player does have significant control over stale state of his moves. In this game Samus definitely, definitely, wants to stale Up-Air. U-tilt, D-throw, D-air to a lesser extent as possible.

Should F-tilt also be staled? I asked about this in the other thread.

No Fail Dirty bomb combo prescription: Push character to edge -> Pivot -> down b -> SH FF D-air.

What exactly do you mean by pivot before dropping the bomb? Are you simply saying face away from the opponent when you drop the bomb?

 

[DungeonMaster]

Yep, the table is completely general and the combos listed on rob are guidance which you can infer from the table to try a specific one from the giant list.
Take the middle of the range of one of the many ROB combos and compare to his magic number. So for instance d-throw->dash->FJ->f-air->J->f-air true combos between 24 and 34%. Middle of that range means 29%, R.O.B's magic number is 39 so it's a true combo sweetspot at roughly -10 relative to magic. Kirby is magic number 22. I should be able to land d-throw>dash->FJ->f-air->J->f-air true combo on kirby circa 12%. (I haven't even tested this one much since it's new, tell me if it works).

What it doesn't tell you that trying for say the fancy up-tilt -> up-air -> CS vs. pikachu is difficult, and should only be attempted at the edge of the range of the combo. Likewise doing grab->up-air->up-air->up-B on Zero Suit can be very hard because her bounce and hurtbox doesn't connect well with the up-air hitbox. Both *are* technically possible, but you need to apply the right combos for the right characters and a simple, general table as guidance is better than listing every character specific *best*.

You are exactly right on the math for rage. I will make a video when I get time (maybe in a week or two) showing this visually since it's been a constant source of confusion.
Rage shifts you forward in the table, staleness shifts you backwards. So Mario at 35% with 100% damage on Samus means you have to SH-CS instead of CS.

F-tilt staleness is good, but again, it's a few %. The biggest impact is from what portion of the leg you hit with. I would worry less about staleness of f-tilt and more about spacing the move to get the appropriate hitbox, my opinion.

As for pivot dropping the bomb, some characters, for whatever reason, have a hurtbox at their toe level. So if you just push them and drop the bomb, the bomb may prematurely explode on their toe and you'll miss the d-air. Pivoting ever so slightly away avoids this problem. It's not that many characters (I don't have a list, DK for sure).

 

[Afro Smash]

Jab > Dash Attack is a true combo on ROB from like 160-200 (probably more), can be used as a last resort kill option if you're struggling

 

[DungeonMaster]

Nice, adding it in. We all struggle at some point or another....

 

[RoachCake]

SH AC D-air > U-tilt true combos on Rob 32-89%
Need to activate D-air at a bit of an awkward time. Pretty much right before you hit the peak of your SH, then land without fast falling or anything to get the auto-cancel, and then immediately do an U-tilt.

At about 32-38% it's a bit hard to land since you have to be close to frame perfect it feels like. Had to try a bunch of times to see the lowest % you could get the combo.
40-80% is the easiest window to land it at, and after that it's a bit weird to land. You've got 2 ways to land it, either delay when you use U-tilt after the AC D-air, or fastfall your D-air to get the landing lag and use U-tilt right after that.

I'd say put it down as 40-80% so you don't need to worry about the other percent ranges stupidness.

 

[DungeonMaster]

I have no idea why that's not in the list, it's in the tree, but must have gotten erased from the list in an eroneous edit. Thanks for pointing that out and giving me the range!
Yeah actually, I'm finding despite what we discussed in the frame data thread that going very low for the fast fall d-air and just suffering the full landing lag is actually just better. You don't need to adapt the muscle memory for target height so the combos flow better.

 

[DungeonMaster]

Added in:
jab -> dash
d-air -> up-tilt
up-tilt -> dash-attack (much better option than f-smash which is in same range, big damage combos resulting from it, much harder to land though)
Magic numbers for Ryu, Roy and Lucas.

Lucas is like Ness, although not identical, his hitstun animation is just a bit more susceptible to combos, you can in fact get an up-tilt -> CS on him (28-29%, not suggested...).
Ryu actually has a deceptively small combo window, and I've been surprised in game a few times. He's not that easy to true-combo. The range on up-tilt -> CS is only 6% wide (30-36%).
Roy is total combo food, he has a bad bounce from d-throw, kinda like zero suit, but his physics is such that it doesn't matter, we can combo him like crazy. (Up-tilt -> CS works from 24 - 44%).

I'm also wanting to add in grab strings. Grab at 16 frames will not true combo out of any of the starters, anything that allows for a d-air or CS is at a % where the opponent is way too high for grab to reach. However in the same range where up-tilt -> dash works up-tilt->grab is a pretty tight string. I also think it's relatively safe at the range of up-tilt against many attempted combo breakers (say mario's n-air). It also may cover teching.

 

[Xygonn]

So I know this game isn't melee, but some folks have been wondering if utilt->dtilt is guarunteed on tech to neutral. I'm gonna use the melee numbers so that is the main caveat. It is possible this isn't quite right.

The frames for melee are invincible for 20 frames, vulnerable for 6. http://smashboards.com/threads/detailed-throws-techs-and-getups-frame-data.206469/

Something that lands between 21 and 26 frames would be guarunteed.

Utilt lands on frames 15 through 18. FAF is 40, and dtilt is 6. That's frame 45 for the dtilt hitbox (40 is frame 1, 45 is frame 6). That gives a minimum of 27 frames (max 30 frames), putting us 1 frame short of guaranteed on tech with the latest utilt hitbox. Jab1 should be guaranteed being between 24 and 27 frames, which is all but the first frame of utilt (unlikely to hit a grounded opponent).

For dair you hit frames 19-21 with a spike and autocancel on frame 34. If you hit the lab and are frame perfect, that puts you at 12 to 14 frames in the air plus 4 landing plus 6 dtilt = 22 to 24. So dtilt is guaranteed on tech of dair (if you are on the right side of your opponent).

 

[DungeonMaster]

I'm actually going to crack out my elgato to check numbers for smash4. I think it's worth it. Maybe this weekend or the next.